Engine Monitor Decision Poll

[jonhop]

Fellow MooneySpacers,

I'm looking to install an engine monitor and would like your input. Given this panel:

Would you put an EDM 900 in position A or

Would you put an EDM 930 in position B?

[Guitarmaster]

900 in "A". I really like having mine right in front of me.

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[Aerodon]

Jon, 

My choice is for the 900.  But if you locate it in position A, the buttons will need to be on top (unless you cut out the panel or use the flush mount).

I would move the #2 ILS indicator up, and put the EDM900 in the second row, more to the right, near the engine controls.  

I would also give serious thought to an EDM830 - its less expensive, and way less work to install.  Your analog instruments look good, and are all relatively easy to maintain and repair.

Don

 

 

Edited October 6, 2017 by Aerodon

[KSMooniac]

I'm a firm believer that engine instruments should be in front of the pilot. I prefer the landscape orientation for the 900 but could only do portrait with my current panel. Someday when I go to a PFD, I'll flush-mount the 900 in landscape, but for now, this configuration is great.

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[KSMooniac]

PS, buy your EDM from Don!

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[carusoam]

Best to have engine data where it can be scanned...

If it doesn't fit in front of your eyes, JPI has a remote mount map/rpm display (called a RAD?) that can also show a warning to look at the JPI for additional info...

Pp thoughts only,

-a-

[Marauder]

I compromised. 

[gsxrpilot]

You can save a few dollars now and go with the 830 or save a lot more later by just going 900 now.

[steingar]

Were I to spend that much money I think I'd want the box right in front of me.

[Bob_Belville]

EDM 930 above the co-pilot yoke. I have had this unit and layout for 5 years and think it reflects correct priorities.

The left panel is devoted to:

• attitude, (Aspen and backups)
• altitude, (Aspen and backup)
• air speed, (Aspen and backup)
• angle of attack, (CYA 100 and Aspen)
• horizontal/vertical flight path, (Aspen and backup)
• synthetic vision, (Aspen)
• traffic, (Aspen, GTN)
• weather, (Aspen, GTN and stormscope)
• JPI RAD for MAP/RPM/Alarms.

ISTM that none of those functions should be pushed out in favor of the EDM. (It's not about how much the EDM costs! The backup AI, altimeter, and ASI are cheap but more critical to safety.) 

At cruise, with STEC50 and GPSS taking care of most of the above, I study the EDM. 

[Andy95W]

22 minutes ago, Bob_Belville said:

The left panel is devoted to:

• attitude, (Aspen and backups)
• altitude, (Aspen and backup)
• air speed, (Aspen and backup)
• angle of attack, (CYA 100 and Aspen)
• horizontal/vertical flight path, (Aspen and backup)
• synthetic vision, (Aspen)
• weather, (GTN and stormscope)
• JPI RAD for MAP/RPM/Alarms.

ISTM that none of those functions should be pushed out in favor of the EDM.

+1

[Bob_Belville]

Re original post, position "A" would be perfect for a stormscope.

[Marauder]

52 minutes ago, Bob_Belville said:

EDM 930 above the co-pilot yoke. I have had this unit and layout for 5 years and think it reflects correct priorities.

The left panel is devoted to:

• attitude, (Aspen and backups)
• altitude, (Aspen and backup)
• air speed, (Aspen and backup)
• angle of attack, (CYA 100 and Aspen)
• horizontal/vertical flight path, (Aspen and backup)
• synthetic vision, (Aspen)
• weather, (GTN and stormscope)
• JPI RAD for MAP/RPM/Alarms.

ISTM that none of those functions should be pushed out in favor of the EDM.

At cruise, with STEC50 and GPSS taking care of most of the above, I study the EDM. 

Back in the 1960s, the approach was to place the engine gauges for our Mooneys on the right hand side. In the 1970s, more of the gauges ended up on a strip in front of the pilot. The MP/RPM & FP still remained on the right side.

With the modern engine monitors, all of these can be kept in one location. That said, Bob's installation required that when he mounted the monitor on the right side, he needed to install the RAD to give him some indication a parameter was out. The JPI 900 has that same requirement and although it is not required for my installation, I installed it. It is in the upper left hand corner of the picture. I even took it one step further and added the EI AV-17 that provides a verbal warning if a parameter goes out.

I personally like the monitor in the field of view. Whether it be for leaning, seeing how much fuel I have burned (now, new & improved with the CiES fuel senders) or just to watch temps. 

 

[MIm20c]

I like both options equally. However, I would not place the 900 over on the copilot side and most panels do not have the space for a 930 on the left like @LANCECASPER ‘s old plane. 

The 900’s $2k savings could buy a good amount of 100ll. 

[Aerodon]

Be aware of deal creep.  You start off wanting just a JPI, and end up with a complete panel makeover, or x2 with me. The wide panel below is for my Seneca, has an EDM960 in the second radio column.  I've also made a bezel to fit around the EDM960, so that it is the same width as the radios below.

