Buying a plane without a prepurchase

[FloridaMan]

I'm considering buying an airplane that's been maintained by Willmar for the past 20 years. I'd love to have Don Maxwell do a prepurchase on it, but it will cost me at least 1600 to get the plane to him, plus another $950 for the prepurchase inspection. Willmar seems to have a reputation that ranks them up there with the very best MSCs and I simply don't think that it would make any sense for them to misrepresent an old Mooney. It would be sold to me with a fresh annual from Willmar as well. 

This is my first airplane and ordinarily I would not consider buying a plane without a thorough prepurchase inspection from a 3rd party, but would it make sense to make an exception in this case? 

[MooneyMitch]

Yes!  But I would certainly stipulate in your purchase contract that you have to approve all prior to final purchase transaction.

[PTK]

I would speak with Bruce Jaeger about your dilemma and trust in his advice. 

 

[FloridaMan]

Quote: Mitch

Yes!  But I would certainly stipulate in your purchase contract that you have to approve all prior to final purchase transaction.

[FloridaMan]

Quote: allsmiles

I would speak with Bruce Jaeger about your dilemma and trust in his advice. 

[MooneyMitch]

Should any discrepancies appear, you should have the option to approve or not approve, or negotiate, prior to being fully financially committed to the purchase.

[MooneyMitch]

Bruce is the former owner of Willmar. 

[FloridaMan]

Quote: Mitch

Should any discrepancies appear, you should have the option to approve or not approve, or negotiate, prior to being fully financially committed to the purchase.

[PTK]

He was but recently retired. This is why I mentioned him to you. You can trust him even though he was with Willmar who is selling the airplane. There are a handful of folks that can be trusted in these unique situations. If you were closer to TX I'd say talk to Ronnie at Dugosh. But up in MN Bruce is the one! He probably knows the airplane and the previous owner's attitude towards maintenance since it was maintained by Wilmar all those years!

 

[FloridaMan]

He probably knows the airplane as well. Is he alright with me giving him a call or do you think an email would be better? 

[MooneyMitch]

"You mean between the time I put a deposit down on it and take delivery, if I rely on Willmar's reputation in lieu of a prepurchase from a third party?"

I assume you have throughly purused the logs and you are satisifed.  That being the case, then during or after the annual, issues are discovered.  You will have the right to accept, reject or negoiate all issues without being obligated to complete the purchase of the airplane. 

 

[PTK]

Pick up the phone and call him! Tell him someone from the MAPA Safety Foundation seminars recommended him to you! Explain your dilemma and you will not be disappointed!

Mitch is also giving you very good advice. Do everything you would normally do to cover your interests and make you feel good about the acquisition. But Bruce Jaeger is your invaluable resource in this very unique case.

[MooneyMitch]

I've found Bruce to be a very open and friendly person.  I would suspect either method would be good.

Sounds fun, let us know more as you go along. 

[MooneyMitch]

Hi again Antares.

Just another thought. 

This is not meant with disrespect, but if you are not fully knowledgeable with aircraft specifics, and specifically Mooney knowledge, it might be wise to have someone that is quite knowledgeable go over all the logs with you.  They can help explain or identify items that appear throughout the history of the airplane.  

The more you know, the better you will feel about this airplane, or any potential airplane you may be interested in purchasing.

[John Pleisse]

Of course you want objectivity, but if Willmar (a top notch shop) was in the business of home cooking for their regulars and conflicting with their national brokerage, they would not have the great reptation they have. I doubt they'd screw ya. It will be their signature an seal in the logbook for the annual, so if something is unairworthy, you would have recousre.

If it were me and I had viewed the a/c and logbooks and found myself in the same delima....I'd go with Willmar. Remember, many people by a/c's site unseen.

Or...hire a good A&P nearby to drive over at meet you at Willmar. Stay with the big "gotchas". Tanks, crankcase, prop, landing gear motor/gear, frame damage, flood damge, frame corrosion, 208A-B, etc.

Elliott in Eden Prarie is a great shop. Pricey...and great.

 

[OR75]

This is what I would do:

Take along a fellow pilot / owner who you trust and has been involved in maintenance and look at the plane (look at the logs, open panels, cowling, avionics, under the panel, battery compartment, etc ...)

Ask for a fresh annual where all glitches are paid by the seller.

 

That does not assure you will have a trouble free a/c but IMHO, even an MSC per-buy will not guarantee you that things won't happen.

[FloridaMan]

That would be great, except I'm 1200 nm from where the airplane is so I'll have to either inconvenience a friend or make a new friend that's closer to the airplane. 

[Cabanaboy]

I say buy, if you find a problem you can pay someone to fix it. No big deal.

[gjkirsch]

Bruce is still active in the community and does flight training.  I would trust Bruce above anyone when it comes to a purchase decision on a Mooney.  Hire him to fly the plane with you and check it out.  You will probably need some dual for insurance purposes.  The only down side I have  of flying with Bruce is I walking away after the flight and realizing how much better of a pilot I should be.  He is just so smooth in a plane it is like he is on another level.

[OR75]

Here is an interesting concept:

Any Mooney fan on here who lives in thearea willing to come along to point at things ?

 

[MooneyMitch]

Quote: gjkirsch

Bruce is still active in the community and does flight training.  I would trust Bruce above anyone when it comes to a purchase decision on a Mooney.  Hire him to fly the plane with you and check it out.  You will probably need some dual for insurance purposes.  The only down side I have  of flying with Bruce is I walking away after the flight and realizing how much better of a pilot I should be.  He is just so smooth in a plane it is like he is on another level.

[mooney2201]

you may just piss away you total investment,i dont care who took care of that plane,if you have one major problem,reach into your pocket and kiss goodbye 25kkkkk............corrosion,busted spar cap,broke engine mount,bad crank,non complied ad,s...take heed,if they find noting wrong,consider it the best mney you ever spent

[mooney2201]

you may just piss away you total investment,i dont care who took care of that plane,if you have one major problem,reach into your pocket and kiss goodbye 25kkkkk............corrosion,busted spar cap,broke engine mount,bad crank,non complied ad,s...take heed,if they find noting wrong,consider it the best mney you ever spent

[Immelman]

I would not buy a first airplane w/o a pre-purchase, even if sold from a reputable MSC. Period.

[fantom]

Quote: Immelman

I would not buy a first airplane w/o a pre-purchase, even if sold from a reputable MSC. Period.