Engine Overhaul Price 2025

[toto]

@hammdo did your shop give you a quote for an overhaul versus an IRAN? Curious what the difference was in both time and money. 

[hammdo]

$35k for overhaul engine only not including hoses etc. All my hoses have already been replaced.

Surefly, exhaust, oil cooler, we’re new when I bought the plane.

Mag overhaul, prop gov, prop were IRAN by me a couple of years ago. Alternator was oh’d before I bought it.

-Don

[toto]

2 minutes ago, hammdo said:

$35k for overhaul engine only not including hoses etc. All my hoses have already been replaced.

-Don

Thank you - you probably already mentioned that in the other thread, but I couldn’t find it. 

Honestly it’s hard to see how the word “overhaul” is worth $10k here. Sounds like the right decision to me. 

[hammdo]

6 month lead time to get overhaul…

-Don

[A64Pilot]

9 hours ago, N201MKTurbo said:

Even the term “field overhaul” is kind of suspicious. Does that mean any overhaul not done by the factory? So the best overhaul shops in the country do field overhauls? Or does that mean any overhaul done by a not famous shop? What exactly is a field overhaul? 

To start with most terms we throw around are not recognized terms by the FAA, like field overhaul for example. People mistakenly have the belief that the best is factory, and often they are correct but not necessarily.

Decades ago you could get a properly done field overhaul for much less than a factory one, this is when the factory was running hard to produce new engine for the thousands of new aircraft, but then the new aircraft market fell apart and to keep the doors open and not layoff employees the factories got heavy into overhauls, in order to compete price wise with the field overhauls as they obviously have a much higher overhead they jacked their parts prices up thereby raising the price of a field overhaul so they could be competitive.

This is where the big PMA manufacturers came into their own, the Factories learned there is a limit to how much they could charge for parts because the PMA guys would build possibly better for less.

Sadly what Keeps Lycoming in business is I’m sure overhauls and I bet most new engine sells are for Experimentals.

Having said that the “best” engines are from speciality engine shops, they run smoother, longer and make more power than a brand new factory engine, but of course they aren’t cheap. 

Then even what an overhaul means differs, some overhaul or replace everything, fuel system, alternator, starter, mags, prop, prop governor etc. remove engine mount have it inspected for cracks and some powder coat, most don’t, most do just the “core” engine.

Not too many years ago an aircraft’s value was determined to a great extent by how many hours were on the engine, prop etc. Using say 50K for the engine overhaul an aircraft with a new overhaul was worth 50K more than one at TBO.

The newer theory of hours don’t matter won’t last I don’t think, and those running past TBO will I think be in for a shock when that engine starts making metal, because the cost to Overhaul an engine once it starts making metal is way higher than it is for one that isn’t.

I think what’s driving it is we are flying older and older aircraft, and the cost of overhauls goes up every year, what used to be 10% of the value of an airplane is now 50% or maybe higher, that coupled with we fly less on average than we used to means a couple hundred hours may be years.

But remember the commercial about oil changes I think it was, the “Pay me now or pay me later” one, well I believe that has merit.

But that’s my opinion

[shawnd]

15 hours ago, 201Steve said:

After Jewel f’d up my engine, I asked Zephyr to re-overhaul it, he said “I can do whatever you want but I’d just be taking your money if you ask me to overhaul it again”. So they did an IRAN, basically doing all core engine work without fooling with the accessories again (Jewell sent those items to someone else anyway). To include line boring the case, overhauling the cylinders, new cam, new lifters. What else is there if everything else had been inspected and determined GTG?

Love LJ (John) - absolute straight shooter when it comes to work that needs to be performed. You can trust an IRAN from Zephyr, its thorough. Had mine IRAN'ed as well, and the engine runs strong. 

[A64Pilot]

31 minutes ago, shawnd said:

Love LJ (John) - absolute straight shooter when it comes to work that needs to be performed. You can trust an IRAN from Zephyr, its thorough. Had mine IRAN'ed as well, and the engine runs strong. 

Agreed, 

 But come sell day, do you think your airplane with an engine that’s 500 hours since overhaul will bring more money than one day 500 hours past TBO?

Sure you will save money now by just having one repaired, but it’s not unlikely that one day you will lose more than you saved.

I assume your engine had just been overhauled? If so then it may not have been worth the extra money to reset the clock by just a few hours, but one that’s run out, it most probably is.

[shawnd]

Mine is not near the overhaul timeframe - it's around 1500 hours at this point. My comment was in regards to @201Steve's IRAN from Zephyr after the overhaul.

Regarding prices, it's really dependent on a few factors. Motivated and financially capable buyer who wants to have the overhaul done his own way rather than buying a previously overhauled engine may pay more if the rest of the aircraft is in top shape. I am not sure most folks recover the full cost of an overhaul with a sale unless they optimize the OH costs. Don't have data, also not what I wanted to get into with my comment above 

 

[N201MKTurbo]

It would be good to get one of these shops that does the IRAN to give you a list of what they do for an IRAN and what they do for an overhaul. It would be nice to know what they aren’t doing.

[A64Pilot]

3 hours ago, N201MKTurbo said:

It would be good to get one of these shops that does the IRAN to give you a list of what they do for an IRAN and what they do for an overhaul. It would be nice to know what they aren’t doing.

That’s the key because just going off of what @201Steve stated in his case it’s not much, so using that as an example if the overhaul cost is a few thousand more than the repair and you are even halfway to overhaul your money ahead to pay for the overhaul.

