Clearence amendment and GTN750

[MooneyBob]

How would you do this on the GTN750?

ATC:

Amendment.

Cleared direct to SIE, then radial 017, join V1, CYN, direct destination ( KBLM).

I just looked in the sectional, followed the 017 radial of the SIE and there is actually intersection (ANABL) on the V1 that I put in the flight plan.

Any other way to do that?

[Vance Harral]

I'd probably just use OBS mode off SIE and CYN - an old-school navigator mode for an old-school clearance.  Looks like about 20nm between your turn points.  Even at 180 KTAS that's plenty of time to set up the next nav waypoint.

[kmyfm20s]

You either use the OBS button as Vance said or you have to create a user define waypoint. You can use RAD/RAD or RAD/DIST to create the waypoint. SIE 017 and CYN 226.

[Marauder]

I think you are using Garmin Pilot and FlightStream. You can also creat it in Pilot and transfer it over. You would load SIE then the user waypoint then V1 to CYN.

I got one of these recently as well.

V29 ENO V29 V229 PXT V16 COLIN DURGE

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[carusoam]

Did they give you SIE and CYN or did they say Sea Isle and Coyle?

Best regards,

-a-

[PTK]

Bob, what you did is the quickest. You could also create a radial/distance way point and enter that. But since it already exists why go through the trouble. They gave you 017 radial and asked you to join V1 precisely because it joins V1 at a published GPS waypointnt.

A nice thing the GTN does with user waypoints you create is put them in your recents so you can recall them easily by the find button as you enter the flight plan.

[Danb]

Most of above works nicely. Where I fly out of same as Chris we get ridiculous plans, one is still on flight aware from KilgTo Kdet about a dozen or so waypoints, but used to flying out of the philly area Iv just put in the first waypoint usually MXE and be prepared for a reroute always happens, then load it into the g 1000, this is where the iPad shines at the same time I load precisely the plan given to me by control and utilize it as what to expect for my next clearance ..since doing this the stress level has diminished tremendously ..I remember when we used to attempt this with paper charts all over the place in a panic...

[midlifeflyer]

Bob, what you did is the quickest. You could also create a radial/distance way point and enter that. But since it already exists why go through the trouble. They gave you 017 radial and asked you to join V1 precisely because it joins V1 at a published GPS waypointnt.

A nice thing the GTN does with user waypoints you create is put them in your recents so you can recall them easily by the find button as you enter the flight plan.

 

I agree. Assuming  there is no published join point, creating an intersection using radial/distance is an option but I think is more trouble than it's worth. Going direct SIE then switching to OBS mode and dialing in the 017 course will work just fine. You can then use the moving map or other aids to identify the join point.

 

If you want to have a waypoint to go to so that you can resume automatic sequencing when you get there, another option is to create the waypoint once you are the course to join. Just slide the moving map to where your OBS mode line joins the airway, tap and create a temporary user waypoint with only 2 taps, then insert it in your flight plan and make it the current Direct To. Turn off OBS mode and automatic sequencing will resume.

 

If it turns out your OBS mode course line heads to or even near a published intersection, easy enough to say, "Will direct ANABL work after SIE to join V1?" More likely than not, unless there is some traffic issue that precludes it, the answer will be yes.

[Marauder]

Most of above works nicely. Where I fly out of same as Chris we get ridiculous plans, one is still on flight aware from KilgTo Kdet about a dozen or so waypoints, but used to flying out of the philly area Iv just put in the first waypoint usually MXE and be prepared for a reroute always happens, then load it into the g 1000, this is where the iPad shines at the same time I load precisely the plan given to me by control and utilize it as what to expect for my next clearance ..since doing this the stress level has diminished tremendously ..I remember when we used to attempt this with paper charts all over the place in a panic...

Coming out of N57, like Dan, the usual clearance I get is direct MXE regardless of the direction of flight. I think it is to keep me out of the departure paths from Philly. In 99% of the cases, I never get to MXE. It is usually a radar vector or direct to a point on my flight plan.

As for the airway or radial to airway intercept, I agree it is more work to setup the waypoint than just to fly it. What I normally do depends on the intercept. If I am on the airway following the GPS headed towards the intercepting airway, I will tune the second VOR in and set the Aspen HSI to display one of the RMI needles so I can see which radial I'm crossing. Once I hit the airway radial, I will hit direct to the VOR. This overrides the flight plan but once I cross the VOR, the GPS flight plan is active again. With the Aspen MFD and Garmin Pilot both capable of showing airways, I know if I am on the airway.

Here is an example of the airways showing up on the Aspen MFD. too easy...

