My first (and hopefully last) "possible pilot deviation"

[N201MKTurbo]

1 hour ago, carusoam said:

Actual IMC adds to the challenge of getting the clearance while airborne… 

We used to have something called an RCO..

Remote Control Outlet?

it was a radio frequency for the nearest Class D approach/departure group…

The cell phone was a better solution.

Best regards,

-a-

Remote Communications Outlet.

Im pretty sure they are still out there. They are nice when you have one.

BTW RCOs are for FSS, RTRs are for ATC.

[jaylw314]

5 hours ago, midlifeflyer said:

Not knowing that is a bit surprising. Think about it. They have to. How can they figure out when to release you unless they know what you are going to do? 

Well, even though everything is through 'computer', not everything computer is communicated in a way that's fast and easy **ahem**NOTAMS**ahem**, so I don't know that immediate would be a natural expectation

[jlunseth]

Probably been said already, but on one or two occasions I have gotten a void time clearance only to have the pattern suddenly clogged up. The simple thing is to call ATC and tell them what is going on and that you won't make the void time. The couple of times that has happened they immediately have given me a new void time.

[midlifeflyer]

2 hours ago, N201MKTurbo said:

Remote Communications Outlet.

Im pretty sure they are still out there. They are nice when you have one.

BTW RCOs are for FSS, RTRs are for ATC.

When I moved to NC 10 years ago,  there was one at my new home base. Never worked  my club had the phone number posted in the planning room.

[redbaron1982]

2 hours ago, jaylw314 said:

Well, even though everything is through 'computer', not everything computer is communicated in a way that's fast and easy **ahem**NOTAMS**ahem**, so I don't know that immediate would be a natural expectation

Yeah, that was my point. I work in the software industry and I can assure you that the most absurd excuses are made why two systems don't communicate with each other.

And in this case, I can think of a not-so-absurd excuse, like "We cannot distract departure with all the flight plans that have been filled and not released yet, that's is ground or clearance delivery responsibility".

Edited May 4, 2023 by redbaron1982

[T. Peterson]

4 hours ago, Hank said:

Just be careful with this. It's what I often do, but sometimes there are issues.

Taking off from a grass strip between Jax and Wilmington, with my IFR flight plan filed, Approach would never answer my calls as I'm climbing towards the clouds at about 5000 or so [filed was 10,000 msl]. Fortunately in the way down from WV I had written all of my frequency changes down, so I just looked for the next expected one and called Seymour Johnson and they opened my flight plan for me. Approach was too busy talking to planes going into Oak Island to bother with someone who was leaving . . . . And yes, I was cleared direct to Furthest WV. 

Yikes. But you accessed, adapted and overcame! Oorah!

 I only do that in solid VMC conditions.

[T. Peterson]

4 hours ago, McMooney said:

How it works for me, i get an expected clearance, load it into my nifty 480, call cd/ground, get something completely different, enter that into the 480, take off and fly something different from everything before, sigh  good thing it's mostly instructions to fly direct

Yessir, it does go that way sometimes! Fortunately your last statement is also my experience in the Mooney. Generally a direct clearance. 
 

[T. Peterson]

4 hours ago, carusoam said:

Actual IMC adds to the challenge of getting the clearance while airborne… 

We used to have something called an RCO..

Remote Control Outlet?

it was a radio frequency for the nearest Class D approach/departure group…

The cell phone was a better solution.

Best regards,

-a-

They have GCO now which I am sure is the same thing, but I don’t like it. Cell phone is the ticket.

[Hank]

29 minutes ago, T. Peterson said:

They have GCO now which I am sure is the same thing, but I don’t like it. Cell phone is the ticket.

I just allow a few extra minutes--I call the national 800 number saved in my phone; they transfer me to where I need to be; then they usually put me on hold and pick up a recorded line to give the clearance and get my read back like on the radio.

If you know the number for the tower near where you are (if it's close enough to clear you), it'll be faster. Wonder if I still have the Atlanta number saved?

[T. Peterson]

1 hour ago, Hank said:

I just allow a few extra minutes--I call the national 800 number saved in my phone; they transfer me to where I need to be; then they usually put me on hold and pick up a recorded line to give the clearance and get my read back like on the radio.

