GNS 430W terrain database problem

[PT20J]

Anyone else seen this? Downloaded latest Garmin update and now the airport terrain data has an error. Tried it twice/

[MikeOH]

By twice I assume you mean that you loaded the terrain card twice from your computer.  If so, did you re download the file from Garmin twice, or just reloaded the data card from the same downloaded file?

Beyond that, do you have another terrain card to try?  I had my data cards fail and that is the kind of error I got before they just bricked the 430W.

FYI, I have installed this new revision with no problem.

[PT20J]

2 minutes ago, MikeOH said:

By twice I assume you mean that you loaded the terrain card twice from your computer.  If so, did you re download the file from Garmin twice, or just reloaded the data card from the same downloaded file?

Beyond that, do you have another terrain card to try?  I had my data cards fail and that is the kind of error I got before they just bricked the 430W.

FYI, I have installed this new revision with no problem.

Well, I’m not sure exactly how the “new” flyGarmin downloader works. I tried the only two options I saw which were to Update Expired Databases and Reinstall All Databases. 

Garmin tech support suggests trying the “older update method”.

Skip

[MikeOH]

Just now, PT20J said:

Well, I’m not sure exactly how the “new” flyGarmin downloader works. I tried the only two options I saw which were to Update Expired Databases and Reinstall All Databases. 

Garmin tech support suggests trying the “older update method”.

Skip

Yes, good point!  Due to an archaic home computer I've always used the 'older update method' which involves first downloading the actual database to the PC; then installing it onto the card as a second step.

[MikeOH]

Oh, and when I started having issues, the actual download and install to the card wen ok, including the verify step...but wouldn't work when I installed it into the 430W!  After two tries it bricked the 430W and the card would no longer load without errors.  I swear I did both cards in by carrying them in my wallet along with the RFID 'credit card' for the airport gate...I think swiping my wallet with the cards in it, did them in.  Many here swore that wasn't possible and that I damaged them with ESD.  SORRY, I don't buy that; if the cards were that sensitive then there would be all kinds of complaints.  Pretty certain Garmin put proper ESD protection on the connector pins, which are recessed.

[PJClark]

I held my breath and closed one eye for the update this morning.  First try with the card did not complete due to a "communication error".  Uh oh.  I removed everything, set it back up and then chose "reinstall databases".  Worked fine, worked in 430W.  Maybe dodged a bullet...

[Ragsf15e]

I loaded the new databases and haven’t had an issue.  The “new” method of loading them from Garmin is nice once you get it working, but doubt that will help your current issue.  
 

The “new” way has a small program loaded on your computer.  First you open an internet browser and login to the Garmin website, select update, then it will open the local program to download and transfer the data to the card in one step.  It’s not as seamless as Jepp, but it’s not bad.

[PT20J]

Reprogramming the old way didn’t fix it. Both new and old programming methods report success, but who knows what that really means? I’ll see what Garmin says, but I’m betting the card’s gone bad. 

[MooneyPoor]

Quite a few folks are reporting this as an issue. Hans Messing I believe on Facebook even ordered new cards which were corrupted during the process. There’s a real issue and hopefully garmin will take ownership soon. 

[MikeOH]

5 hours ago, MooneyPoor said:

Quite a few folks are reporting this as an issue. Hans Messing I believe on Facebook even ordered new cards which were corrupted during the process. There’s a real issue and hopefully garmin will take ownership soon. 

Just so we are clear, are you saying this is a NEW problem that has just occurred with the latest database revision?

[MikeOH]

11 hours ago, PT20J said:

Reprogramming the old way didn’t fix it. Both new and old programming methods report success, but who knows what that really means? I’ll see what Garmin says, but I’m betting the card’s gone bad. 

Sadly, I think so.  Same symptoms I had.

[squeaky.stow]

I think I will be holding off on updating my expired database update until I hear more. Fortunately I don't have to go anywhere.

FWIW I have found that Garmin is pretty responsive with their customer service line for DB issues. At least twice I have accidentally bumped my laptop and lost the USB connection during the upload to my card, resulting in an error message that I had already downloaded the update and could not do it again. In both cases I was able to reach a real person at Garmin very quickly and they reset my download permission.

If it is trashing the card, that's a much bigger problem. Please keep us posted on any resolutions. 

[carusoam]

Seeing if @KLudwick is cruising by...

-a-

[hmasing]

On 3/7/2021 at 11:37 AM, MikeOH said:

Just so we are clear, are you saying this is a NEW problem that has just occurred with the latest database revision?

Yes, that's what I'm saying (I'm "Hans Messing" from facebook :-D )

Latest update trashed two TAWS/Terrain cards - my old one and a brand new one.  Finally got a third brand new one to work and now I'm getting an "obstacle database integrity error" even though the update says it worked fine.

