Electric Kick Scooters

[TGreen]

Any recommendations for a foldable electric kick scooter? Any to avoid?

[TGreen]

I interpreted the silence as a hearty endorsement for my provisional pick, the NIU KQi2 Pro. https://shop.niu.com/products/niu-electric-kick-scooter-kqi2-pro

Will let you know how it turns out. 

[M20F]

I bought two of these in 2019 still going strong.  I notice no longer available on Amazon but brand seems to be ok. 
 
They go really fast.  I got this cool scar at 09J from one!

 

 

[tony]

5 hours ago, TGreen said:

I interpreted the silence as a hearty endorsement for my provisional pick, the NIU KQi2 Pro. https://shop.niu.com/products/niu-electric-kick-scooter-kqi2-pro

Will let you know how it turns out. 

would love to hear your pirep.

[MikeOH]

3 hours ago, M20F said:

I bought two of these in 2019 still going strong.  I notice no longer available on Amazon but brand seems to be ok. 
 
They go really fast.  I got this cool scar at 09J from one!

 

 

Ah, you need a Onewheel...I'll bet the scars will be WAY more impressive

[Pinecone]

21 hours ago, TGreen said:

I interpreted the silence as a hearty endorsement for my provisional pick, the NIU KQi2 Pro. https://shop.niu.com/products/niu-electric-kick-scooter-kqi2-pro

Will let you know how it turns out. 

Interesting, no where do the say how much it weighs.  Let us know.

[tony]

17 hours ago, Pinecone said:

Interesting, no where do the say how much it weighs.  Let us know.

It does, you have to keep scrolling to the bottom.  40.6lbs

[Pinecone]

Thanks, I thought I scrolled all the way down.

That is heavy.  I have an electric bike that is only a few pounds heavier.  And you get to sit.

But harder to get in and out of the plane.

[Marc_B]

I got a Uscooter. https://uscooters.com/

It's got about 25 mi range and goes over 20mph.  Foldable and doesn't take up much room.  The model I have weighs about 27 lbs.  Cost around $800 IIRC.  Makes it easy to use around the airport and take in the aircraft.  It free wheels well, which is one of my requirements in case I ran out of juice...I could tolerate it turning into a nonpowered scooter, but couldn't stand it turning into a 27# brick!

Edit: it will work with 2 people but due to the short handlebar width it feels twitchy with 2.  I've seriously considered an addition of skateboard and a tow rope for traveling with two!  ha ha.  So much fun but I'm not the young, rubber gumby skater dood that I was when I was 12!

[LANCECASPER]

On 8/5/2024 at 7:11 PM, TGreen said:

Any recommendations for a foldable electric kick scooter? Any to avoid?

I would avoid any with Li-Ion batteries

https://www.beechtalk.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=231210

[TGreen]

So far so good. Easy to put together, easy to use, easy to fold and unfold. Goes 17 mph, says it has a range of about 20 miles, climbs hills fine. I think it will be perfect for short hops from the plane.

[tony]

Is it easy getting it in and out of the baggage compartment?

Edited August 13, 2024 by tony

[wombat]

On 8/9/2024 at 3:38 PM, LANCECASPER said:

I would avoid any with Li-Ion batteries

https://www.beechtalk.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=231210

Should we keep our phones out of the cockpit?   What about fire extinguishers?

 

Seriously though, anything with stored energy can go catastrophically wrong.  I suspect the incidence rate of high energy density batteries made by low-cost manufacturers in China have a much higher rate than other manufacturers.  But what is the rate of an event when not being charged or used?  What would be an acceptable rate?  And 'none' is not a reasonable answer because I don't know of anyone who won't fly with a cell phone, and every cell phone has an incidence rate greater than 0.    No real easy answers here, we have to rely on anecdotes and media that seems to always have some angle they are trying to work that isn't just reporting accurate information.

 

 

 

 

[LANCECASPER]

4 hours ago, wombat said:

Should we keep our phones out of the cockpit?   What about fire extinguishers?

There are containment bags for phones and tablets. (https://www.sportys.com/avsax-ped-fire-containment-bag.html)     They are right there so we can see or smell if anything seems out of the ordinary to have some chance to catch it soon. 

A fire extinguisher is not going to put out a runaway Li-Ion battery fire.

- - - - 

Even a Mooney pilot who had a portable battery, which was out of reach in the back seat, that had been dropped earlier,  proved to be a total loss of the airplane while taxiing. At least there was no loss of life. Had that happened in the air it most surely would have cost him his life.

 

- - - - 

Having a larger capacity Li-Ion battery in the baggage compartment, such as on a small bike or scooter, would be too great a risk for me, since they could get tossed around and dinged up during use. Hauling it in the car is one thing - you can pull over and jump out - it's not so easy in the air. Everyone gets to make that choice for themselves though.

[BlueSky247]

Great point, Lance. Appreciate you mentioning that. I might not have even thought twice about tossing the onewheel in the back.

