Aero Comfort interiors new policy

[Falcon Man]

I refurbished a 1984 M20K interior with: the SpaceSaver kit for side panels,  a new carpet and ceiling panels from Airtex,  an insulation kit from Lasar, epoxy premiered the tubes, and had a local upholstery shop do the seats. I spent about 80 hours and it turned out great and saved me thousands.

I like working on my airplanes with my IA/AP guiding me. Not for everyone. 

[kortopates]

I am a long time owner with over 20 yrs on our current 252/Encore and went a similar route as described above after a few years of ownership. I couldn't justify the high cost of a quality interior. It just looked like a lot of money for sakes of appearances and also thought I could save money using a local upholstery guy that actually came with some good recommendations from other satisfied aircraft owners. 

It looked nice and I saved money alright but it wasn't long before I realized it was at the cost of comfort. The guy used some standard foam, if he even replaced the old foam (I was never sure) and my sore butt was getting sorer on longer flights as time went on. Plus the leather he used was just cheap and looking tired after only a couple years. As I learned more about the proper way to build up an aircraft seat with different densities of foam I undersood why we were suffering on longer trips and started to plan my next interior improvements with Hector and just wished I had done it right the first time. I would have been dollars ahead, but it was a learning experience for me. I know there are lots of upholstery shops that do know how to properly build up a seat, I talked to several who claimed too, but when their prices matched or exceeded Hectors I didn't want to risk making another poor choice so I went with the proven winner by the shop that has probably done more quality Mooney interiors than anyone - and am glad I did. He does excellent work.  

[haymak3r]

Can confirm what was stated about aerocomfort. Called and spoke to Hector last week, and got on his schedule to get my yokes wrapped. Crazy expensive!! 

While we are all CB's at heart..  A friend of mine was blown away with the price I told him for the yokes. And then we were talking about my plans for getting the seats done next(now will be in 2025...). I still would like to get some sheepskin covers for the front seats. So have been hesitant in getting them re-covered with new leather, rather getting them re-foamed would be the more important factor. My friend asked why not just get some high quality memory foam or something, and get the sheepskin covers, and put the foam under those. Not sure how well that would all be secured down, but got me thinking. And so I guess, I am now curious what other's think about this. I don't think I would do it unless others have, and have had positive results.

Thanks,

Chris

[bcg]

On the subject of shipping interiors to Hector (which we are doing in about three weeks), anybody have any tips?  Buy or build a wooden shipping crate?

I think your best bet cost wise would be to crate it up on a pallet and shop it LTL, assuming they have a forklift there to unload it. It's been a few years but, I used to ship 4' x 8' x 5', 1,500 pound packages half way across the country LTL for about $400. A Mooney interior in a crate could probably be shipped that way for $300 or less now. I always used a broker to find me the best deal, his commission was less than what he saved me.

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[jetdriven]

My guess is its gonna be 800$ to ship that on a pallet, each way.   Freight is obscene now. I just ate 189$ for a pair of magnetos from Virginia to Montana 2nd day.

[LANCECASPER]

Not for freight shipments, but UPS USPS shipments I never go through either of them directly. Pirateship.com has about the best rates found on shipping smaller stuff (mags, accessories, etc).

[Echo]

On 10/28/2023 at 4:06 PM, Pinecone said:

Same here.  I am redoing my interior, but it will be lower level than the full out.  No ultraleather covered plastic.  Cloth seats (more comfortable in hot and cold).

And about half the cost of the high end interior.

I like my interior with a few exceptions.  The carpet is literally threadbare.  I ordered new carpet from a Minnesota company named SCS Interiors.  $484.82.  Purchased shulder harnesses from Alpha Aviation for $1212.00.  Painting yokes and door handle (local powder coater about $150).  I am doing labor (except shoulder harness install).  Finally found a local installer for engine monitor and intercom install.  Soon my functional plane will be "mine".  NOT spanky.  Not spartan.  

