Do controllers want us to file IFR on good weather days?

[Danb]

Chris That's who I also was talking about just forgot where he started from

[slowflyin]

+1 for filing IFR for cross country.   If the weather is IMC I research the preferred routes and file accordingly.  If not,I file to a local fix on both ends and direct in between.   In addition, while VFR  I'll sometimes cancel if the controller is slammed AND I'm no where near all the action. 

[John Pleisse]

Yep, you can shoot approaches there. You just can't land there. They also are the approach controllers for Georgetown and other IFR capable airports in the area. I think they appreciate the activity from us. Can't be very exciting to see the occasional C5 or C117 show up.

Oh, absolutely... I love them...great controllers, but I didn't know you could shoot approaches...WOW. Now if they could do something about the poor RCO reception at KGED. At the 22 end of the field, they can't receive you or it is faint. I always get my clearance at the FBO and negotiate the void time.

[xrs135]

I'm an FAA controller and pilot. I can tell you that it totally depends on where you are in the country and each individual situation. An aircraft on an IFR flight plan just has more strict separation standards than a VFR aircraft, and odds are we will be talking to you a little bit more than a VFR aircraft. Workload-wise (IFR vs VFR) it honestly doesn't matter... it's just different. VFRs can be challenging in that you don't always know exactly where they are going and what they are doing. Whereas if an aircraft is IFR, you have total control of what the aircraft is doing and where it's going. The important thing is that we are TALKING TO YOU.

 

The biggest thing with small guys on IFR flight plans is that can often clog up the system a little bit just due to performance versus IFR jets. But that's just the way it is. I'll give you a couple examples...

 

If there is an arrival/departure into or out of one of our satellite airports, we have to reroute all of our high performance jet departures onto a totally different departure procedure that often sends them in the completely wrong direction - not the most efficient thing, but at least it gets you up and on your way. This is just to protect the airspace around the satellite airport, especially in the event of a missed approach. We HAVE to continue the weird departure procedures until we get word the little guy is on the ground, out of the way, OR if he cancels IFR. As somebody at RHV mentioned in an earlier post... sometimes satellite IFR departures can even shut down an entire airport such as SJC... and this is completely correct. It's not a bad thing, it just slows guys down momentarily in order to protect airspace. That's just the nature of the system.

 

Another example would be a little guy departing Reno IFR. All planes departing Reno IFR absolutely HAVE to be on a departure procedure or ODP due to the high terrain surrounding the airport. A small plane on the Reno7 departure off 16L is going to be tracking the localizer backcourse until climbing above the MVA which is 8,400-12,000ft depending on what direction you are going. So sometime this results in another IFR aircraft to have to sit on the ground awhile for entrail spacing. Again, that's just the nature of the system.

 

Really though, what it comes down to is that we are here to help you out no matter what it is you want to do. If you want to fly IFR, fly IFR. If you want to fly VFR, fly VFR. But my words of advice are to always, always, always have flight following or radar advisories. You are silly if you don't. If the controller is too busy, he will let you know, but most likely they won't be.

 

For me, if I want to fly somewhere IFR, especially departing out of a place like Reno. I depart VFR with advisories (if the conditions permit) and pick up the IFR in the air. This way nobody is delayed behind me, I can turn on course immediately, and everybody is happy. If there is even the slightest chance of encountering any IMC along my route of flight, I'll go IFR. But if it's CAVU everywhere, it's VFR flight following every time.

 

Hope this helps some people out. If you guys ever have any questions about anything ATC related, just let me know!

[RobertE]

Perfect.  Thanks.

[carusoam]

Way to go XRS!

Thank you for the lengthy detailed explanation as well.

Best regards,

-a-

[bonal]

As a VFR only that uses flight following whenever I fly for more than a quick half hour XC and the controllers always seem happy to have me in contact. Many of my trips work better if I am cleared through SFO bravo and once they have my contact and know my flight plan I am asked if I would like a bravo clearance before I can even request it. NorCal app Oakland center can get pretty busy and even though they are always accommodating. In fact all the controllers out here in the west have been great. It's nice to know that if I have a problem I'm already talking to some one that knows where I am. I notice xrs135 fly's a C, good man.

[M016576]

Just a couple of points: it's VMC and IMC, not VFR and IFR when referring to the wx. Different things.

If you are flying IFR and VMC conditions prevail, you still are required to visually scan for traffic in addition to your instrument scan. Just because you are IFR does NOT relieve you of your traffic scan and "see and avoid" duties. It doesn't happen often, but midairs have occurred between aircraft operating on IFR clearances.

It often surprises me how many pilots that prefer to be told where and how to fly by a controller, rather than choosing their own course, altitude and approach. Some of it is novelty, some of it is fear of being violated, and some of it is genuine safety concern.... But the traffic advisories can still be obtained by getting flight following.

Personally, I fly GA for 2 reasons: 1) the speed of transportation, and 2) the sense of freedom it brings (versus my day job, where I'm forced to fly IFR all the time, except when on mission). VFR is FAR more flexible in course and altitude and typically much faster than IFR flight in my Mooney. Normally 15-20 minutes faster where I fly- due to me being able to choose my own route rather than getting vectored all over.

I do file IFR in VMC when I fly into crowded or congested airspace (Bay area or seattle). I do this mainly for safety concerns like I mentioned above, but it drives me crazy being vectored all over the place to end up on a 15 mile straight in to Boeing field or Palo Alto so some jets or turboprops can get in/out.

If it's IMC, that's a different story- obviously I'm filing IFR then.

Still... Why give up your freedom to control your flight if you don't have to? And why add that extra 15 minutes to shoot an approach if it's VMC?

I'll make a last and final caveat- if you don't fly much in general (let's say less than 8 hours a month), but do hold an instrument rating, then it's probably best to fly IFR to the max extent possible in order to keep your proficiency at the highest level possible. It does cost you more in fuel to fly IFR, but the training time is worth it for you for when you really need it (ie IMC).

Finally... Recognize that you are the PIC. The controllers literally work for you; whether you are in a mooney, a F-18 or a 747. While they are doing their best to keep you safe, all the flying is your ultimate responsibility as PIC... And if things "go south", then you as the PIC will be held responsible as such.

With great power comes great responsibility!

Edit: XRS135 I just read your post- Excellent info. Here's a great reason to not fly vfr w/ flight following: no radar coverage in the area and at the altitudes you are cruising at. The good news is, though, that there tends to be very little traffic in those areas. Where I'm talking about is basically all of eastern Oregon below 11,000'msl and most of northern Nevada below 11,000'msl. Flying in the pacific north west has its quirks, that's for sure....

[jlunseth]

I virtually always file IFR.  The exception would be a flight where I know I am going to want to try different altitudes, because of cloud cover or weird winds aloft, or where I am probably going to let a passenger hand fly for awhile and can't tolerate the altitude and course restrictions.  My experience is probably colored by the fact that most of my flights are in the midwest and usually not very congested.  But filing IFR gives me the safety of traffic callouts, someone right there on the radio in the event of an emergency, and someone else watching out for pop-up TFR's.  I just don't have any trouble with it, and the times I get vectored around in the wrong direction to get out of the KMSP Bravo are no more than 1 out of 10.  I think many people avoid IFR just out of fear of having to stay on their toes talking to the controllers.  I do it all the time, and therefore don't find it very difficult.