[TGreen]

20 hours ago, tony said:

Is it easy getting it in and out of the baggage compartment?

Haven't tried yet. But either that or through the door should work. 

[A64Pilot]

I carry two folding scooters in our Mooney in the baggage, URB-E’s, unfortunately no longer made but they come up on Ebay sometimes. Very high quality US made from CNC machined 6061 T-6 and carbon fiber, but big $$$ and couldn't compete with cheap Chinese.

Most that live in our fly-in community are older and many carry scooters.

Breakfast crowd, all fly in to eat.

Ideally for safety we would want LifePo4 batteries, but I’ve not seen scooters with them, just Li-Ion.

Difference in Li-Po and Li-Ion is Ion is in a metal case like Tesla or 18650’s for instance where Po are “pouch” batteries, The ones in a metal case are of course more damage tolerant.

Most scooters I think are Li-Ion, specifically 18650’s as that’s been the standard for decades, even the early Tesla’s used thousands of 18650’s.

 

[wombat]

@LANCECASPER Sorry, I wasn't clear enough.

My comment about the fire extinguisher was an attempt to suggest something so ridiculous that nobody could reasonably agree: Removing fire extinguishers because they themselves can be a hazard.   One of the videos I posted was about a fire extinguisher exploding and injuring the person in the car with it.   Since fire extinguishers are provably dangerous explosion hazards, I suggested maybe we shouldn't fly with them in the aircraft.   

My actual point here is that we would be well served to have a way to analyze the risk of each different stored energy device in the cabin of the plane so we could make an informed decision.   Unfortunately we don't and we have to rely on sensationalist media reports and anecdotes.   

 

I don't think the portable fire containment bags are a very good plan; most of the fires I've seen have been so sudden there was no chance to do anything about it before it was way too significant to grab to put into a bag.  Sure, it's a possible solution where I say "just take the risk".   But I don't think the cost of that solution in terms of money, complexity, training, time, and space is worth the reduction of risk.  But that's just me and you can make your own decision in your plane.

[tony]

16 hours ago, TGreen said:

Haven't tried yet. But either that or through the door should work. 

let me know, I wouldn't think it would be an issue of that handle bbar folding down.  But I'd love to get a verification.  

[Pinecone]

On 8/13/2024 at 7:07 PM, wombat said:

 

I don't think the portable fire containment bags are a very good plan; most of the fires I've seen have been so sudden there was no chance to do anything about it before it was way too significant to grab to put into a bag.  Sure, it's a possible solution where I say "just take the risk".   But I don't think the cost of that solution in terms of money, complexity, training, time, and space is worth the reduction of risk.  But that's just me and you can make your own decision in your plane.

Also they contain the flames but not the hot gases and smoke and fume.

[Will.iam]

In the airlines for runaway ipad's and phones they have a fire bag that they put water and ice in with the flaming device.  Have not seen it in action, hope I never do.

[Pinecone]

I managed to  punction a battery in an older iPhone trying to replace it.   Impressive.

But again, the bags may contain the flame, but if they tried to contain the hot gases it would just expand and explode.

[LANCECASPER]

On 8/15/2024 at 2:32 PM, Pinecone said:

I managed to  punction a battery in an older iPhone trying to replace it.   Impressive.

But again, the bags may contain the flame, but if they tried to contain the hot gases it would just expand and explode.

It may not be a perfect solution but it looks like they have thought through some of things:

"The AvSax can minimize that danger in seconds with its unique use of water. Simply pour at least two liters of water into an AvSax and then drop the burning device into the bag. The water activates the polymer gel inside the bag, causing it to expand around the device. Should the device continue venting, the AvSax is tough enough to absorb the explosive force. In short, the AvSax cools the batteries in the device, reducing the likelihood of the battery catching fire but if it does go into thermal runaway it is all contained within the bag. Includes bag and protective gloves for handling the overheating device. Measures 19” x 7” x 2” packed; weighs 4 lbs."

[MikeOH]

Is it just me or does the thought of being startled by your electronic device smoking/flaming in the cockpit, grabbing the AvSax and gloves, putting on the gloves, finding and filling the AvSax with water, and finally grabbing the smoking/flaming device and putting in the bag...all while calmly simultaneously flying the airplane strike you as more than a bit challenging?

Yeah, I know, just letting it burn out in the cabin is not a real attractive option, either.  Be honest here, how many carry fireproof gloves to even pick the device up and do anything with it?  If this disaster ever befalls me I'm likely to grab the device the best I can with a jacket and stuff it out the pilot's storm window (cell phone), or deliberately open the cabin door and jettison (ipad).

[Hank]

39 minutes ago, MikeOH said:

If this disaster ever befalls me I'm likely to grab the device the best I can with a jacket and ... deliberately open the cabin door and jettison (ipad).

You do realize that in flight, the door leaves just over a 1" gap when open? The slipstream at cruise speed is strong enough that you can't push it open any further.