I have zero issues with folks upgrading their plane interior.  (good for them) I just can not relate to the expense of the current interiors and would rather spend my money elsewhere (firearms/golf/travel).  I meant NO judgement on those that do.  Just "not my thing".  I feel the same about latest/greatest avionics.  Not worth the squeeze to me.  Scott

[hoot777]

Can you recommend some othe interior shops. I’m in SC

[William Munney]

I’m passing on shipping a container to Hector.  He is very expensive, freight is expensive and then you have the variable costs and results of uninstalling and then reinstalling your own interior.

I’m going to sub it out.  There are thousands of interior and upholstery shops in the US.  I found several locally who are MUCH less expensive and enthusiastic about the project.  The Hector price tag of $25k was tough enough to swallow when it was a drop-it-and-done deal.

Seats and carpet are coming out next week.  Clean and inspect the interior.  Ordered the foam and carpet already.  Looking for leather.  And, I can do the windows too if i want and still save money.  Yes.  It’s going to be work but getting held hostage in the GA market is getting tiresome.  Less service for more money everywhere you look.

[Pinecone]

I am going with a local shop also.  I don't want the full blown interior that Hector normally does.

So while my plane is in the avionics shop, the interior shop will pick up the interior pieces, redo the interior and deliver back to avionics shop to reinstall when the avionics work is done.

New carpet.  Seats done in mix of fabric and leather (fabric is more comfortable), headrests leather with embroidered Mooney emblem. Plastic pieces repaired and painted, kick panels replaced.  Yokes leather covered.  Insulation replaced.

I asked around the airport and several people recommended this shop.  Once the work is done, I will post info and pictures.

[Schllc]

1 hour ago, Pinecone said:

I am going with a local shop also.  I don't want the full blown interior that Hector normally does.

So while my plane is in the avionics shop, the interior shop will pick up the interior pieces, redo the interior and deliver back to avionics shop to reinstall when the avionics work is done.

New carpet.  Seats done in mix of fabric and leather (fabric is more comfortable), headrests leather with embroidered Mooney emblem. Plastic pieces repaired and painted, kick panels replaced.  Yokes leather covered.  Insulation replaced.

I asked around the airport and several people recommended this shop.  Once the work is done, I will post info and pictures.

If I had the time it takes to get in and finish it I would, but that isn’t my situation, not yet anyway…

I have done only one major project in aviation but I can promise you it applies to all of them…

Hector was the exception in that he was proven, most other shops don’t have the reputation and are really poor with communication, but decent to great at their craft. 
I would suggest, if at all possible, if you have to use a new to you guy, make sure the shop is close enough for you to visit once or twice a week. 
This simple part of the process will apply appropriate pressure on the vendor as well as allow the owner to see things as the develop.  There are myriad details you can’t even think of that require small and large decisions.  The vendor will make a lot of these decisions without consulting, which isn’t always wrong, but given the options you may have chosen differently. 
Being close and viewing regularly can mitigate these items, and reduce the vendor excuses.  Both of these things will expedite the completion which is a win win.

maybe I’m just really particular but my experience quoted 3-4 months and took 15 months  I was 1,000 miles away which wasn’t really convenient to check on, even in my own plane.  I don’t have bad things to say about the shop, I just had unrealistic expectations given the circumstances  I will go back to the shop again, but know what to go there for and what to stay away if I’m not open to their method  

I have the referral that was posted here, but would like another one based in southwest fl  

 

[1980Mooney]

2 hours ago, Schllc said:

If I had the time it takes to get in and finish it I would, but that isn’t my situation, not yet anyway…

I have done only one major project in aviation but I can promise you it applies to all of them…

maybe I’m just really particular but my experience quoted 3-4 months and took 15 months  I was 1,000 miles away which wasn’t really convenient to check on, even in my own plane.  I don’t have bad things to say about the shop, I just had unrealistic expectations given the circumstances  I will go back to the shop again, but know what to go there for and what to stay away if I’m not open to their method  

Flying a plane 1,000 miles away for an interior and having it down for 15 months is crazy.  I bet there are not a lot here that can afford to pay all their fixed costs on their plane for nearly a year and a half only to have it sit.  You can't let your hangar lease go - with waitlists in almost all airports you likely can't get it back if you do.  You need your hull ("expensive") insurance if something were to happen to it sitting - flood, tornado, fire, etc (remember all the Mooney PFM M20L's flooded when Hurricane Charley hit Mod Works in 2004?).  Your plane will be out of Annual - you may need to hire a distant A&P for an "out of state Annual"(i.e. potentially $$$) or else ferry it - but timing may not match up with the installer delay vs an A&P Annual schedule.  Your plane may have even more idle downtime waiting.  Your Instrument currency lapses. And if the down timing falls on your BFR then you need to rent a plane.