In some ways, I think GPS has made it more complicated than the old VOR to VOR way. Tune VOR 1 to your assigned airway or radial, track it. Set VOR 2 to the airway or radial to intercept. Needle centers up on VOR 2, turn... Sometimes technology does seem to take a set backwards.

Don't get me started on emails!

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[PTK]

I think you are using Garmin Pilot and FlightStream. You can also creat it in Pilot and transfer it over. You would load SIE then the user waypoint then V1 to CYN.

I got one of these recently as well.

V29 ENO V29 V229 PXT V16 COLIN DURGE

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

I agree. Assuming  there is no published join point, creating an intersection using radial/distance is an option but I think is more trouble than it's worth. Going direct SIE then switching to OBS mode and dialing in the 017 course will work just fine. You can then use the moving map or other aids to identify the join point.

 

If you want to have a waypoint to go to so that you can resume automatic sequencing when you get there, another option is to create the waypoint once you are the course to join. Just slide the moving map to where your OBS mode line joins the airway, tap and create a temporary user waypoint with only 2 taps, then insert it in your flight plan and make it the current Direct To. Turn off OBS mode and automatic sequencing will resume.

 

If it turns out your OBS mode course line heads to or even near a published intersection, easy enough to say, "Will direct ANABL work after SIE to join V1?" More likely than not, unless there is some traffic issue that precludes it, the answer will be yes.

 

Or simply OBS at SIE 017 radial to suspend sequencing, fly to and intercept V1 and then simply take it out of OBS. As long as CYN is the next waypoint in the flight plan it will resume sequence to it. If it's not next waypoint but further down need to activate the particular leg you want.

[PTK]

Chris, how about you just...uhmmm...concentrate on paying your...uhmmmmmm...anorexically challenged..."women," alright??!!

[midlifeflyer]

Or simply OBS at SIE 017 radial to suspend sequencing, fly to and intercept V1 and then simply take it out of OBS. As long as CYN is the next waypoint in the flight plan it will resume sequence to it. If it's not next waypoint but further down need to activate the particular leg you want.

Yep. That's what I meant in my first paragraph.

[flyboy0681]

I think you are using Garmin Pilot and FlightStream. You can also creat it in Pilot and transfer it over. You would load SIE then the user waypoint then V1 to CYN.

I got one of these recently as well.

V29 ENO V29 V229 PXT V16 COLIN DURGE

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

I attempted entering this using my Pilot just to get the experience and it returned an error stating "There is no single intersection between these two VORs" and it wouldn't create the waypoint. Were you successful?

[kmyfm20s]

I think you are using Garmin Pilot and FlightStream. You can also creat it in Pilot and transfer it over. You would load SIE then the user waypoint then V1 to CYN.

I got one of these recently as well.

V29 ENO V29 V229 PXT V16 COLIN DURGE

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Garmin pilot with the FS210 make it even easier! On the map page you rubber band the leg you want to add the new waypoint to the approximate spot you want it. When it gives you the waypoint selections you select user defined. Then select RAD/RAD and enter the proper radials. That way you don't have to leave the map screen. After checking to make sure it's correct then you send it to the GTN.

[Marauder]

I attempted entering this using my Pilot just to get the experience and it returned an error stating "There is no single intersection between these two VORs" and it wouldn't create the waypoint. Were you successful?

I have done this for other way points but you're right, it won't accept it. Hmmm.

[flyboy0681]

I have done this for other way points but you're right, it won't accept it. Hmmm.

 

Rubber banding seems to be the best viable solution and works well, the only issue I found with it is manipulating my finger to get the exact radial.

[wishboneash]

I use the GTN650 for entering & modifying all IFR plans (I don't have the FS210, so I can't upload a plan into the 650). If I get time, I will update the portable devices and other GPSs. I think this reduces confusion and makes you more proficient at using the primary GPS navigation device which is really key in what could be a high workload situation. The handheld device can still give you situational awareness or keep the approach charts loaded. So, in this case, using the OBS function is probably what I would do initially.

[kmyfm20s]

I attempted entering this using my Pilot just to get the experience and it returned an error stating "There is no single intersection between these two VORs" and it wouldn't create the waypoint. Were you successful?

That's weird! It works on my GTN trainer with those VOR's but not on G. Pilot. With all the other VOR's tried it on with G. Pilot it worked just great and it a technique I've used in the air before. I wonder if it not recognizing CYN as a domestic VOR?

[kmyfm20s]

Rubber banding seems to be the best viable solution and works well, the only issue I found with it is manipulating my finger to get the exact radial.

