IPAD on order

[Earl]

I just ordered the new 64GB 3g IPAD and am really looking forward to getting it (already sold out at the Apple stores in Atlanta).  I also participate in the Beechtalk forum and there is a very long thread about the ipad and the aviation apps available for it.  Very good reviews on the product there, including the gps function on the 3g version.  Only rub was some thought the glare in direct sunlight was a problem but other posters did not agree. 

It sounds to me like a combination of the ipad and a couple of apps (that cost $100 per year) and it can replace my chart and approachplates  on my 696 which will save me hundreds of dollars every year.  If I were Garmin I would start thinking long and hard about their subscription fees.  I can replace everything on the 696 with the ipad except XM weather.

Anyone here using it yet and what do you think?

[KSMooniac]

I'm anxiously observing from the sidelines currently.  I have a netbook/convertible tablet today that works great for the free NACO plates, so I ditched that subscription last year.  I use Air Charts atlases for charts and really like them.  I'm not interested in moving to e-charts because I don't want to worry about glare, battery life, etc. for something that is likely to be used all the time, but that is just me.  It is just hard to beat the Air Charts for cost and convenience IMO.

If I didn't already have my tablet, I would probably get the iPad 3G 64GB just like you.  For now, i want to see more PIREPs and more importantly see what kind of Android devices appear later this year before getting another device.  There seem to be a whole bunch of new devices in the class coming soon.

I wish we had an XM WX competitor out there...that is sorely needed.  I currently use a 496 for WX so I don't need something to interface with a tablet, but if there were a viable alternative that offered some cost savings I'd be all over it.

[Earl]

At least when you are on the ground you can get all the weather info you need on the ipad.  It's in the air that it falls short.  Will be interesting to see if XM comes up with and adapter to plug into the ipad with an app to display weather.  Like I said, I pay a ton of money to keep charts and plates updated on my 696 and this will totally replace that functionality.  I will post pix and video when I get it and use it.

[KSMooniac]

The cost to feed the 696 removed any desire for me to get one, especially since I already have a 496.  I have PFD wishes rattling around in my head too, and keep waffling between an Aspen and G500 solution.  I don't care to pay to feed an MFD at all since I'm already feeding two WAAS boxes and an MFD won't offer any additional benefits beyond "that's pretty cool."  If the GPS units didn't have any native maps, I would feel differently.

[Jeff_S]

Here's a PIREP on the 64Gbyte iPad 3G. I actually stood in line at the Perimeter Apple Store last Friday to get one (but only for about an hour) and finally got a chance to take it flying on Tuesday. I primarily use ForeFlight, which I've loved on the iPhone but can say that on the iPad is simply awesome.

I have all the charts/plates for the SE region states loaded into the device, so I don't need any connectivity to view them even at altitude. Of course cellular data connection craps out at about 3000', but I found the GPS to work well at my 5500' test altitude, and if it works there (with "No Service" indicated for cellular) there's no reason it shouldn't work at all altitudes. I also found the GPS to be much quicker to pick up than with the iPhone...perhaps with the added size of the iPad they can get an antenna that's more sensitive.

My intention is to use this as a chart/plate reader so no more paper for me. Of course, on the ground it's an awesome preflight and briefing tool. In the air, it will provide all normally paper charts, and since GPS seems to work well it will be an emergency backup if all my other panel gew-gaws crap out. It (currently) has nowhere near the full functionality of a real flight GPS like a 696/FlightCheetah etc., but I have all I need in the panel for normal situations so just an emergency, get-me-to-the-nearest-airport capability will suffice. I didn't have any problem with glare and it was a sunny late afternoon.

I'd be interested in what other apps are being discussed on the Beech forum besides ForeFlight. Based on past experience, I expect ForeFlight to keep adding significant functionality, but I image other apps will spring up as well.

[MB_M20F]

I also have an iPad on order and plan to test out ForeFlight. Stand by for PIREPs in a few weeks' time. M

[Earl]

Quote: Jeff_S

Here's a PIREP on the 64Gbyte iPad 3G. I actually stood in line at the Perimeter Apple Store last Friday to get one (but only for about an hour) and finally got a chance to take it flying on Tuesday. I primarily use ForeFlight, which I've loved on the iPhone but can say that on the iPad is simply awesome.

I have all the charts/plates for the SE region states loaded into the device, so I don't need any connectivity to view them even at altitude. Of course cellular data connection craps out at about 3000', but I found the GPS to work well at my 5500' test altitude, and if it works there (with "No Service" indicated for cellular) there's no reason it shouldn't work at all altitudes. I also found the GPS to be much quicker to pick up than with the iPhone...perhaps with the added size of the iPad they can get an antenna that's more sensitive.

