TKS stall strip fell off in flight

[Awful_Charlie]

Bother! One of mine has just done the disappearing act, and the replacement has a four week delivery time.  Anyone know if this grounds the aircraft for the duration, or is it ok to use? (Obviously avoiding intentional stall conditions!)

[wolftimj]

I've been flying around in my Bravo for about 4 months with one missing. Put a piece of duck tape over the tube so it doesn't get bent. Just got my replacement last week. Technically legal? Depends who you ask and surely you will get staunch supporters of both legal and illegal on this board. My trusted friend and MSC owner didn't think it was a big issue so I continued to fly, although I wouldn't take any Angel Flights or similar during that time period.

[Awful_Charlie]

Well, mine is in for annual now, and the part has been on order for a couple of weeks, so guess by the time the annual is done, the part should be available for a ferry flight over to a different shop to fit it.  My A&P was unhappy about any use without it, but he's happy to sign off a ferry permit for the 30 min flight over to Germany.  Still, that's a $732.44 bill I could do without just for the part!

[tpapilot]

Well, after the first flight of the year I found one of my stall strips missing. My A&P calling the manufacturer of the TKS system, they said that the part is three months out!! I don't want my bird out of commission for that period of time so I am going to try the aluminum block CNC'ed to the exact dimensions of the other strip and see if the repair is acceptable to the inspector. I bought my J with the TKS system already installed and I don't really need it for the flying that I do, It is test it at annual but that's about it.

 

Is there any additional info on the use of an aluminum piece machined for a stall strip? 

 

The part number for the new Ovation is the same as what is on my J so I would think that the part is more accessible for replacement 

[gjkirsch]

Even though your plane is technically not approved for flight into known icing, you have a very weather capable system that I would try and preserve.  The correct strip has micro holes in it to disperse the deicing fluid.  As far as flying without the strip, I have lost three over the years (you would think I would learn by now) and went the duct tape over the tube route while the part was on order.  I just did not use the system at all during those periods and avoided icing. 

[milotron]

Hi I am resurrecting this post to get confirmation on the alternate adhesive proposed. One of mine came off today and was hanging by the tube. Fortunately the TKS feeder tube is intact, and I am happy to see that my non-FIKI plane has these rather than the non-porous stall triggers.

 

https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/prosealant.php?clickkey=4275

 

Did this work? Anybody have experience it?

 

iain

[aviatoreb]

A few years ago I had my tks stall strip fall off in flight - fell off one day over Lake Michigan tumbling down from 17,000 ft - plunk down to the bottom of the lake.

[LANCECASPER]

13 hours ago, milotron said:

Hi I am resurrecting this post to get confirmation on the alternate adhesive proposed. One of mine came off today and was hanging by the tube. Fortunately the TKS feeder tube is intact, and I am happy to see that my non-FIKI plane has these rather than the non-porous stall triggers.

 

https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/appages/prosealant.php?clickkey=4275

 

Did this work? Anybody have experience it?

 

iain

Yes this is the stuff to use. I had a loose strip on an Encore with TKS and Dugosh used this to re-attach.

[milotron]

Thanks @LANCECASPER

Better luck with that stuff?  I ordered two tubes from AC.  I imagine that if one came off, another is not far behind.

My son sure panicked when he saw it. "dad a piece of the wing came off!"

 

I came back with reduced speed and made the slowest, smoothest, shortest landing I have ever done. I didn't know there was a little tube in the middle holding in place and thought that it was hanging from remaining glue. I didn't want to loose it in the ocean!

 

[LANCECASPER]

4 hours ago, milotron said:

Thanks @LANCECASPER

Better luck with that stuff?  I ordered two tubes from AC.  I imagine that if one came off, another is not far behind.

My son sure panicked when he saw it. "dad a piece of the wing came off!"

 

I came back with reduced speed and made the slowest, smoothest, shortest landing I have ever done. I didn't know there was a little tube in the middle holding in place and thought that it was hanging from remaining glue. I didn't want to loose it in the ocean!

 

Yes you don't want to lose it, I think it's $1500.

[M016576]

On 4/9/2015 at 9:44 AM, gjkirsch said:

As far as flying without the strip, I have lost three over the years (you would think I would learn by now) and went the duct tape over the tube route while the part was on order.  I just did not use the system at all during those periods and avoided icing. 

Two separate questions to ask ones self-

Question 1) will the plane fly almost identical to normal without the stall strip?

