Dual E-Mags on FIKI Bravo?

[BrianL29]

I understand you can use dual e-mags with a second power source.  Would the second battery & alternator of a FIKI aircraft fulfill this requirement?

I cant run my engine lean of peak. I currently have 1 surefly.  As I lean past peak  EGT/TIT they begin to drop, but then start to increase again followed by a dramatic power loss.  I believe the increase is caused by loss of combustion on the standard mag.  I recently installed fine wires, but didn't make a difference.  

Savvy told me to perform the in flight mag test.  When I switched to the standard mag, I was certain the engine was quitting and I aborted.  They told me it wouldn't quit and to try again, but I haven't been brave enough.

[irishpilot]

Brian, very few Bravos run LOP due to the intake setup. There are a few who have successfully done so. I am pretty sure you’ll need GAMIs, if you don’t already have so. Also, do you have a good engine display? Not the stock gauges.

When I had my Bravo, I just accepted the fuel flow and flew either 29/2400 or 27/2200 as my standard power settings. You’d have to keep your bird a pretty long time before it paid you back on the $$ you spent on parts.

But, if there’s a will, there’s a way. I’m sure others who run LOP will chime in.


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[Danb]

Brian my Bravo was one that ran ok LOP but I lost considerable true airspeed, on long trips I just dialed it back to say 24/2400 and 15 GPH for good range, my Acclaim is opposite loves LOP. Although the continentals top are suspect. All a trade off. 

[KSMooniac]

ElectroAir has STC approval for two electronic ignitions, but I'm not sure if Surefly does. Part of the EA STC requirement is a backup power source of some flavor, and I'm sure the Bravo dual electric system would satisfy that. I recently installed a dual EA system on my J, and had to add a backup battery for one ignition (per their STC).

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[LANCECASPER]

18 hours ago, BrianL29 said:

I understand you can use dual e-mags with a second power source.  Would the second battery & alternator of a FIKI aircraft fulfill this requirement?

I cant run my engine lean of peak. I currently have 1 surefly.  As I lean past peak  EGT/TIT they begin to drop, but then start to increase again followed by a dramatic power loss.  I believe the increase is caused by loss of combustion on the standard mag.  I recently installed fine wires, but didn't make a difference.  

Savvy told me to perform the in flight mag test.  When I switched to the standard mag, I was certain the engine was quitting and I aborted.  They told me it wouldn't quit and to try again, but I haven't been brave enough.

On that engine the Slick mags are the weak point. Most mags are fine if they are properly inspected every 500 hours. On this engine they may have to be done sooner and I would make sure they are done by someone who really knows them. I also would alternate and stagger them, having say the R mag done and then 250 hours later having the L mag done, so you are still doing each mag every 500 hours or sooner but not having both done at the same time. This would prevent the same person making the same mistake on both mags at the same time. Robert at Aero Accessoires in Van Nuys does man excellent job. 

I don’t have a Bravo anymore, but if I did I might go with one Surefly. Until there’s a lot more time in service I wouldn’t be in a rush to do two Sureflys. Belt and suspenders are a good thing.

[BrianL29]

I purchased my Bravo in June 2023. I had basically no complex time and 30 hours later i made a gear up landing.  The plane was down for a year waiting on shops.  (I spent the downtime getting my multi-rating and getting the training I should have had from the beginning.)

Before the IRAN I remember being able to lean the engine well lean of peak and it ran smooth.  It has GAMI injectors and I've done the GAMI spread test which was fine.  I had a JPI 930 installed and dual GI-275's while it was down.  So I have good data.  Surefly overhauled their mag and Kelly Aero supplied an overhauled Slick/Champion after the prop strike.

I've been cruising at 29/2400 leaned to 1575-1590 TIT and get 19.5 gallons/hr.  I need to experiment with lower RPM settings.

I mostly want to run LOP to keep the engine clean.

Thanks for the advice all!

[Fritz1]

Mags, electroair and surefly all have their kinks, the mags are predictable and reliable when serviced every 500h, good idea not to put all eggs in the same basket, I had the Bravo for 7 years, put about 700h on it, tried the electroair, went back to two mags slick start on the left, fly 100 dF rich of peak, 30"/2300, typically 18.5 gph, about 78% power, engine runs smooth LOP with GAMIs and fine wires, but I only do that for lean tests at 60% power, 78% max power cruise is only possible 100-125 ROP, the fine wires make a huge difference in the Bravo engine, run smoother, lower TIT, the electroair started better than the impulse mag, especially hot, but had other disadvantages, the slick start mag booster has solved all starting problems

[LANCECASPER]

45 minutes ago, BrianL29 said:

I purchased my Bravo in June 2023. I had basically no complex time and 30 hours later i made a gear up landing.  The plane was down for a year waiting on shops.  (I spent the downtime getting my multi-rating and getting the training I should have had from the beginning.)

