G1000 and 55x

[NJMac]

I recall that there was a preference for the GFC 700 of course.   

But would I be happy with the stec 55x and a g1000?  Anything to be aware of for this setup? 

[StevenL757]

Just that your upgrade options are extremely limited...and expensive...should you eventually choose to step away from a rate-based autopilot to the GFC700 (which would pretty much be your only upgrade choice).  You don't want to know what the upgrade costs...trust me.

The G1000 hardware in these models is already well into aging, and is inferior to the G500TXi.  You'd be better-off looking at something vanilla and upgrading to the TXi and a couple of GTN navigators/FMSs with a GFC500.

[Niko182]

A 94 to 00 Ovation upgraded with a GFC500 with 4 servos, a 650xi, and a G3X will probably come out cheaper than a post 2004 O GX, and will have more capabilities as well. Features such as target trend, vnav, a digital autopilot with brushless servos, touchscreens, more useful load, and more.

Just my 2 cents.

[NJMac]

37 minutes ago, StevenL757 said:

  You'd be better-off looking at something vanilla and upgrading to the TXi and a couple of GTN navigators/FMSs with a GFC500.

I had resolve that too.  But it's getting so thin in options, I had considered settling for an Ovation with the g1000/55x Jimmy hasn't even emailed out to his list yet. 

Edited March 26, 2021 by NJMac

[Niko182]

5 minutes ago, NJMac said:

I had resolve that too.  But it's getting so thin in options, I had considered settling for an Ovation with the g1000/55x Jimmy hasn't even emailed out to his list yet. 

Theres an 310hp Eagle on trade a plane for sale. Once an eagle is converted to a screaming eagle, it doesnt really have any differences compared to an ovation other from the 30-xxxx serial number compared to the 29-xxxx serial numbers. The owner posted on here and even said his price was too high and he was open to offers. Thats where I'd look first. New engine, 750, 650, and a 55x. Overall a really good platform to start with.

Edited March 26, 2021 by Niko182

[NJMac]

Just now, Niko182 said:

Theres an 310hp Eagle on trade a plane for sale. Once an eagle is converted to a screaming eagle, it doesnt really have any differences than an ovation. The owner posted on here and even said his price was too high and he was open to offers. Thats where I'd look first. New engine, 750, 650, and a 55x. Overall a really good platform to start with.

I want a long body but really have my mind made up for KI TKS on my next plane.  Id love an SE but don't want to be the one to pay for the panel AND ice protection knowing this is a step towards a cabin class 6er. 

[MIm20c]

Waas?

[NJMac]

33 minutes ago, MIm20c said:

Waas?

Not currently but Jimmy mentioned maxwell could upgrade it 

[TGreen]

3 hours ago, NJMac said:

I recall that there was a preference for the GFC 700 of course.   

But would I be happy with the stec 55x and a g1000?  Anything to be aware of for this setup? 

That's my setup. Works great. Only real complaint is that it often does not capture the glideslope. Not a huge deal. I anticipate that and manage the glideslope in VS mode with small adjustments to power and descent rate. Don't have WAAS, but nonprecision GPS approaches get me low enough. Would love a digital autopilot but I can live with this forever. 

[GeeBee]

There are some advantages to the set up. Since it is a rate based autopilot, if you have an AHARs failure, and have to fly on the standby attitude, the autopilot still works. Some don't see that as a big deal, but I see it as a great safety feature. I wish Garmin would allow attitude switching for the GFC 700 so you have an autopilot if the primary AHARS fails.

That all said, according to Jonny the factory is looking at an NXi upgrade which would include a GFC700 autopilot for the STec airplanes. So personally, I would not hesitate to buy an Stec equipped G1000 unit because either the factory or Garmin is going to get it done at some point. 

 

 

 

[PaulM]

18 minutes ago, TGreen said:

 often does not capture the glideslope. 

Tgreen,

  Have you read through these threads?.. 

I have found that as long as you hit the sequence that I outlined that it always captures the GS.   Including all LNAV modes with guidance if you have WAAS. 

For just ILS capture, you must hit the APR button after the G1000 has switched to green needles, and that doesn't happen until the fix before the FAF.  Even if you have hit the APR button before, without the precision flag from the nav radio the 55X won't arm the GS mode. 

 

[StevenL757]

3 hours ago, NJMac said:

I want a long body but really have my mind made up for KI TKS on my next plane.  Id love an SE but don't want to be the one to pay for the panel AND ice protection knowing this is a step towards a cabin class 6er. 

Good call.