The answer is yes, so long as you don’t stall the wing. But the stall strip is a Mooney type certification requirement which causes stall to occur at the roots prior to the wing tips, improving controllability and response into a stall... which leads to the second question.

question 2) is it legal to fly without 1 or both stall strips?  The answer is definitely no.  *IF* your aircraft were to be ramp checked and the inspector noticed that one stall strip was missing and a tube covered in duct tape, you would certainly have some explaining to do.

 

The main issue with flying with a single stall strip missing is that you are decreasing your spin resistance.  Since one stall strip will cause stall at the wing root at the critical angle of attack, while the other wing will continue to fly, possibly until the point where the wingtip stalls (think control surface), you could be setting yourself up for trouble.  Certainly you’re now in the realm of a test pilot.  Which is not what flying certificated aircraft is about (unless you’re paid to be a test pilot by a manufacturer).

really though- would you notice much difference in the flight characteristics? No, not unless you took your plane up and stalled it with varying levels of rudder, power and angle of bank.  

But that doesn’t mean it’s legal to fly without it... because it isn’t.  Unless you’ve received a sign off for a ferry or a sign off from an IA (which I doubt they would give, since flying without the stall strip goes against the STC.)

think of it this way- if you damaged the leading edge of your wing (like ran into a post, or hit the leading edge with something That caused a 8” crease), would the plane fly differently?  The answer is- not appreciably.  So long as you stick to the middle of the flight envelope, you probably wouldn’t notice at all (ask me how I know sometime, hah!).  But just because it flys normally in the middle of the envelope, doesn’t mean the damage is irrelevant and that it’s legal to fly.

Edited May 28, 2019 by M016576

[StevenL757]

6 hours ago, LANCECASPER said:

Yes you don't want to lose it, I think it's $1500.

Exactly.  I came close to losing one last year, and make it a regular part of my preflight to check all four before climbing in.

[StevenL757]

11 hours ago, milotron said:

Thanks @LANCECASPER

Better luck with that stuff?  I ordered two tubes from AC.  I imagine that if one came off, another is not far behind.

My son sure panicked when he saw it. "dad a piece of the wing came off!"

I came back with reduced speed and made the slowest, smoothest, shortest landing I have ever done. I didn't know there was a little tube in the middle holding in place and thought that it was hanging from remaining glue. I didn't want to loose it in the ocean!

Yea, that stuff recently replaced the redux that was used by the factory prior.  One note...you want to be sure that your panel is completely dry when you mount the strip.  If you’ve run the system previously and have even so much as a drop of fluid in the way, the strip won’t stick.  We reattached one during annual last year and had to deal with this, so can share this frustration first-hand.

Certainly glad you didn’t lose it inflight.  During my annual THIS year, a TKS-equipped Acclaim was in the hangar next to me, and he’d recently lost one inflight, so again, if it isn’t part of your preflight routine to check all four stall triggers, add it.

Steve

[FoxMike]

Here is a tip to help keep the strips on your aircraft.  Up until a few years ago the glue Mooney was using would not stick real well.  I think a service bulletin advised to remove them and reglue with a replacement product.  If you have not done this it would be a good idea to look into it.  I have also found anyone helping push the airplane seems to place their hands on the stall triggers.  Ask your helpers not to touch the triggers which can loosen them.  

[milotron]

I went back to look at the plane. Two of the four triggers have different, slightly rubbery adhesive. The fourth has the harder stuff and was pretty much detached, not sure how it was still there. I'll take it off and re-glue the two of them.

 

Good advice to check before flight!

Edited May 30, 2019 by milotron
cuz I can't spell

[Flyphilly]

Does anyone know if there is a service bulletin that addresses gluing the actual stall strip back on, instead of the temporary one? Or is there information in the maintenance manual for this procedure? I am trying to confirm that the sealant to be used on the TKS strips is the same that is used on the temporary stall strips per the service bulletin - CS3204B2

 

 

[carusoam]

8 hours ago, Flyphilly said:

Does anyone know if there is a service bulletin that addresses gluing the actual stall strip back on, instead of the temporary one? Or is there information in the maintenance manual for this procedure? I am trying to confirm that the sealant to be used on the TKS strips is the same that is used on the temporary stall strips per the service bulletin - CS3204B2

 

 

Let’s leave a note for the the TKS people...  @CAV Ice @CAV Ice Protection

I’m sure there is a proper procedure for that...

Its not like these were from the 60s when documents were scarce...

Stand by...

We could also ask @M20Doc... (gluing a TKS strip back on)

It would be a bummer to find out stall strip glue is sensitive to TKS fluid...

Best regards,

-a-

[CAV Ice]

@FlyphillyPM me with your email address and I will send you a sealant cross reference list and installation procedures for the stall strip.