Aspen Max Upgrade

[alextstone]

7 hours ago, Marauder said:

 

Based on your description, it sounds like the Max unit has a problem. Have you tried calling Aspen technical support directly? When my non-Max units were exchanged, my IA removed them, I drove them to the avionics shop and the avionics shop sent them in for conversion. When they were returned, the process was reversed. There was no calibration of the AHRS needed.

What other issues was the avionics shop working on?


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Actually it was assumed that the new unit was the problem once before and Aspen sent out a replacement.  The New-New unit exhibited the same issues.   I left a message for Aspen but I have not yet heard back.  My understanding is that there should be no special calibration needed but we went ahead and calibrated the AHRS (three times) because of the new RSM.

The other issues were unrelated to the Aspen.  (ADS-B transponder lost its GPS input and the JPI monitor needed GPS data connected to it).

[PTK]

12 hours ago, alextstone said:

I'm at a point that I am considering just selling the new unit and waiting until I can afford a more elegant solution, e.g. all Garmin panel. 

Is it possible to work it out with Aspen to cancel and return the new unit to them, keeping your old one? Their dealer should be able to assist you with this. It’s the least he can do since he can’t complete the install. Both Aspen and the dealer bear full responsibility. If they have any ethics and sense of responsibility towards their customers they should be able to see that you entered into this transaction in good faith but due to circumstances beyond your control things went south. If they don’t they may play the blame game by attempting to deflect responsibility giving you the runaround. If Aspen let’s you down like that it would be a major disappointment but I’d try and complete the install at this point and then sell it down the road when you can install Garmin. Thankfully there's Garmin and they’re not going anywhere!

[LANCECASPER]

39 minutes ago, alextstone said:

Actually it was assumed that the new unit was the problem once before and Aspen sent out a replacement.  The New-New unit exhibited the same issues.   I left a message for Aspen but I have not yet heard back.  My understanding is that there should be no special calibration needed but we went ahead and calibrated the AHRS (three times) because of the new RSM.

The other issues were unrelated to the Aspen.  (ADS-B transponder lost its GPS input and the JPI monitor needed GPS data connected to it).

It sounds like with all of the deferred maintenance that you've had to catch up on with your Bravo that the previous owner may have tried to cut corners. If he went with the low Aspen install bid you may very well have an installation issue not an Aspen issue. If the original installer did some kind of a non-standard install, that could be the problem. The MAX is expecting a previous standard install. For sure the shop you're using now is clueless. I would try to get to a shop that has extensive Aspen experience. It's likely that they will find the issue much more quickly than another shop with limited experience. 

[Cruiser]

sounds like it is a dealer/installer problem to solve and you let them off the hook.

[alextstone]

It sounds like with all of the deferred maintenance that you've had to catch up on with your Bravo that the previous owner may have tried to cut corners. If he went with the low Aspen install bid you may very well have an installation issue not an Aspen issue. If the original installer did some kind of a non-standard install, that could be the problem. The MAX is expecting a previous standard install. For sure the shop you're using now is clueless. I would try to get to a shop that has extensive Aspen experience. It's likely that they will find the issue much more quickly than another shop with limited experience. 

You're onto something there for sure.

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[alextstone]

sounds like it is a dealer/installer problem to solve and you let them off the hook.

If you saw how lost they were and then learned that their only "qualified" installer for seriously ill, I suspect your would have done the same. They have not been paid.

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[Cruiser]

one thing to consider is that just because it worked (before) does not mean it was wired correctly

[PTK]

43 minutes ago, alextstone said:

If you saw how lost they were and then learned that their only "qualified" installer for seriously ill, I suspect your would have done the same. They have not been paid.

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk
 

That’s a good thing you haven't paid them on top of all this.

[alextstone]

**UPDATE**  Aspen called me back first thing this morning.  David had very detailed notes as to their prior communications with the shop.  I was informed that they have seen this particular issue (the Aspen 1000 Pro / EA100 installation works fine with the old Aspen unit but there is an AHRS failure with the new MAX unit) 7 or 8 times.  They explained that when the original install was done, the installer may have not used the Ethernet cable Aspen supplies nor added additional shielding as per the installation instructions.  The new MAX units are more sensitive to this lack of shielding, etc.   I was given names of other shops to contact who may be able to help finish the job. 