My intention is to use this as a chart/plate reader so no more paper for me. Of course, on the ground it's an awesome preflight and briefing tool. In the air, it will provide all normally paper charts, and since GPS seems to work well it will be an emergency backup if all my other panel gew-gaws crap out. It (currently) has nowhere near the full functionality of a real flight GPS like a 696/FlightCheetah etc., but I have all I need in the panel for normal situations so just an emergency, get-me-to-the-nearest-airport capability will suffice. I didn't have any problem with glare and it was a sunny late afternoon.

I'd be interested in what other apps are being discussed on the Beech forum besides ForeFlight. Based on past experience, I expect ForeFlight to keep adding significant functionality, but I image other apps will spring up as well.

[LFOD]

I have the 3g version and I loaded Foreflight on it.  It is an absolutely outstanding setup in the air.  The GPS works well and having all of the charts available is great.  My outdated paper charts and approach books will remain well to the rear of the cargo area. Enjoy it when you get it.

[rob]

I bought, and subsequently returned, an iPad. I found it to be a waste of time. Was hopeful that it would be more useful, but I had trouble with it from the start - even things as simple as reading mail weren't working properly. I think this, like the iPhone, needs some time to mature...

[KSMooniac]

Here is a good blurb from AOPA about Fore Flight on the iPad:
http://www.aopa.org/flightplanning/articles/2010/100506ipad.html?WT.mc_id=100507epilot&WT.mc_sect=gan

 

[Earl]

Quote: rob

I bought, and subsequently returned, an iPad. I found it to be a waste of time. Was hopeful that it would be more useful, but I had trouble with it from the start - even things as simple as reading mail weren't working properly. I think this, like the iPhone, needs some time to mature...

[Jeff_S]

Quote: rob

I bought, and subsequently returned, an iPad. I found it to be a waste of time. Was hopeful that it would be more useful, but I had trouble with it from the start - even things as simple as reading mail weren't working properly. I think this, like the iPhone, needs some time to mature...

[fantom]

I don't think Rob was referring to the iPhone now, just an example of when it first came out.

There is an iPad in my future too.....just hate being another beta tester now, and the price will drop and the features are enhanced.

Fore Flight looks very interesting! Is there a handly list of othe iPad avaition apps, say from that Beechtalk forum?

 

[Immelman]

I went ahead and bought one a few weeks ago and its great. My only regret was not waiting for the one with GPS. Oh well.

For charts, try SkyChartsPro. $20 a year gets you all sectionals, TACs, en route low IFR, plates, and A/FD. Its basic but easy to use. I've been in touch with the author on a few things and he's a great and very talented guy who is continuing to imrpove it.

I bought 'good reader' for a buck and put ALL the FAA handbooks on there, all my maintenane manuals, etc - loads of PDFs.

I bought it primarily for the charts, but have found a whole bunch of other uses for it as well. About the only thing I really miss is java so that I can get a full wx briefing including some of the tools on ADDS, or skew T charts.

A handy free app is "pilotwhiz" which does a bunch of E6B stuff okay.. but what it does great is weight and balance. I spent some time setting it up for my airplane and it makes running different loading scenarios and then showing you where you are in the envelope trivial.

[rob]

I was referring to the original iPhone, not the current 3Gs one. Though I do wonder if the iPad battery will suffer the same fate as the iPhones, rapidly degrading to the point of not lasting an entire workday.

As far as specific problems I had with the iPad - I was victim to the Wifi glitch, I had frequently crashing Apps, including the mail app, which is embedded and written by apple. While some will claim that the iPad is not a data entry device (I disagree and would have utilized an external keyboard if I had kept it), I still expect that I can consume media, including email on it, without incident. Specific emails that were plain-text with a simple attachment (pdf or jpg) would crash the application repeatedly. The same email was not problematic on my iPhone. Apple denied that there was a problem even after witnessing it.

I also found the device to be too big. I encourage anyone who's thinking about buying one to go play with one. It needs to be about 1 - 1.5" smaller on both dimensions, then it would make sense to me. As it stands, it's big and heavy and cumbersome to use. All in all, it's not ready for prime time. The "office" applications aren't compatible with the industry standards, the wifi isn't compatible with the RFC, the Apps are not ready for primetime (even Foreflight was not fully functional last I checked)

My advice - wait a year. For the same money you'll get a slightly smaller, more efficient, and lighter device.

 

 

[DaV8or]

So you guys with the iPad, how are you securing/holding it in the cockpit? Does it strap to your knee like a kneeboard? Yoke mount? How do you power it, just battery or cigarette lighter?

