Need a new landing lifht

[Mooney1401]

Hello I have a 78 M20J and need to replace

A burnt out landing light. Can I get some help

On what to replace it with thinking LED but i

Know nothing about them in regards to size, brand

Or type. 

 

Thanks

[jetdriven]

The OEM bulb is a GE 4522 available from many sources.  The size is PAR 46, you have options with the LED, or HID.  I have read on BT that the LED is not as bright as the 4522, but it lasts forever. It is a simple drop in replacement and IIRC a log entry an owner can do himself.  The HID (we have one) is 750K candlepower, and lights up the runway markings from 2 miles out.  However, getting an A&P to consider it a minor mod and log entry install is difficult. The Boombeam is STC'd.     We went with the XeVision HID 50W.

There is tons of info on this site about this subject.

4522: http://www.randsstore.com/45fsms1.html

LED:    http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/elpages/whelen461l.php

XeVision HID: http://www.xevision.com/hid_aircraft_kits.html

BoomBeam HID: http://speedmods.com/Boom_Beam/boom_beam_AML.htm

 

[mulro767]

I replaced my GE bulb with a Whelen LED and will be switching back.  It really doesn't do much other than provide recognition.  At night it lights up my prop and about 20' in front of me.  I do not feel comofrtable landing at night with it.  My runway in Northern WI has numerous deer and other wildlife and 20' visibility and 70 KIAS scares me.  However, it's suppsed to last forever.

[Mooney1401]

Mulro767 thanks for the post that is good to know. Same to you jetdriven thanks for the links ! 

[mulro767]

Replacing your landing light on a J is a pain in the butt.  To me, the cost of the GE 4522 of $33 is nothing compared to the time and work of taking off both top and bottom cowlings and and replacing the light.  The lamp lasts roughly 25 hours.  So how often do you use the light?  I like to use it frequently even during daylight operations as it provides better anti-collision and visibilty.  For that reason I plan to just replace at every other oil change.  Rather than when it fails. 

[Seth]

That's too bad to hear.  I had heard good things about Whelen.  Anyone happy with their Whelen landing lights?

[Mooney1401]

Did not know I had to take the cowls off thought I could just go in from the front lens. Will read up on the procedure tonight and tackle it tomorrow. Took your advise and went with the GE

[jetdriven]

The GE 4522 is 290,000 candlepower.   

The XeVision 50W is 750,000 candlepower.  Boombeam is reputed to be the exact same hardware.  Vertical beam is 10 degrees instead of 12. Get it aimed right. If high you light up the house beyond the end of the runway in the flare.

The Teledyne Alphabeam PAR 46 LED landing light is 170,000 candlepower.

The Whelen is a PAR 36 bulb.  Too small. EDIT:  They do selll a PAR 46 bulb.  No candlepower published.

Here is the BT thread with the comparison photos from the incandescent bulb and a Whelen PAR 36.   the light does not nearly equal the incandescent bulb.

http://www.beechtalk.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=55199&hilit=led+landing+light&start=0

[omega708]

Quote: Seth

That's too bad to hear.  I had heard good things about Whelen.  Anyone happy with their Whelen landing lights?

[mulro767]

Quote: Mooney1401

Did not know I had to take the cowls off thought I could just go in from the front lens. Will read up on the procedure tonight and tackle it tomorrow. Took your advise and went with the GE

[jelswick]

Thank you Omega for your post as I was getting a little nervous!  I just replaced my regular whelen at annual with the Parmetheus LED and haven't used it at night yet, but was getting concerned about some of the earlier posts on satisfaction with LEDs.  What I am loving is having to remember not to shut it off after take-off knowing I can leave it on and that is just one more thing making me a least a little more visible to everyone else out there during flight as another added safety item.

[omega708]

No problem Jelswick.  I'd like to hear your opinion on the light when once you use it at night.

[Seth]

My Moony Missile has two landing lights on the lower cowling accesible through lense and retaining rings similar to Jim (but there are two lights!). 

I had a discussion brewing the last time my landing lights went out and had pretty much decided to go with the Par 36 LED Whelens - one taxi and one landing light.  However, I didn't, and simply replaced with regular bulbs for less than $20.  However, they are both out again, 70 flight hours later, and I'm thinking about going LED again.  Simply to not have to change, and properly "aim" the lights over an over may be worth the $450 on two LEDs.  Also, the price has slowly come down a bit.  I realize I don't have to remove the cowling, but it is still a pain that doens't have to be as much as an issue in the long run should I switch to LED).

I know Mulro is unappy with LED landing lights he installed and is switching back.  Is anyone else unhappy enough to change back?  Does anyone think I should put in two landing lights as opposed to one tax and one landing light.

I knew one landing light was dead, but the other one went kaput on Tuesday night during a night landing after flying through weather after an angel flight.  I can deal with the no light landing, but it's the no light taxi that you have to be very careful about, especially in rain.

-Seth

[omega708]

Seth,

You could always replace one of them with an LED to see how you like it and then replace the other later to keep from dropping double the $$ as the rest of us.

[Seth]

You know, I was thinking about that, but then I got worried as to the uneven draw on the circut and didn't want to creat other potnetial electrical problems.  Also, the heat from one lamp, would be bothersome.  Also, I don't want to open up the lighting area cover, to only replace one bulb instead of two, and then have to go through that process again. 

I figure if I go ahead and put in LEDs, I'll replace both. 

Does anyone see the price of the Par36 Whelen lights falling any more in the next year or so? Or if anything, do you see a price hike coming?  I know they have dropped a good $40 the past year or so (just from memory, didn't check, coudl be wrong).