If you know the number for the tower near where you are (if it's close enough to clear you), it'll be faster. Wonder if I still have the Atlanta number saved?

Foreflight will give you the phone number for the actual controlling agency of the airspace over your departure airport, thus negating the necessity of the national 800 number. If you have ForeFlight bring up the airport page and tap on the Info block.

[Hank]

4 minutes ago, T. Peterson said:

Foreflight will give you the phone number for the actual controlling agency of the airspace over your departure airport, thus negating the necessity of the national 800 number. If you have ForeFlight bring up the airport page and tap on the Info block.

I use Avare, when i have my tablet charged up, with me, charts updated and I remember to not put it in the baggage area. The information is probably in there somewhere. 

[T. Peterson]

16 minutes ago, Hank said:

I use Avare, when i have my tablet charged up, with me, charts updated and I remember to not put it in the baggage area. The information is probably in there somewhere. 

That’s a lot of remembering!

Have you ever got all situated, seat adjusted to the perfect spot, seat belt buckled and then realized your keys were in the front pocket of your blue jeans? That’s always special!

[T. Peterson]

On 5/2/2023 at 2:46 PM, mike_elliott said:

Careful with this one so one doest foul plugs waiting to get a clearance and then a release, which sometimes takes a good 5-10 min. Do a quick runup right before entering the the runway to make sure all cyl.s are still firing. I have had that bite me hard once.

I know I run the risk of forgetting to go to full rich, but I lean after the run up while doing the phone for clearance thing. So far all is well.

[Hank]

8 hours ago, T. Peterson said:

That’s a lot of remembering!

Have you ever got all situated, seat adjusted to the perfect spot, seat belt buckled and then realized your keys were in the front pocket of your blue jeans? That’s always special!

That was even more special on those after-work IFR training flights during the WV winters! Undo seatbelt, unzip coat, remove gloves, slide seat back and try to get them out of a front pocket . . . I wore Dockers to work, and those have deep pockets! Meanwhile I'm getting very cold very fast, and there's the CFII beside me . . . .

[midlifeflyer]

13 hours ago, Hank said:

I just allow a few extra minutes--I call the national 800 number saved in my phone; they transfer me to where I need to be; then they usually put me on hold and pick up a recorded line to give the clearance and get my read back like on the radio.

If you know the number for the tower near where you are (if it's close enough to clear you), it'll be faster. Wonder if I still have the Atlanta number saved?

The National 800 number went away about two years ago. I'm sure it's still answered because old habits die hard.

you don't have to "know" the direct phone numbers to the Center or TRACON facilities handling the nontowered airport's clearance delivery. They are listed in the AFD  and in some EFB apps. The back and forth from you to FSS to ATC to FSS to you and back again if necessary is thankfully gone.

[T. Peterson]

1 hour ago, midlifeflyer said:

The National 800 number went away about two years ago. I'm sure it's still answered because old habits die hard.

you don't have to "know" the direct phone numbers to the Center or TRACON facilities handling the nontowered airport's clearance delivery. They are listed in the AFD  and in some EFB apps. The back and forth from you to FSS to ATC to FSS to you and back again if necessary is thankfully gone.

Interesting. I didn’t know the national number had gone away, I just realized one day that it wasn’t necessary. There sure have been a lot of changes since my part 135 days when I called FSS from a pay phone at the FBO to file a flight plan. The technology we enjoy today is incredible. I really like ForeFlight. The bummer is I will have to start paying for it myself when I retire later this year!

[Hank]

36 minutes ago, T. Peterson said:

I really like ForeFlight. The bummer is I will have to start paying for it myself when I retire later this year!

That's why i use Avare, it's free. Also, foreflight only runs on fruity tablets, and i don't have one ofnthose, either. I figure it's half an annual inspection in savings each year sticking with Android (every Samsung tablet has a GPS chip, even the $100 ones, but Apple makes you spend big bucks for that feature).

[hubcap]

Fortunately, I can contact Clearance Delivery from the ground at my home airport, so I get my clearance before taking off. When traveling, if not at a towered field, I just use the phone to call for a clearance before takeoff. I rarely pick up a clearance after takeoff…unless it’s in the heat of the day during summer.