Summary of relevant items to check:

1.  Ethernet cable should have the following printed on it:  CAT5-E MX100P-24.  

2.  Additional shielding as per the installation instructions.

3.  EA100 must have SW version 1.2 or later.

 

[rbridges]

at least you have a working non-MAX unit.  Unfortunately, any shop that's half decent is backlogged like crazy.  I hope the info that Aspen gave you points you in the right direction.

[tmo]

Rigging up a good ethernet cable shouldn't even need an avionics shop, this is probably the simplest solution you could have hoped for.

The EA-100 appears to be field upgradeable if your version is too low.

[Marauder]

**UPDATE**  Aspen called me back first thing this morning.  David had very detailed notes as to their prior communications with the shop.  I was informed that they have seen this particular issue (the Aspen 1000 Pro / EA100 installation works fine with the old Aspen unit but there is an AHRS failure with the new MAX unit) 7 or 8 times.  They explained that when the original install was done, the installer may have not used the Ethernet cable Aspen supplies nor added additional shielding as per the installation instructions.  The new MAX units are more sensitive to this lack of shielding, etc.   I was given names of other shops to contact who may be able to help finish the job. 
Summary of relevant items to check:
1.  Ethernet cable should have the following printed on it:  CAT5-E MX100P-24.  
2.  Additional shielding as per the installation instructions.
3.  EA100 must have SW version 1.2 or later.
 

Thanks for the follow-up. Much to Peter Garmin’s dismay, this wasn’t a failure of the Aspen as much as it was a failure of doing the installation correctly.

Hopefully the new shops will get you in quickly. You will love the new Max version. The display is so much crisper than the original unit. Add in the new features and an additional 2 year warranty, it was a sweet deal.


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[rbridges]

1 hour ago, Marauder said:

 

Thanks for the follow-up. Much to Peter Garmin’s dismay, this wasn’t a failure of the Aspen as much as it was a failure of doing the installation correctly.

Hopefully the new shops will get you in quickly. You will love the new Max version. The display is so much crisper than the original unit. Add in the new features and an additional 2 year warranty, it was a sweet deal.


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the guy yelling altitude through the headsets startled my wife on our last trip.  

[alextstone]

I just went back to the plane and to some previous notes I made while the installer was working on the MAX upgrade to verify that the EA100 SW version was indeed 1.2 or later.  Unfortunately, it is not, it is SW V1.1 (yes this was verified internally, not just on the original placard on the unit).  So, according to my conversation with Aspen today, the MAX will not communicate properly with the EA100, suspicious ethernet cable notwithstanding.  Hmph. 

I can't believe my bad luck with maintenance shops.  I called another dealer and left a message but I could not get through.   Anyone have a copy of the EA100 SW V1.2 laying around?    I'm not about to have the ethernet cable changed out until at least we test the system with the new MAX unit WITH the CORRECT SW version installed in the EA100.  

 

 

 

 

 

[LANCECASPER]

It's too bad that some people reacted negatively and bashed Aspen about this on this thread. When I was at Oshkosh last summer i found out that my Aspens were ready to be sent in for upgrading. I asked at the Aspen booth if there's anything else that my shop would need to do to install the upgraded units. They said they would need to run the audio wires and make sure that my EA-100 had software 1.2.

[Airways]

A guy at Beechtalk had the same problems. Turned out the shop didn’t use correct ethernet cables...

 

Here

[Marauder]

It's too bad that some people reacted negatively and bashed Aspen about this on this thread. When I was at Oshkosh last summer i found out that my Aspens were ready to be sent in for upgrading. I asked at the Aspen booth if there's anything else that my shop would need to do to install the upgraded units. They said they would need to run the audio wires and make sure that my EA-100 had software 1.2.

Personally, I am getting tired of reading the bashing from people who not only don’t own an Aspen product, don’t even own a glass system of any kind.