-Seth

[jetdriven]

Seth, what do you mean "uneven draw on the circuit" and "potential electrical problmes"?   The LED's use a fraction of the current of an incandescent.  They drop right in.  I fail to see how that can cause any problem.

[Seth]

Bryion-

This may simply be my lack of understanding of an electrical current.  Let me clarify.  To have one LED and one regualar bulb at the same time setup next to each other; I'm worried about what what the different bulb draws would do to the circut.  Also, the heat of the usual bulb vs the lack of heat of an LED may have a negative impact on the LED light.

If I'm going to make the switch, it will be both, not one and then the other.  I can always fly with only one light in the plane, but if I have two sockets, I'm going to put two lights in.

I'm currently leaning toward to possibilites:

1.  Getting two regualr bulbs with the Q for Quartz that evidently last longer, and then figure out the LED issue next time, or;

2.  Getting one taxi and one landing light, for a total of 2 Par 36 Whelen LED units.

-Seth

[jetdriven]

Seth you are worried about nothing. They have independent circuits and one doesnt know what the other is doing.  The incandescent bulb should not output enough heat in a lateral direction to affect the LED bulb, if it does, then I wouldnt install an LED, too fragile. 

In your case, I would personally have an incandescent for raw visibility power for landing, and the LED for taxi and iin-flight lighting.  Then only use the incandescent for night landings.  I have the HID which can do both, but lately they are getting difficult to install. A&Ps call them major alterations and the associated paperwork issues.  There are tons of threads, but my mechanic saw it as a minor alteration therefore no 337, etc. 

Quote: Seth

Bryion-

This may simply be my lack of understanding of an electrical current.  Let me clarify.  To have one LED and one regualar bulb at the same time setup next to each other; I'm worried about what what the different bulb draws would do to the circut.  Also, the heat of the usual bulb vs the lack of heat of an LED may have a negative impact on the LED light.

If I'm going to make the switch, it will be both, not one and then the other.  I can always fly with only one light in the plane, but if I have two sockets, I'm going to put two lights in.

I'm currently leaning toward to possibilites:

1.  Getting two regualr bulbs with the Q for Quartz that evidently last longer, and then figure out the LED issue next time, or;

2.  Getting one taxi and one landing light, for a total of 2 Par 36 Whelen LED units.

-Seth

[Seth]

Bryon-

Do you have two separate swtiches to turn off one light vs the other?  My setup currently is one swtich for both lights.  Once circut.  It is a parallel circut so that if one landing light goes out, the other will stay on, as opposed to a series circut, like a chirsmast tree, where if one goes out, they all go out. 

I'm worried because of the mismatch in currnet/voltage/whatever power wise (don't remember from high school physics at this point)  I can't turn just one off.  So that would be two different types of bulbs requiring two different power levels/draws on the same paralell circut.  I remember that not being a good thing way back when studying cicrcuts.  I could again, be mistaken.  Also, then when I leave the tasxi light on, I'd have to leave the landing light on.

However, now might be a good time to upgrade the wiring, and install a taxi light swtich in addition to the landing light switch.  The negative . . . added expense.   That should be a small modification however, and potentially a good reason to install two different typs of lights.

Look for a separate thread in the near future with a poll as I'd like to see what other people have in their aircraft setup wise.

Also, to the original post author - Mooney 1401 - DId you get your question answered and did you make a decision on which light to purchase?  Sorry for slightly hijacking your thread.

-Seth

[David Mazer]

I have the Parmetheus LEDs also.  While I agree they are not as bright when both bulbs are burning, I have had too many instances where the GEs have burned out and I have nothing on final.  One slightly dimmer light is much better than one slightly brighter burned out light.  I also leave them on start to shutdown.

[1964-M20E]

I put eh Wheelen LED PAR46 landing light on mine and I'm happy with it.  Nice narrow spot throws a lot of light far.

[Seth]

The Par46 is bringter than the Par36.  More LEDs and more surface area.

 

[jetdriven]

 

Here is an interesting thread, a LoPresti rep saying a GE 4509 incandescent bulb  (PAR 36, 110,000 CP) is measured 400% brighter than a PAR 36 Parmetheus at 75 feet, and a Boom Beam HID is TWELVE TIMES brighter.   Of course, consider the source.   And they are talking about PAR 36. But good info.

Can someone post photos of incandescent, LED, and HID in use?

http://www.piperowner.org/forums/topic.html?id=150806

[jwilkins]

I replaced both the landing and taxi with Whelens and am happy with them on my '80 K, which has the two lamps side-by-side in the cowl.

They need to be aimed properly which is a tad time consuming but not technically challenging.

I did not need to remove the cowl, and would not want to (if I had a choice) as the aiming needs to be checked with the cowl on. On my K the two lamps are on one circuit, wired in parallel. There is absolutely no electrical reason to be concerned about installing one LED lamp which has a reduced current draw in a parallel circuit. You might want to clean up the terminals very well and use a little 3M dielectric grease to avoid future corrosion on the connections. If there is green corrosion on the terminals where the wire is crimped consider replacing the terminals and perhaps the wire, using the same gauge wire even though your LED lamp draw is lower. The circuit breaker is sized to the wire size, so you don't want to substitute a smaller gauge wire for the original size. 

Jim

 

[omega708]

After doing my night currency landings last night I have to confess that I still absolutely love my Whelen LED PAR46 landing light.  Coming in on short final I can see well past the boundaries of the 150' wide runway and probably 1/3 - 1/2 way down it's 7,000' length.  Of course as you get lower the distance that you can see drops, but it is nice to get that initial view to make sure that there aren't any of natures creatures down the runway or hanging out on the fringe...