Before the IRAN I remember being able to lean the engine well lean of peak and it ran smooth.  It has GAMI injectors and I've done the GAMI spread test which was fine.  I had a JPI 930 installed and dual GI-275's while it was down.  So I have good data.  Surefly overhauled their mag and Kelly Aero supplied an overhauled Slick/Champion after the prop strike.

I've been cruising at 29/2400 leaned to 1575-1590 TIT and get 19.5 gallons/hr.  I need to experiment with lower RPM settings.

I mostly want to run LOP to keep the engine clean.

Thanks for the advice all!

I wouldn't trust a Kelly overhauled Slick mag - there are many horror stories of bad mags right out of the box. If your engine is stumbling during the mag check, that's the first place I'd look.

[Will.iam]

9 hours ago, BrianL29 said:

I purchased my Bravo in June 2023. I had basically no complex time and 30 hours later i made a gear up landing.  The plane was down for a year waiting on shops.  (I spent the downtime getting my multi-rating and getting the training I should have had from the beginning.)

Before the IRAN I remember being able to lean the engine well lean of peak and it ran smooth.  It has GAMI injectors and I've done the GAMI spread test which was fine.  I had a JPI 930 installed and dual GI-275's while it was down.  So I have good data.  Surefly overhauled their mag and Kelly Aero supplied an overhauled Slick/Champion after the prop strike.

I've been cruising at 29/2400 leaned to 1575-1590 TIT and get 19.5 gallons/hr.  I need to experiment with lower RPM settings.

I mostly want to run LOP to keep the engine clean.

Thanks for the advice all!

I don’t have a Bravo but if @Fritz1 is running 100df ROP on 30”/2300 and 18.5ff i find it hard to believe you are LOP running only 29”/2400 at 19.5 ff as your setting is more rich than Fritz1 and he is already 100df ROP.  What measurement are you using to determine you are running LOP?

[BrianL29]

9 hours ago, Will.iam said:

I don’t have a Bravo but if @Fritz1 is running 100df ROP on 30”/2300 and 18.5ff i find it hard to believe you are LOP running only 29”/2400 at 19.5 ff as your setting is more rich than Fritz1 and he is already 100df ROP.  What measurement are you using to determine you are running LOP?

I am not lean of peak at 29/2400 19.5 Gallons/hr  I'm about 100-150 ROP.  Thats what I've been using as I cant achieve lean of peak without losing power. 

[BrianL29]

That's interesting on Kelly Aero.  I have another slick sitting on a shelf when I installed the Surefly. Maybe I'll send it to Van Nuys for an overhaul. 

The slick start mag booster is intriguing for a Bravo. I didn't know those existed. Thanks.

And I did install fine wires about 15 hours ago and they didn't change any of my numbers, except for the ones in my bank account.  If anything its a little trickier to hot start.  

[Fritz1]

The real problem with the impulse coupling Slick mag in the Bravo is that the Skytec lightweight starter turns the engine too fast for the impulse coupling to engage when the engine is hot, the Slick mag booster helps, but it is only a partial solution, the real solution is a retard breaker mag which I have sitting on the shelf, but need to rewire the ignition switch, the best mag solution would be to keep the impulse coupling on the left, install retard breaker mag on the right with the Slick mag booster, I still pondering the legality of that, during Covid I had two dud mag overhauls in a row by QAA, never again, use Aircraft Accessories of Oklahoma now, good success with alternators, mags, turbo wastegate, good guys, reliable and responsive, the electroair is a very complicated system, the ignition advance below 24" does not help a turbo aircraft because it hardly ever runs there, no experience with the surefly, rather new system, bottom line: keeping one mag and overhauling it every 500h might be the most reasonable approach right now

[BrianL29]

I think I will overhaul the mag I have on the shelf with Van Nuys or AAO and try replacing the Kelly Aero mag.  

Is this Van Nuys?

http://aeroacc-vny.com/