New Battery Recommendation

[WAFI]

Hello my fellow aviation goo-roos-

I’m looking to replace my battery that’s going on four years old now. Since I’m slowly converting over to more electricity power avionics I would feel more comfortable with a fresh high quality battery.

What battery would you get if the cost was irrelevant? 

Part Number would be much appreciated or at least the size. 

 

PS: Has anyone been looking at the EarthX Batteries? Damn they are light but unfortunately not certified yet for a Mooney. Unless you know something I don’t.  

[LANCECASPER]

You might get yours capacity tested to make sure, but if you're ready for a new battery for your 14v J model Concorde has two options:

https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/rg35a.php This one has 29 amp hours.

https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/rg_35axc.php This one has 33 amp hours.

Since you only have only battery i would get the one with the most capacity, for about 10% more money.

[alextstone]

You are probably going to see several posts telling you how much better Concord sealed batteries are thanGill batteries are.  I bought into this bias when I needed to replace battery number two (I have two batteries of the same size in my Bravo).  I purchased a Concord sealed battery 03/2019.  The other one is a Gill G243 that was installed 01/2018.  The IA doing my annual noticed that the Gill was low on electrolyte fluid and he filled it with distilled water during the annual a month ago.  Then winter set in here (I'm in MS and up to New Year's Eve, we had warm temps).  As these things go, when I started the plane during its first "cold-cold start = 40 degrees F, the number one battery was weak.  

I informed the IA and he immediately pointed at the Gill battery because the electrolyte fluid was low at the annual.  I had to prove to him that the Gill was on the number one battery bus, not the Concord.  I replaced the Concord with another Gill.  

The other issue is that is will be hard to find ANY battery in stock right now.  I had to order one from Banyan FBO in Ft. Lauderdale Florida.  They purchased it from a 'shadow dealer' of unknown origin.  

This is just my anecdotal experience, yours may vary.

[WAFI]

5 minutes ago, alextstone said:

You are probably going to see several posts telling you how much better Concord sealed batteries are thanGill batteries are.  I bought into this bias when I needed to replace battery number one (I have two batteries of the same size in my Bravo).  I purchased a Concord sealed battery 03/2019.  The other one is a Gill G243 that was installed 01/2018.  The IA doing my annual noticed that the Gill was low on electrolyte fluid and he filled it with distilled water during the annual a month ago.  Then winter set in here (I'm in MS and up to New Year's Eve, we had warm temps).  As these things go, when I started the plane during its first "cold-cold start = 40 degrees F, the number one battery was weak.  

I informed the IA and he immediately pointed at the Gill battery because the electrolyte fluid was low at the annual.  I had to prove to him that the Gill was on the number one battery bus, not the Concord.  I replaced the Concord with another Gill.  

The other issue is that is will be hard to find ANY battery in stock right now.  I had to order one from Banyan FBO in Ft. Lauderdale Florida.  They purchased it from a 'shadow dealer' of unknown origin.  

This is just my anecdotal experience, yours may vary.

Banyan is not that far from me, maybe I can unfold the mysterious “Shadow Dealer”. Thanks for the feedback!

[alextstone]

Just now, WAFI said:

Banyan is not that far from me, maybe I can unfold the mysterious “Shadow Dealer”. Thanks for the feedback!

FWIW, Banyan did not mark up the price over published retail so where they got the battery was not a concern for me.  The overnight shipping was steep though! ( I had an 18 hour trip departing in two days, ugh).

[LANCECASPER]

8 minutes ago, alextstone said:

You are probably going to see several posts telling you how much better Concord sealed batteries are thanGill batteries are.  I bought into this bias when I needed to replace battery number one (I have two batteries of the same size in my Bravo).  I purchased a Concord sealed battery 03/2019.  The other one is a Gill G243 that was installed 01/2018.  The IA doing my annual noticed that the Gill was low on electrolyte fluid and he filled it with distilled water during the annual a month ago.  Then winter set in here (I'm in MS and up to New Year's Eve, we had warm temps).  As these things go, when I started the plane during its first "cold-cold start = 40 degrees F, the number one battery was weak.  

I informed the IA and he immediately pointed at the Gill battery because the electrolyte fluid was low at the annual.  I had to prove to him that the Gill was on the number one battery bus, not the Concord.  I replaced the Concord with another Gill.  

The other issue is that is will be hard to find ANY battery in stock right now.  I had to order one from Banyan FBO in Ft. Lauderdale Florida.  They purchased it from a 'shadow dealer' of unknown origin.  

This is just my anecdotal experience, yours may vary.

If the number one battery was weak and the number one battery was the Gill, why did you replace the Concorde?

[alextstone]

1 minute ago, LANCECASPER said:

If the number one battery was weak and the number one battery was the Gill, why did you replace the Concorde?

Oops, its very early here and I am caffeine-deficient.  I corrected the post.  

[WAFI]

Any chance you know the Model #??

[LANCECASPER]

3 minutes ago, WAFI said:

Any chance you know the Model #??