[Pinecone]

On 5/3/2023 at 5:16 PM, GeeBee said:

Easy way to do it. I look for my routing in Garmin pilot before I depart. Yes, it will show you the ATC routing they will give you about 20 minutes prior to proposed. If it is different than what I filed, that is what I program and every time, it is what I get. 

I check in Flight Aware not long after I file.  And if the routing is different, I amend my flight plan with the new routing.  Fore Flight or Flight Service has been sending me emails with my routing or As Filed.

That said, I had a flight recently that I did this.  When I called for clearance, I got a totally different clearance.  I called ground for taxi and was told to call CD for a revised clearance, which they ended up not revising the clearance, then after take off, I got a revised clearance totally different that what I had.

[Pinecone]

3 hours ago, midlifeflyer said:

The National 800 number went away about two years ago. I'm sure it's still answered because old habits die hard.

Uuuh, no it has not.  1-800-WX BRIEF 

One number to the nearest Flight Service Station.

I use it sometimes for a weather briefing and filing SFRA flight plans (the automated system doesn't like some of the directions on how to file).

[midlifeflyer]

1 hour ago, Hank said:

That's why i use Avare, it's free. Also, foreflight only runs on fruity tablets, and i don't have one ofnthose, either. I figure it's half an annual inspection in savings each year sticking with Android (every Samsung tablet has a GPS chip, even the $100 ones, but Apple makes you spend big bucks for that feature).

There's a small chance I will use Avare when I stop flying IFR. The feature set won't be that important to me anymore. I'm constantly surprised how bad its flight planning is except for the simplest VFR flight. At this point it's one of my tertiary backups (where I don't care about anything other than have the proper approach plate) although I like FltPlan Go! a little better these days..

[midlifeflyer]

17 minutes ago, Pinecone said:

Uuuh, no it has not.  1-800-WX BRIEF 

 

Uhhh yes it has. I thought we were talking about Clearance Delivery, not general FSS services.

800-WX BRIEF (800 992 7433?) is not and never was the National Clearance Delivery phone number. It is and has for a long time been the national FSS number.  The National Clearance Delivery number was 888-766-8267. It's still in operation but only has a recording telling you to go to the Chart Supplement or go to the website to get the proper phone number (I'm sure you can call the WXBRIEF phone and get it too)..

[Pinecone]

Aah, I see what you are saying.

But, as someone else said, you can all it, and they will connect you to the appropriate CD.

But ForeFlight has the direct number

[midlifeflyer]

8 minutes ago, Pinecone said:

Aah, I see what you are saying.

But, as someone else said, you can all it, and they will connect you to the appropriate CD.

But ForeFlight has the direct number

Which number are you talking about? Yes, you can call WXBRIEF and ask for the CD number for where you are, and then call it. That may be your choice.  But I'd rather just take slow 10 seconds to look it up and call CD without the middleman.

OTOH, what was the national CD number is basically gone.

LOL. Of course Foreflight, FltPlan, Garmin Pilot, Avare, iFly, SkyVector, etc etc exc has the direct number. 

[EricJ]

13 hours ago, midlifeflyer said:

There's a small chance I will use Avare when I stop flying IFR. The feature set won't be that important to me anymore. I'm constantly surprised how bad its flight planning is except for the simplest VFR flight. At this point it's one of my tertiary backups (where I don't care about anything other than have the proper approach plate) although I like FltPlan Go! a little better these days..

I primarily use Avare, even for IFR, but have FltPlan Go on my tablets as well.   I go back and forth sometimes, but find the map displays for Avare much better for graphics and situational awareness than FltPlan Go, enough so that I use it most of the time.    A *lot* of people use FltPlan Go for filing, even people who use other EFBs for everything else.    If its map displays were better (imho) I'd use it a lot more.

And they're both free ($0) with free updates of charts and plates and everything else you need.    The plates are georeferenced and can be overlaid on the maps on both apps.   The airport taxiway charts are georeferenced as well.    All for 0$.     I don't think Garmin and Jeppesen are adding value comparable to their subscription fees.