And for those who can afford it, they likely don't want to and don't want a solution with a plane grounded for so long.

[Schllc]

4 hours ago, 1980Mooney said:

Flying a plane 1,000 miles away for an interior and having it down for 15 months is crazy.  I bet there are not a lot here that can afford to pay all their fixed costs on their plane for nearly a year and a half only to have it sit.  You can't let your hangar lease go - with waitlists in almost all airports you likely can't get it back if you do.  You need your hull ("expensive") insurance if something were to happen to it sitting - flood, tornado, fire, etc (remember all the Mooney PFM M20L's flooded when Hurricane Charley hit Mod Works in 2004?).  Your plane will be out of Annual - you may need to hire a distant A&P for an "out of state Annual"(i.e. potentially $$$) or else ferry it - but timing may not match up with the installer delay vs an A&P Annual schedule.  Your plane may have even more idle downtime waiting.  Your Instrument currency lapses. And if the down timing falls on your BFR then you need to rent a plane.

And for those who can afford it, they likely don't want to and don't want a solution with a plane grounded for so long.

It wasn’t an interior. I still need that done!

it was a full Avionics’s upgrade, landing gear overhaul, some other upgrades and an annual. 
I was NOT happy with the delay, but not much you can do once it’s in pieces somewhere. 
it was definitely a learning experience. 
I had the engines pickled btw, I had another plane to fly, and ground only insurance was only 1800. And I had my hangar subletted, not a problem at an airport with a five year wait list. 
my point was any major work done by me in the future will be done close enough for me to put eyes on the plane and the people regularly. 
 

PS. This was not for a Mooney either, it was for my Aerostar. But the principle applies to any major work on any airplane. 

[GaryP1007]

It wasn’t an interior. I still need that done!
it was a full Avionics’s upgrade, landing gear overhaul, some other upgrades and an annual. 
I was NOT happy with the delay, but not much you can do once it’s in pieces somewhere. 
it was definitely a learning experience. 
I had the engines pickled btw, I had another plane to fly, and ground only insurance was only 1800. And I had my hangar subletted, not a problem at an airport with a five year wait list. 
my point was any major work done by me in the future will be done close enough for me to put eyes on the plane and the people regularly. 
 
PS. This was not for a Mooney either, it was for my Aetostar. But the principle applies to any major work on any airplane. 

Might be helpful to post a list of interior shops state by state with a commentary by customers.


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[Pinecone]

The shop I chose is close enough to drive to if needed.  Not at the same airport as the avionics work, but close enough for me to visit both weekly.

As mentioned, others on my field have had work done by this shop and were very happy.

[GeeBee]

The question with upholstery work is not what does it look like now, because new cloth and leather always looks great  Rather it is "what will it look like in 5 years."

[Schllc]

9 hours ago, GeeBee said:

The question with upholstery work is not what does it look like now, because new cloth and leather always looks great  Rather it is "what will it look like in 5 years."

Very true, however, if it looks like crap when it’s brand new, it ain’t getting any better!

[GeeBee]

25 minutes ago, Schllc said:

Very true, however, if it looks like crap when it’s brand new, it ain’t getting any better!

I agree, however it is not what you see but what you don't see in a new job that makes it look bad later. Things like carpet backing, seat foam and the attachment thereof.

“The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.” 

― Benjamin Franklin

[Schllc]

11 minutes ago, GeeBee said:

I agree, however it is not what you see but what you don't see in a new job that makes it look bad later. Things like carpet backing, seat foam and the attachment thereof.

“The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.” 