The Gill for yours is a G-35 or if you want sealed it's a 7035-28.

 

The Mooney Standard parts section of Aircraft Spruce is your friend: https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/stpages/mooneyM20standardreplacementparts.php?clickkey=5942

[WAFI]

7 minutes ago, LANCECASPER said:

The Gill for yours is a G-35 or if you want sealed it's a 7035-28.

 

The Mooney Standard parts section of Aircraft Spruce is your friend: https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/stpages/mooneyM20standardreplacementparts.php?clickkey=5942

Thanks for the link—

It looks like the 7243-16 is the sealed battery correct?

[Brian E.]

After my Concorde failed after many years of service I decided to give the Gill sealed a chance.  Been flying the Gill for 2 years, 500 hours all over the hot and cold US with no concerns thus far.  In summary, don't be afraid or discount the sealed Gill.

[LANCECASPER]

58 minutes ago, WAFI said:

Thanks for the link—

It looks like the 7243-16 is the sealed battery correct?

It is a sealed battery, but it's a 24 volt battery. If you're looking for a 12 volt sealed Gill for your airplane it's a 7035-28.

[A64Pilot]

Don’t put ANY battery in your airplane that can leak acid, because eventually it will, and battery acid isn’t kind to airframes.

An AGM can’t leak as the mat isn’t fully saturated.

[WAFI]

1 hour ago, A64Pilot said:

Don’t put ANY battery in your airplane that can leak acid, because eventually it will, and battery acid isn’t kind to airframes.

An AGM can’t leak as the mat isn’t fully saturated.

So your saying go with the Concorde RG-35AXC?

[LANCECASPER]

24 minutes ago, WAFI said:

So your saying go with the Concorde RG-35AXC?

Based on my experiences with both Gill and Concorde that would be my vote. If you do a “Concorde” search on Mooneyspace I think you’ll see why, although a few have had good success with Gill.

[GeeBee]

When I was a young man, I worked in a auto supply chain store. I noted when I stocked batteries how much heavier the pricier units were. You would pick up a Group 24 warrantied for 12 months easy. A Group 24,  36 month unit would require a "grunt". One day the rep from Exide was there (there are only 4 battery manufacturers in the US, everything is   "house" labeled. He explained to me weight is a measure of quality. A heavier battery has thicker plates which take longer to sulfate out, simply because there is more material. They are also more robust to abuse such as over charging as the plates are less likely to warp.

Fast forward to being on a San Diego layover in the early 2000's. The Navy Seals had an open house and they had the hatches open on their "go fast" pursuit boat. I noted the batteries were made by "Lifeline" and the guide explained they use the AGM batteries because they are robust, but more important, they will work under water and they can take a 30 cal round through them and still deliver power. Since then I have seen numerous drills put through AGMs as a test, and yes they still work. Soooo I bought AGMs for my boat. I noted that when I picked them up, they were really heavy, and I remember the words of the Exide rep.

About 10 years ago my grand daughter was playing at the helm of my boat. Unaware she had turn on the bilge pump, I discovered it 2 days later. Bilge pumps are connected to the hot bus, so I had a dead battery. Totally depleted. It was on it last year,  I decided to see if I could rescue it. I unleashed the charger on it, and yep, it over charged and exploded. Blew a hold between the case an top. Electrolyte leakage.....zero. Sold on AGMs

I have AGM in all my cars, diesel truck, boat, personal water craft and yes......the Mooney. 

[Guest]

If money were no issue, I’d get a battery made form Dilithium Crystals.  But alas we are airplane owners, so I’d go for the Concorde 35 series battery for the OP.

Clarence

[N201MKTurbo]

1 hour ago, M20Doc said:

If money were no issue, I’d get a battery made form Dilithium Crystals.  But alas we are airplane owners, so I’d go for the Concorde 35 series battery for the OP.

Clarence

If we had dilithyum crystal batteries, we could get rid of the engine and gas tanks. I'm sure they could develop a turboprop version of the warp drive for the front of the firewall.

[A64Pilot]

5 hours ago, WAFI said:

So your saying go with the Concorde RG-35AXC?

I’m not sure about the XC, I’ve run them both with success. I don’t have an XC in my C-140, but it’s a tiny engine and won’t ever go IFR.

However I’ve heard good things about the Gill sealed, I’ve not tried one myself, but the wet cell is junk, don’t even put one in your car (I had one leak in my Maule, very soon after having the aircraft recovered too.) Thank God it leaked out of the vent and only ruined the paint on the belly for about a foot.

I had a 660 AH bank of Lifelines on my sailboat for 6 years, we lived aboard and spent 6 to 8 months a year “on the hook” meaning no marina’s so everything ran off of the battery bank. Normal life span for a sailboat bank is three years and very often golf cart batteries are used as they are pretty tough, Trojan is a good brand, but the Lifeline is pretty much the premium battery, but you pay for it, but we are very, very reliant on our battery banks, failure in the middle of the Caribbean can kill a cruise.