What people seem to forget that competition in this market place is an advantage for us consumers. Do you really think Aspen would have introduced the E5 if the G5 from Garmin hadn’t showed up? And why was the G5 introduced at all? To compete with the Aspen PFD.

As well, I think Avidyne has helped check what would have been a steady exorbitant price increase in the GPS navigator space.

As Mongo used to say: “Competition good, Monopoly bad”.


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[Marauder]

A guy at Beechtalk had the same problems. Turned out the shop didn’t use correct ethernet cables...
 

Thanks for posting this. As I mentioned in another thread, I have used a number of avionics shops over the years. What this video shows is what I have seen with shops that cut corners. Choose your avionics shop carefully...
As someone who works in the electronics industry, when a manufacturer specifies a requirement, it is because of our testing shows that environmental factors exist that may cause interference. That’s exactly what is happening here.

I’ve posted this video before, but here is a video of the squelch opening up on my Garmin GTN because of interference from the remote indicator on my JPI 900. Should I blame Garmin because they didn’t shield their box well enough or should JPI be blamed for producing a product that emits electronic noise?

The fix for the noise was a ferrite filter being installed on the remote indicator’s lead.




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[alextstone]

***UPDATE TO THE UPDATE***

I installed V1.2 on the EA100 tonight and as if by magic, the Aspen 1000 Pro MAX now works and the AHRS failure light extinguishes.  So, I've learned yet again that my "picker" where it comes to maintenance shops is broken.  The engineer at Aspen has been very responsive and helpful throughout the process, now on to installing Synthetic Vision, ADS-B, ground and flight testing!

Alex

[carusoam]

Great follow-up, Alex!

Good luck with the next steps.

Best regards,

-a-

[tmo]

@alextstone - thank you for the follow-up.  I expect to be faced with major avionics change decisions in the coming years, so every little bit of real world info helps.

A question - by "I installed" you actually mean that Aspen updates can indeed, at least for the most part, be installed by the user / in the field, without an avionics shop deemed by the vendor as worthy to not mess up?  To me it would be a major advantage.

I believe Avidyne updates for the IFDs are also distributed in a similar fashion, can anyone confirm?

[alextstone]

4 hours ago, tmo said:

A question - by "I installed" you actually mean that Aspen updates can indeed, at least for the most part, be installed by the user / in the field, without an avionics shop deemed by the vendor as worthy to not mess up?  To me it would be a major advantage.

Hi @tmo.  That is a very good question.  The short answer to your question is "no".  That must be done by a qualified A&P / IA (or under his or her supervision - that's your clue as to where the "I" comes from in my case).  I am currently working at a shop to gain the experience necessary to qualify for an A&P mechanics certificate.

[tmo]

Well, the answer sounds like a "yes" - unless the "qualified" part of "A&P/IA" has some excessively strict requirements.  If it just means an A&P/IA that is not afraid of a RS232 connection, then it's great.  If it means "got blessed by Aspen after performing a secret ritual" then it's not much different from Garmin.

[Marauder]

Well, the answer sounds like a "yes" - unless the "qualified" part of "A&P/IA" has some excessively strict requirements.  If it just means an A&P/IA that is not afraid of a RS232 connection, then it's great.  If it means "got blessed by Aspen after performing a secret ritual" then it's not much different from Garmin.

 

I don’t think any of the major manufacturers allow user installed firmware updates. Might have something to do with the STC or simply to provide the shops with a revenue stream. I seem to be paying a steady stream of $100 payments every time I go in for a firmware update. The only exceptions have been when the firmware update addresses an issue that affects the STC.

 

The only other exception has been JPI. In their case, they want the whole unit returned to conduct an update of the firmware.

 

 

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[tmo]

1 hour ago, Marauder said:

The only exception has been JPI. In their case, they want the whole unit returned to conduct an update of the firmware.

Which seems like a borderline retarded policy, but oh well.

I can understand the need for oversight of an A&P/IA for the updates, but not the need to go to an "authorized service center".  Guess I'm just oversimplifying things.