The Cessna 172 panel started off with a vertically mounted EDM830 (I like the buttons on the bottom).  But then I dropped the OEM ammeter, which forced me into buying an EDM900.  I put the EDM900 above the pilots right knee, near the engine controls. The JPI engine warning light is below the clock.  The RHS 'blank space' is reserved for an iPad.

Anyone got an old Mooney panel for me to start experimenting with?  Or even better, someone with an auto cad file that the are prepared to share?

Aerodon

[Marauder]

Just now, Aerodon said:

Be aware of deal creep.  You start off wanting just a JPI, and end up with a complete panel makeover, or x2 with me. The wide panel below is for my Seneca, has an EDM960 in the second radio column.  I've also made a bezel to fit around the EDM960, so that it is the same width as the radios below.

The Cessna 172 panel started off with a vertically mounted EDM830 (I like the buttons on the bottom).  But then I dropped the OEM ammeter, which forced me into buying an EDM900.  I put the EDM900 above the pilots right knee, near the engine controls. The JPI engine warning light is below the clock.  The RHS 'blank space' is reserved for an iPad.

Anyone got an old Mooney panel for me to start experimenting with?  Or even better, someone with an auto cad file that the are prepared to share?

Aerodon

Addictive isn’t it Don?

[Aerodon]

18 hours ago, carusoam said:

Best to have engine data where it can be scanned...

If it doesn't fit in front of your eyes, JPI has a remote mount map/rpm display (called a RAD?) that can also show a warning to look at the JPI for additional info...

Pp thoughts only,

-a-

The EDM900 comes with a little LED that can indicate caution (yellow) or alarm (red).  I believe the remote digital display is an option now.

[carusoam]

I have a block of instruments in front of the pilot.  The block is similar to the M20C, with a better location...

• fuel level x 2
• Amps/Volts
• oilT
• oilP
• Single CHT 

It is about the size of a JPI900...

Don,  if you have an extra JPI900, I'll get more serious about checking its dimensions...

Best regards,

-a-

[Guitarmaster]

Love this location!

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[DaV8or]

I'm a total rebel. A misfit. I bought a Mooney, redid the panel and I didn't go with JPI. Then, I didn't put my engine monitor right in front of me, I put it at the far right side of the panel! Of course I do have a vintage Mooney with a vintage sized panel, which I  actually like better than the now standard 201 size panel! 

I really don't pay attention, do I? 

Funny thing is though, I'm so out of touch that for the last six years I have been absolutely satisfied with my panel design. I have zero regrets and wouldn't change my monitor's location if I were to do it over again. It really does work just fine over in the waste lands of the airplane panel. I do have big warning lights mounted right in front of me though, and they do work to get your attention! 

I vote "B" position and also suggest you check out the EI MVP-50. I love mine. Super easy to use and very intuitive. Ever wish you could talk to somebody on the phone when you had a problem that actually helped design the product? At EI you can.

Anyhow, here's what my backward ass self did-

 

[HRM]

I don't think you need it in front of you, especially if it is an EI MVP-50. The co-pilot is supposed to handle engine management 

[jonhop]

Hmmm... thanks for all the input. I have so much to consider now. Didn't think about moving the NAV 2 indicator or other things around or the extra space that will be eliminated.  I still like the idea of having the monitor in front of me. I'm not IFR now but can see how ridiculous the instrument scan would be if the engine gauges are primary for power and they are where they are now. Most of my IFR flying when it happens will be single pilot IFR. I'm sure I can train my wife to be a flight engineer but that is as far as she wants to go at the moment.

Thanks Much!

Jon

[jonhop]

On 10/5/2017 at 8:36 PM, Aerodon said:

Jon, 

My choice is for the 900.  But if you locate it in position A, the buttons will need to be on top (unless you cut out the panel or use the flush mount).

I would move the #2 ILS indicator up, and put the EDM900 in the second row, more to the right, near the engine controls.  

I would also give serious thought to an EDM830 - its less expensive, and way less work to install.  Your analog instruments look good, and are all relatively easy to maintain and repair.

Don

 

 

Don, @Aerodon

Thanks for the advice.. I made a paper template and believe the upside down layout would be acceptable and I think the landscape layout would be better for me visually. The only problem is that once the unit is configured for that mode, it has to be sent back to the factory if it needs to be changed. 

Regards,

Jon

Edited October 7, 2017 by jonhop

[MIm20c]

1 hour ago, jonhop said:

Don, @Aerodon

Thanks for the advice.. I made a paper template and believe the upside down layout would be acceptable and I think the landscape layout would be better for me visually. The only problem is that once the unit is configured for that mode, it has to be sent back to the factory if it needs to be changed. 

Regards,

Jon

You can change the layout (vert/horz) after the fact on the 900 unit without sending it back to the factory. 

[gsxrpilot]

41 minutes ago, MIm20c said:

You can change the layout (vert/horz) after the fact on the 900 unit without sending it back to the factory. 

Yes, but not if you set it to horizontal with the buttons along the top (upside down). It will work in that orientation, but will be stuck there on only the factory can un-stick it.