If you want it exact you just edit the waypoint with the radials.

[Marauder]

That's weird! It works on my GTN trainer with those VOR's but not on G. Pilot. With all the other VOR's tried it on with G. Pilot it worked just great and it a technique I've used in the air before. I wonder if it not recognizing CYN as a domestic VOR?

Something is screwed up in Pilot. I have seen some other little oddities from time to time with it. One that still plagues me is this one:

It started after the last update. Any of the couple of dozen stored flight plans I have will give me this error when I retrieve one for the flight plan and then hit "File & Brief". Their solution was to deleted all of my flight plans... Ain't going to do that unless I know I can retrieve them again.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[midlifeflyer]

I use the GTN650 for entering & modifying all IFR plans (I don't have the FS210, so I can't upload a plan into the 650). If I get time, I will update the portable devices and other GPSs. I think this reduces confusion and makes you more proficient at using the primary GPS navigation device which is really key in what could be a high workload situation. The handheld device can still give you situational awareness or keep the approach charts loaded. So, in this case, using the OBS function is probably what I would do initially.

I tend to agree. I've done it the other way but ultimately came to the conclusion that, while I might look where they are sending me to on my tablet first - just as I woukd do with a paper chart - the first data entry should be in my primary NAV.

[PTK]

My feeling is along similar lines. Learn to use your primary GPS nav/comm and unleash all that power. This is especially true with the GTN750. Learn to use it taking advantage of all that potential.

That's always, by definition, going to be the simplest way to operate.

The best use for a tablet may be to eliminate paper clutter and act as a reference.

I'm not sold on and strongly disagree with the notion of fiddling with a tablet to control the main GPS nav/comm!

[Marauder]

Since we are talking about clearances, I have noticed an interesting trend when it comes to what you filed using a tablet versus what they propose back versus what you actually get. The trend is that there is no trend!

Everytime I have used Garmin Pilot to file (I suspect the same is for ForeFlight), I get back a proposed route from supposedly ATC. If I accept this proposed route, it updates Pilot with this new route.

When I call get to my clearance, the actual clearance is not the one I originally filed nor is it the one they proposed. It is usually something different. I know a number of you have used fltpln. Have any of you filed with ForeFlight or Garmin Pilot used fltpln for the route planning and does what you see there match what you actually get?

Sometimes I feel like I am playing a game of "Whack a Mole"!

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[midlifeflyer]

Since we are talking about clearances, I have noticed an interesting trend when it comes to what you filed using a tablet versus what they propose back versus what you actually get. The trend is that there is no trend!

Everytime I have used Garmin Pilot to file (I suspect the same is for ForeFlight), I get back a proposed route from supposedly ATC. If I accept this proposed route, it updates Pilot with this new route.

When I call get to my clearance, the actual clearance is not the one I originally filed nor is it the one they proposed. It is usually something different. I know a number of you have used fltpln. Have any of you filed with ForeFlight or Garmin Pilot used fltpln for the route planning and does what you see there match what you actually get?

 

I do.

 

Here's what I think is the deal. The expected clearance is provided by ATC computers, whatever app or online source you use. The expected clearance from ForeFlight will be the same and the expected clearance from Pilot will be the same as...

 

Whether the expected clearance is what you filed depends of whether there are preferential routes (published or unpublished) that need to be applied and the airspace in which you traveling.

 

Whether the expected clearance is the same as what you get depends on traffic considerations at the time. So a lot of what you are seeing is because you are in Delaware, right in the middle of the busy NE corridor where TRACON rules.

 

To contrast, here in the Raleigh area, away from all that, I almost always get an expected clearance that is pretty much what I filed (I do use the "recent ATC routes" available in a lot of places) and am almost always cleared via my expected route. Doesn't mean I don't get changes or route amendments but they are the exception rather than the rule and they tend to be minor.

[flyboy0681]

Since we are talking about clearances, I have noticed an interesting trend when it comes to what you filed using a tablet versus what they propose back versus what you actually get. The trend is that there is no trend!

Everytime I have used Garmin Pilot to file (I suspect the same is for ForeFlight), I get back a proposed route from supposedly ATC. If I accept this proposed route, it updates Pilot with this new route.

When I call get to my clearance, the actual clearance is not the one I originally filed nor is it the one they proposed. It is usually something different. I know a number of you have used fltpln. Have any of you filed with ForeFlight or Garmin Pilot used fltpln for the route planning and does what you see there match what you actually get?

Sometimes I feel like I am playing a game of "Whack a Mole"!

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

This frustrates me as well and happens all the time.