As you may know, it will cost you just north of $70k to equip an Ovation with a known-ice TKS system.  Let's say - hypothetically - you decide to do this, and then within a year, you decide to sell the plane.  You'll be lucky if the value-add for the TKS installation tops anything over $25-30k.  You immediately lose over half the money you'll put into it.  No joke.

So...I'd personally look for one with TKS installed.  Just my $0.02

[buddy]

I’ve been flying my 2005 M20R with the G1000 WAAS and Stec 55X for about 6 yrs. now and have NO regrets. As long as you understand the sequencing when using the 55X autopilot to shoot an approach you’ll have know problems.

[NJMac]

4 hours ago, GeeBee said:

There are some advantages to the set up. Since it is a rate based autopilot, if you have an AHARs failure, and have to fly on the standby attitude, the autopilot still works. Some don't see that as a big deal, but I see it as a great safety feature. I wish Garmin would allow attitude switching for the GFC 700 so you have an autopilot if the primary AHARS fails.

That all said, according to Jonny the factory is looking at an NXi upgrade which would include a GFC700 autopilot for the STec airplanes. So personally, I would not hesitate to buy an Stec equipped G1000 unit because either the factory or Garmin is going to get it done at some point. 

 

 

 

Good point about the failure mode. 

If the factory can get the nxi upgrade AND the 400lb gross weight increase both done, that would be fantastic value add to the existing fleet.  You have me thinking now. 

[M016576]

3 hours ago, StevenL757 said:

Good call.

As you may know, it will cost you just north of $70k to equip an Ovation with a known-ice TKS system.  Let's say - hypothetically - you decide to do this, and then within a year, you decide to sell the plane.  You'll be lucky if the value-add for the TKS installation tops anything over $25-30k.  You immediately lose over half the money you'll put into it.  No joke.

So...I'd personally look for one with TKS installed.  Just my $0.02

Demand signal is so high right now for de-iced aircraft right now....  if one was to have it installed, it’s probably the closest time to “break even” that one could pick..... still probably lose 20K “driving off the lot.”

 

then again, any avionics upgrade seems to be about the same (percentage wise anyway)

Edited March 27, 2021 by M016576

[Jeff_S]

I fly behind this configuration, upgraded to WAAS in 2015 when that became available.  It works fine.  It doesn't have all the nicest new features that the GFC700 provides, notably autopilot-controlled VNAV except on approaches, but it will get you where you're going and is reliable.  Genesys continues to sell and support the unit, and as noted above, it's quite likely that upgrade paths will be available.  It's too bad that Garmin and Mooney didn't work together to allow for an upgrade to the STEC-3100, but that's always still possible.

So if the right plane came up that worked for you in every other way, I wouldn't let this panel configuration be a show stopper.

[GeeBee]

It makes no sense for Garmin to work for an STEC-3100 upgrade when they can force Mooney to a GFC-700 upgrade and sell you a new NXi unit.

 

 

[Jeff_S]

3 hours ago, GeeBee said:

It makes no sense for Garmin to work for an STEC-3100 upgrade when they can force Mooney to a GFC-700 upgrade and sell you a new NXi unit.

 

 

Except that they haven't come forward with this offer.  I agree that it's all a business decision...I'm in the software business myself so I understand the trade-offs and the need to have demand to justify a development effort.  While in software anything is POSSIBLE, that doesn't mean its always PROFITABLE.  As I said, the system still works and as long at that big fan in front keeps spinning, all the fancy magenta lines and HITS boxes are about the same in various versions of the software and you'll get where you're going.

[RobertGary1]

I've flown G1000 systems with the KAP 140 autopilot. Just simply awful due to the lack of full integration. Like settings baro separate, not syncing the G1000 altitude bug. I'd guess you'd get the same silliness with a 55X

 

-Robert

[GeeBee]

1 hour ago, RobertGary1 said:

I've flown G1000 systems with the KAP 140 autopilot. Just simply awful due to the lack of full integration. Like settings baro separate, not syncing the G1000 altitude bug. I'd guess you'd get the same silliness with a 55X

 

-Robert

Nope. Rate based autopilot, single baro setting. Integration is quite good, down to auto switching of CDI etc. 

 

 

[RobertGary1]

40 minutes ago, GeeBee said:

Nope. Rate based autopilot, single baro setting. Integration is quite good, down to auto switching of CDI etc. 

 

 

Ah, the autoswitching was awful with the 140. On the inbound turn on the ILS hold the autopilot would kick back into roll mode. I had a lot of students who would just fly off into oblivion.