Lifeline is made by Concorde, same as our aircraft batteries, and they are essentially identical in construction, they are a US company, and manufacture everything in the US in a plant in California, and I think recently opened a plant in Georgia, it’s a family owned business, if you look at the company phone roster, you’ll see the name Godfrey or maybe it’s Godwin? Point is it’s family owned and totally US, they don’t buy Chinese batteries and slap a sticker on them.

I don’t know where Gill’s are made.

On edit, just looked it up, Redlands Calif. Apparently parent company is Teledyne?

Gills are often the OEM battery because Gill gives them away to Aircraft manufacturers in order to be the OEM battery, because many pilots want the battery that the airplane came with. I know as I was a manufacturer.

Concorde won’t cut a sweet deal to OEM’s. I tried.

As long as there is a quality US option, I’ll pay a little more and buy US. I won’t buy junk though.

Edited February 6, 2022 by A64Pilot

[LANCECASPER]

8 minutes ago, A64Pilot said:

However I’ve heard good things about the Gill sealed, I’ve not tried one myself, but the wet cell is junk, don’t even put one in your car (I had one leak in my Maule, very soon after having the aircraft recovered too.) Thank God it leaked out of the vent and only ruined the paint on the belly for about a foot.

I needed a battery in the Spring of 2020 and Concordes were out of stock so I reluctantly* bought a Gill 7431 sealed battery for +/-$700. I too had heard that they were better than the other Gills.

(*Relunctantly since I had gone through numerous G243 Gills over the years. One day I asked a mechanic that I used if he had ever had any luck with Gills. He said, "Yes, if you count bad." Then he went on to tell me that he only uses Concordes. So I made the switch years ago and have been much more satisfied. I hated now buying the Gill 7243 and vowed that I wasn't going to tell anyone, since my friends knew how I felt about Gill batteries.)

One year and a few months later in Jun 2021 it didn't just fail the capacity test during annual, it was dead as a doornail. I was actually stupid enough to call in and talk to their warranty claims department. Since I was past the first twelve months they offered me a credit of less than $200 if I wanted to buy another 7431 Gill battery. Not a chance. She said "Well you could give the credit to someone else.". I told her that I wouldn't do that to any of my friends. Never again.

[A64Pilot]

 We shipped new aircraft with of course two new BIG Gills as turbines need a lot of battery to start.

Our dealer in Australia upon putting the aircraft back together put the batteries on a shelf and put in Concordes before delivery, he wouldn’t deliver an aircraft with a Gill.

I’ve heard good things about the Gill AGM, but just can’t bring myself to do that as my history with them has been so bad, and why do it as my history with Concorde has been so good.

If you have a battery problem, call Concorde, you’ll talk to a real Engineer who will talk you through a recovery procedure or whatever is needed.

Edited February 6, 2022 by A64Pilot

[Guest]

1 hour ago, LANCECASPER said:

I needed a battery in the Spring of 2020 and Concordes were out of stock so I reluctantly* bought a Gill 7431 sealed battery for +/-$700. I too had heard that they were better than the other Gills.

(*Relunctantly since I had gone through numerous G243 Gills over the years. One day I asked a mechanic that I used if he had ever had any luck with Gills. He said, "Yes, if you count bad." Then he went on to tell me that he only uses Concordes. So I made the switch years ago and have been much more satisfied. I hated now buying the Gill 7243 and vowed that I wasn't going to tell anyone, since my friends knew how I felt about Gill batteries.)

One year and a few months later in Jun 2021 it didn't just fail the capacity test during annual, it was dead as a doornail. I was actually stupid enough to call in and talk to their warranty claims department. Since I was past the first twelve months they offered me a credit of less than $200 if I wanted to buy another 7431 Gill battery. Not a chance. She said "Well you could give the credit to someone else.". I told her that I wouldn't do that to any of my friends. Never again.

“Friends don’t let friends buy Gill Batteries”.  It would be nice on a Tee shirt !

Clarence

[Guest]

13 hours ago, N201MKTurbo said:

If we had dilithyum crystal batteries, we could get rid of the engine and gas tanks. I'm sure they could develop a turboprop version of the warp drive for the front of the firewall.

No Mooney owner would buy a Dilithium Crystal version unless it would run LoP

Clarence

[carusoam]

Quick review…

Search for Gill and Champion…

The bad pireps go back a decade…

Gill has been purchased by TCM…

Then they started making sealed batteries…

At least three people have bought the new Gill sealed batteries… but, there is only two years of their pireps…

if you want a known battery that works for 5+ years… go Concorde.

Then get it a Batteryminder, specific to its type…

I was replacing gill batteries each two years for failing capacity tests…

Thats one every year for a long body…

and I tried the gill branded battery charger… with that…

Some companies take a really long time to rebuild a relationship…

when changing batteries be ready to check the WnB… and documents…

PP thoughts only…

-a-

 

[WAFI]

Well, I ended up replacing the battery with the same one that came with the plane when I purchased it.

Concorde RG-35AXC. 

Paid $404 for it, an Airparts was able to get it with in thirty minutes. Not Bad