The key is to ask one of the brokers if it’s still like it was a couple of decades ago, that is you take the cost of overhauls of the components, divide that by TBO to get the value of one hour, multiply that by the number of hours left until overhaul and that number is what the airplane is worth more than the identical airplane that’s run out.

If the difference between repair and overhaul is real significant in cost, then almost certainly there is a whole lot left undone and the odds of having an engine that will won’t live long is much higher.

It’s really similar to the difference between a pre-buy and an Annual, an Annual is defined legally as to the min standards where a pre-buy is not. An overhaul has a Manual that every item must be followed.

I don’t understand the insurance theory of the cost, are they saying that they charge higher insurance rates per each overhaul, or are they saying that if you do one then you pay a higher rate, meaning that shop can’t do any overhauls?

Other than the legally required hangar keepers insurance etc. I doubt that any except the very large shops carry insurance for the liability of their work, small shops don’t have the income to pay for such luxuries, and they are pretty much judgement proof anyway as they don’t have large assets.

I’d bet Lunch for example that Mooney doesn’t carry liability insurance, they couldn’t afford it, and if they can’t do you think the small shops could?

Edited 23 hours ago by A64Pilot

[PT20J]

IRAN = Inspect and Repair As Necessary. By definition, you can’t know the cost to repair until you disassemble and inspect. But, it should always be less than a new limit overhaul. Maybe closer to a service limit overhaul.

[N201MKTurbo]

18 minutes ago, PT20J said:

IRAN = Inspect and Repair As Necessary. By definition, you can’t know the cost to repair until you disassemble and inspect. But, it should always be less than a new limit overhaul. Maybe closer to a service limit overhaul.

I have heard that when Lycoming does a factory reman, quite a few parts are returned to service if they are not past service limits.

[PT20J]

13 minutes ago, N201MKTurbo said:

I have heard that when Lycoming does a factory reman, quite a few parts are returned to service if they are not past service limits.

When I took the factory class, Lycoming said the rebuilts are done to new limits and have the same warranty as a new engine. There are a lot of new parts: Cylinders,  pistons, camshaft, lifters, gears. They try to reuse cases, and crankshafts, probably con rods.

[N201MKTurbo]

6 hours ago, PT20J said:

When I took the factory class, Lycoming said the rebuilts are done to new limits and have the same warranty as a new engine. There are a lot of new parts: Cylinders,  pistons, camshaft, lifters, gears. They try to reuse cases, and crankshafts, probably con rods.

When I bought my plane it had a factory reman. When I overhauled it a couple of years ago I took the gears to the local engine shop for NDT and dimensional inspection. They all had electric pen writing on them with the same suffix on them. The guy at the engine shop said that Lycoming writes that on parts that they reuse for a factory reman. 

[A64Pilot]

8 hours ago, PT20J said:

When I took the factory class, Lycoming said the rebuilts are done to new limits and have the same warranty as a new engine. There are a lot of new parts: Cylinders,  pistons, camshaft, lifters, gears. They try to reuse cases, and crankshafts, probably con rods.

They get engines in they disassemble and parts are segregated, Cams, Cranks, Cases etc go into separate piles if you will and are inspected, reworked or whatever is necessary, then engines are built from these, they do not keep the parts together so it’s not arguably the same engine that came in.

But unless things have changed there used to be two different engines you could buy, the ones that met new limits were zero timed with new logbooks etc and many would say as the cases etc are “seasoned” they are in fact superior to a true brand new engine. I’m in that camp.

The other engine you could buy was overhauled to service limits and not zero timed, but in truth for most uses is indistinguishable from a new or zero timed motor.

What can make a field overhaul better is if the overhauler has the knowledge, equipment and skill to basically remove any differences between parts as in make them dimensionally identical, balance within a ridiculously small weight etc and port and polish and CC the heads improving flow and therefore power, perfectly aligning valve guides and honing not reaming to extremely close tolerances, multi angle valve jobs etc.

Of course all this takes much longer and therefore cost more money, but sometimes you get what you pay for.

[PT20J]

From Lycoming’s website:

Factory New – Everything in the engine or installed on the engine is brand new.  The engine has a zero time since new and zero time since major overhaul.  These engines are identical to what an OEM customer (such as Cessna or Piper) would be installing into their brand new aircraft.  New engines carry a two-year factory warranty up to the hourly overhaul period listed in Service Instruction 1009. This engine choice makes sense for the customer that likes to have the peace of mind of having everything be brand new.

Factory Rebuilt – Every part used in building the engine meets or exceeds new part specifications; or the engine is like new. It has a zero time since new and a zero time since major overhaul. Some parts may be used, but they meet the same specifications as a new part. Like new engines, this engine carries a two-year factory warranty up to the hourly overhaul period listed in Service Instruction 1009. This engine choice is for the customers who are looking to have a return on their investment by adding value to their airframe.

Overhauled – The parts used to build the engine meet or exceed service limits and specifications. The engine carries the previously accrued total time since new, but has zero time since major overhaul.   This engine also carries a one-year factory warranty up to the hourly overhaul period listed in Service Instruction 1009. An overhauled engine is best for the customer who is looking for the most cost-effective option, or for those who accrue hours very quickly and will likely run the engine through the next overhaul cycle. Some parts are no longer available new from the original equipment manufacturers, such as dual magnetos from Bendix/TCM. In these cases, those parts are overhauled by a reputable overhaul facility.

All Lycoming factory new, rebuilt and overhauled engines are built on the same production assembly line. The same skilled workers build all types of engines, new or overhauled, 4-cylinders or 8-cylinders, and naturally aspirated or turbocharged.