 

[PT20J]

@hmasing Hans, have you reported this to Garmin? I'm interested to see what they say. This must not be a widespread issue because I don't see a lot of reports on the web about it and Garmin support was stumped when I called them. After trying various programming methods, and verifying that the same problem occurs with the left NavData card removed (apparently sometimes a bad NavData card will cause Terrain database failures) Garmin support booted the problem to engineering and engineering believes it to be a bad Terrain card. I ordered a new one to try out.

Skip

[hmasing]

9 minutes ago, PT20J said:

@hmasing Hans, have you reported this to Garmin? I'm interested to see what they say. This must not be a widespread issue because I don't see a lot of reports on the web about it and Garmin support was stumped when I called them. After trying various programming methods, and verifying that the same problem occurs with the left NavData card removed (apparently sometimes a bad NavData card will cause Terrain database failures) Garmin support booted the problem to engineering and engineering believes it to be a bad Terrain card. I ordered a new one to try out.

Skip

I will call them when I can - early next week I hope.  The terrain card showing this is new, out of the box. :-/

[carusoam]

Something real is going on and spreading...

BT is showing something similar...

https://www.beechtalk.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=193248&p=2841227&hilit=Data+card#p2841227

-a-

[PT20J]

The errors don't seem to be consistent. And if there were a single issue, it would seem that Garmin would know about it by now as the update has been out for a while and there must be a lot of 430/530W units in the field.

Does anyone know if a new TAWS card comes loaded with databases or is it blank? It would be interesting to see what happens after inserting a new card without downloading an update first.

[PT20J]

55 minutes ago, hmasing said:

I will call them when I can - early next week I hope.  The terrain card showing this is new, out of the box. :-/

I get faster response with email: aviation.support@garmin.com

You might also reference my support ticket:  <<Reference ID:18854451K0 >> Re: GNS 430W Airport Terrain Database issue <Q#:1002106>

Skip

 

[MikeOH]

I wonder if this problem is dependent upon the software revision of the box itself.

My 430W bricked itself about a year ago and I had to send to Garmin for their flat-rate repair during which the system software was updated to the latest (at that time, of course); maybe that's why I haven't had the issue with this latest data card update??

Might be worth making sure your box is running the latest software.

[PT20J]

3 hours ago, MikeOH said:

I wonder if this problem is dependent upon the software revision of the box itself.

My 430W bricked itself about a year ago and I had to send to Garmin for their flat-rate repair during which the system software was updated to the latest (at that time, of course); maybe that's why I haven't had the issue with this latest data card update??

Might be worth making sure your box is running the latest software.

Interesting idea, but I had mine updated when I installed the GTX 345 (which gets it's GPS info from the 430W). I'm currently running GNS 430W main SW v5.40 and GPS v5.0 which I believe is the latest. 

Skip

[MikeOH]

13 minutes ago, PT20J said:

Interesting idea, but I had mine updated when I installed the GTX 345 (which gets it's GPS info from the 430W). I'm currently running GNS 430W main SW v5.40 and GPS v5.0 which I believe is the latest. 

Skip

Hmm, when did you install the GTX345?  Perhaps the problem is actually with the NEWEST version of the 430W box software. I'll have to go check, but it's possible my box was updated more than a year ago and is NOT the latest; I can't remember what version I'm running.  I'll check tomorrow. I'm not sure how often Garmin updates the box software.

 

Oh, and how do I find the box software version?  Do I have to hold down six buttons and scratch my head while turning on the 430W?

[PT20J]

Just now, MikeOH said:

Hmm, when did you install the GTX345?  Perhaps the problem is actually with the NEWEST version of the 430W box software. I'll have to go check, but it's possible my box was updated more than a year ago and is NOT the latest; I can't remember what version I'm running.  I'll check tomorrow. I'm not sure how often Garmin updates the box software.

The GTX 345 was installed and the GNS 430W updated in March 2018. Since the 430/530W is out of production, I imagine that Garmin would only update the software for a new critical bug. They're not going to add any features (unless it is to support some new piece of Garmin equipment).

Updates have been working fine until the last one. 

Skip

[MikeOH]

Ok, just checked and my 430W repair was October of 2019.  It will be interesting to see if I have a newer version than 5.4/5.0

[rbridges]

On 3/7/2021 at 1:25 PM, squeaky.stow said:

I think I will be holding off on updating my expired database update until I hear more. Fortunately I don't have to go anywhere.

FWIW I have found that Garmin is pretty responsive with their customer service line for DB issues. At least twice I have accidentally bumped my laptop and lost the USB connection during the upload to my card, resulting in an error message that I had already downloaded the update and could not do it again. In both cases I was able to reach a real person at Garmin very quickly and they reset my download permission.

If it is trashing the card, that's a much bigger problem. Please keep us posted on any resolutions. 

Same here. Just glitchy download and got same error. They were easy to reach and reset my cycle.