[231Pilot]

My wife has a WiFi 64GB iPad.  It has no problem with mail, or apps.  Battery life is well over the advertised 10 hours.  I haven't used it for aviation....she knows she might not get it back;-)   I'll probably get one of the 3G versions in a few months, but I would always get 64GB or higher if they make one. 

 

Rob, was your crashing iPad a 64GB, a 32GB or a 16GB?  If it was one of the smaller ones (lesser GB) that might have had something to do with the crashes.  If not, you might have just gotten the one that needed to be replaced with warrenty/Apple Care.

 

If you are not a Mac user, I will advise any and all of you to buy the Apple Care extended warranty.  You will get better results with support if you have it.  I have, in the past 10 years, had 2 different Macs (one laptop and one iMac) that got new motherboards within a month of the 3 year Apple Care expiring.  No charge to me, made the cost of the Apple Care extended warranty a real bargain!  So far my wife and I have had 2 iMacs, 4 laptops, 2 iPods, 1 iPhone, and 1 iPad and only the two problems that were covered by extended warranty.  My experience has been good, and I will be getting an iPad for me and my flight bag.

 

Lew

[rob]

Mine was a 64GB Wifi version. While it may well have been the "bad apple" (pun intended) of the bunch, my experience with the folks at Apple (Saddle Creek Store in Memphis) was not a good one and the lack of useful applications for it made me not want to deal with an exchange anyway. I work in IT and have been using Apple products for 20+ years, even pre-Macintosh. They are what they are; often times, that's early to market with a lot of buzz - there are numerous examples of that going all the way back to the Newton. The iPad reminds me of that - a potentially good idea that's not quite ready to go. I'll revisit in a year when the platform is more mature and the apps more refined.

[Jeff_S]

I haven't had any of the crashes Rob describes either, but admittedly I'm not trying to be a "power user" with it. I really have no desire to use it for Mail (too bothered by that on my iPhone as it is!) and don't expect to use it for any document creation.  And it's true that Apple software often needs to go through a few versions before it start to stabilize, but also true that they're pretty good about doing that quickly.

As to the question of how I use it in the cockpit...I have always kept a separate, IAP-sized folder that I got when I was doing my IFR work. I would print out and slip in all the IAPs I would need for a trip so I wasn't thumbing through the real books. The iPad is only slightly larger than that, so it basically just sits in the passenger seat or on the shelf of the removed back-right seat so I can easily grab it to get any info I need.  I also seems to rest in my lap nicely if needed. I bought the Apple case for it which offers nice protection for the screen when not in use.

[231Pilot]

There are 'bad apples" out there.  I have been fortunate not to have one.

That said, I sure am glad I don't need one to fly my Mooney.

[Earl]

Quote: DaV8or

So you guys with the iPad, how are you securing/holding it in the cockpit? Does it strap to your knee like a kneeboard? Yoke mount? How do you power it, just battery or cigarette lighter?

[DaV8or]

So, to get the GPS you need to get the 3G version. Does that mean that you need to sign up for the AT&T service to make use of the GPS, or will it work without a subscription? It looks like you are into this device for this much:

iPad  64GB 3G  $830

Kneeboard       $150

ForeFlight         $75   (Annual)

AT&T??            $360  (Annual)

$1415 for the first year and then $435 a year after that. Does this sound right?

If I don't need AT&T, I might go for this, otherwise I think that's a deal breaker for me.

[KSMooniac]

I'd like to know that answer re: GPS/3G as well.  I already have a smart phone and data plan, but definitely want a functional GPS.  I would tether the iPad to my smart phone if I needed web access while out of WiFi coverage.  One nice thing about the 3G service, though, is that there is no contract required so you can turn it on or off each month if you wish...I could see that being handy when going on a long trip/vacation.

[Barry]

I have been looking into this, myself. I believe what I am going to do is buy a MyFi ( I believe that is what they call it) medallion from Sprint. The medallion does 4G/3G and WiFi. It is battery powered and runs for 8-10 hours per charge. I can turn it on, get a 3G/4G connection and Wifi ANYTHING to it.

What's nice about this is you don't need another service to pay for. At home, use the 4G (as fast as my DSL, maybe faster); on the road, I can use what every it can pickup ... and with the Wifi connectivity you are not committed to one device as you are when you are using wireless which is "built in".

4G is a little spotty now, but 3G is everywhere. 4G will be here in spades by next year ...

I've about 4 devices with "built in" wireless and it is driving me to the poor house. I believe this may be a better way to go.

PS - the size of the device is nice. I can carry it in a shirt pocket and you can barely see it. We have them at work and I've had a chance to use it ... very nice !!

 

[KSMooniac]

Barry, have you looked at the specs for the new Sprint EVO 4G?  It has a built-in hotspot capability and should be for sale in a month or so.  I'd rather have that instead of another device...