― Benjamin Franklin

I completely understand your point. 
good, fast, cheap…….. pick two. 
 

no better option than good referrals and they probably come out well for the most part.  It’s most important to align expectations.  There can be no assumptions.  
Caveat emptor

[Marc_B]

As most things in aviation. It all costs more than we “think” or is that just want it to. There are other places to get work done and some may be great. Aero Comfort is a well known shop with a well deserved reputation. Their pricing was upfront ahead of drop off and didn’t change at the end. To some (me included) it was worth the cost. 
If others have recommendations and examples, it would be super helpful. The problem is that this is a low volume service (comparatively speaking) and it’s not like 4.9 stars on yelp is gonna help. 
If you’re spending a bit of money, my thinking is get a personal referral or go somewhere well known. Otherwise you might be happy or you might be disappointed. Both feeling grow over time.

Probably not a bad thread to have…interior shops that are great. But I suspect you’d find the same as a google mooneyspace search…lots of happy Aero Comfort customers…whether that’s glareshields, yokes, seats or full interiors. 

If you’re trying to go less expensive, get a carpet kit from SCS, get some sheepskin seat covers, and check prices for Spatial Interior kit from Jaeger for sidewalls (or fix/patch/repair and repaint your own). 

another thought is to check with Hector about a local to them shop to take out and reinstall their work.  Perhaps they haven’t ruled out the “turn key” completely and could steer you to a solid recommendation sans shipping…

[GeeBee]

Actually my AeroComfort interior came in under Hector's quote and he issued me a check for the difference. That is a first for me in aviation.

[Pinecone]

Did he used to remove and replace the interior for free?  Or included in the cost?

Why not offer it, but for an additional price?

[GeeBee]

17 minutes ago, Pinecone said:

Did he used to remove and replace the interior for free?  Or included in the cost?

Why not offer it, but for an additional price?

He did offer either DIY or installation. Installation was extra. After this year only DIY. I suspect the reason for not offering installation after 2024 is the cost of maintaining the Part 145 status to do the work. He told me it is increasingly difficult to get labor capable of doing the work and who can pass the random drug tests. Even the occasional marijuana user cannot work in a Part 145 station even as a receptionist. Without 145 status insurance gets pricey.

[LANCECASPER]

4 hours ago, Pinecone said:

Did he used to remove and replace the interior for free?  Or included in the cost?

Why not offer it, but for an additional price?

I think the biggest reason is that his building where the upholstery takes place is not on airport property, although adjacent, and he always had to find a space to rent at an FBO or Avionics shop to do the removal and install. In San Antonio that space is very difficult if not impossible to find and is expensive. In 2006 he used my hangar down at KSSF to remove/install. I had the chance to give him and an employee their first ride in a GA aircraft when he was finished in December 2006. Over the years he’s used space at Ahr Avionics at KSAT but with everyone being backed up on work, I doubt there’s any extra space there for sure.

In 2016 when I did the complete interior on anther Bravo I bought, I did the removal and install and just brought him the pieces and picked them up when he was done. It was a lot of work and not something I’d want to do everyday, but I learned a lot about my airplane. This is not a new policy, all through the years people shipped him interiors from all over the world and he shipped them back, finished. Most of his business was done that way. The exception was that If someone wanted to pay a premium to have him do it, he would find a place to do it, usually during evenings and weekends. The hassle was always that someone flew it in from out of town and wanted to wait around and have it done. He has a business to run - there’s only so many hours in a day. Although he still did a fine job on that part, and tried to accommodate everyone, it takes him away from his expertise, finishing the upholstery, yokes and side panels and headliner, meticulously. Plus it takes him away from his family.

I like all of his work, but covering the side panels in ultraleather and stitching them the way they do turns a 30-40 year old interior into something that rivals a brand new airplane. No matter where I lived, personally after having him do work on most of the airplanes I’ve owned I wouldn’t use anyone else. It’s going to cost something to have anyone do it. You’re only paying the difference one time to have him do it  . . . .  right  . . . .  the first time. In the Mooney world an interior from Aero Comfort will always bring a good portion of the money back on resale.

“There never was an article made that couldn’t be made worse for less money” John Ruskin

[shawnd]

On 12/25/2023 at 8:54 AM, Pinecone said:

I asked around the airport and several people recommended this shop.  Once the work is done, I will post info and pictures.

@Pinecone got any pictures? :-)