Instrument Currency Requirements

[Robert C.]

Do you have a link to FAA guidance on that?  The FARs have been intentionally vague on what counts as an approach.

 

OK, found it.

 

In the June 2014 FAA Airman Knowledge Test Bank (instrument Rating)

 

97. PLT442 IRA

Enroute weather conditions are IMC. However, during the descent to your destination for an ILS 

approach, you encounter VMC weather conditions prior to reaching the initial approach fix. You know 

that to log the ILS approach toward instrument currency requirements,

A) the flight must remain on an IFR flight plan throughout the approach and landing.

the ILS approach can be credited only if you use a view-limiting device.

C) the ILS approach can be credited regardless of actual weather if you are issued an IFR clearance

 

We know that A and C are wrong, hence B is the correct answer (on the test at any rate).

 

i.e., you cannot log if you break before the fix unless you switch to a hood or foggles.

It leaves ambiguous what happens after the IAF and FAF so i answered rashly when  I stated you could log it if you broke out after the FAF. Sorry about that.

 

Robert

 

http://www.faa.gov/training_testing/testing/test_questions/media/ira.pdf

[1964-M20E]

Well let’s look at it from another angle. 

 

Ask the question could I have been flying the plane on the same path for any given segment of the approach or flight legally under VFR rules?  If the answer is NO then log the approach and or flight time.  At the end of the day it only matters to you.

 

Oh and one key thing the 1992 OPINION is just that an opinion no different than anyone here who has commented.  Furthermore, is that guy still there 1992 was a long time ago in a galaxy far far away?

[Hondo]

Here is what Rod Machado said about logging an IFR approach.

 

QUESTION #4

Hi Rod,

I have a question about logging IFR time and approaches. I'm on an IFR flight plan and part of it in true IMC (instrument meteorological conditions). I break out at 4,000 feet in VMC (visual meteorological conditions) flew the ILS approach in VMC conditions. Is that a loggable approach for instrument currency?

Thanks,
Terrance

ANSWER #4
Greetings Terrance :
In the May-June 1982 issue of Flight Forum , the FAA said, "...In order to log approaches toward IFR currency, the approaches must be carried at least through the so-called critical elements. This could include conducting the approach to a landing, to the minimum altitude and\or missed approach point, or through the approved missed approach procedure."

In regard to breaking out from IMC to VMC on the approach, here's what the FAA had to say in their July-August 1990 issue of Flight Forum . "...Once you have been cleared for and have initiated an instrument approach in IMC, you may log that approach for instrument currency, regardless of the altitude at which you break out of the clouds. When doing a simulated IFR approach you should fly the prescribed instrument approach procedure to DH or MDA to maximize the training benefit."

Since you didn't begin your approach in IMC, you can't log that approach towards meeting the instrument currency (recent flight experience) requirements.

 

[Bob - S50]

Here is my summary of what has been said, what I've read in part 61 and ignoring simulators (which is an option):

 

1.  In the last 6 months do a minimum of 6 approaches, practice intercepting and tracking courses (which I say you are doing if you are flying legs of an appoach), and holding.

 

2.  If you do not meet this requirement, go out under the hood with a safety observer in VMC and get what you are lacking.

 

3.  If you are non-current for 6 months, you have to get an IPC.

 

My plan:

 

Get ... 2 ... approaches every month.  That way if I miss a month or two I'll still meet the requirements.  I fly the first one to a missed approach and one turn in holding, then fly the second approach to a full stop.  Two approaches, tracking, and holding.  I prefer to do them at towered airports.  For my area that means OLM, TIW, BFI, RNT, BLI and PAE.  I'm not planning on landing at a military field or at SEA.  I try to go to a different airport every month until I rotate through the list.  I try to do one ILS and one RNAV.

 

Bob

[Hank]

Bob,

You may as well include military fields fir practice approaches. Some of them are different enough that you'll enjoy them. Just don't touch the ground . . . .

[Bob - S50]

Bob,

You may as well include military fields fir practice approaches. Some of them are different enough that you'll enjoy them. Just don't touch the ground . . . .

I might do that.  I prefer to do both approaches at the same airport for efficiency but I guess I could fly the first one to a missed at GRF or TCM then go to OLM or TIW for the landing.  Could also go to NUW then go to PAE.

 

Thanks for the suggestion.

 

Bob

[midlifeflyer]

Here is my summary of what has been said, what I've read in part 61 and ignoring simulators (which is an option):

 

1.  In the last 6 months do a minimum of 6 approaches, practice intercepting and tracking courses (which I say you are doing if you are flying legs of an appoach), and holding.

 

2.  If you do not meet this requirement, go out under the hood with a safety observer in VMC and get what you are lacking.

 

3.  If you are non-current for 6 months, you have to get an IPC.

 

My plan:

 

Get ... 2 ... approaches every month.  That way if I miss a month or two I'll still meet the requirements.  I fly the first one to a missed approach and one turn in holding, then fly the second approach to a full stop.  Two approaches, tracking, and holding.  I prefer to do them at towered airports.  For my area that means OLM, TIW, BFI, RNT, BLI and PAE.  I'm not planning on landing at a military field or at SEA.  I try to go to a different airport every month until I rotate through the list.  I try to do one ILS and one RNAV.

 

Bob

I like the plan. The only part I question is avoiding non-towered airports. If you do them in actual, they will be pretty quiet; if you do them with a safety pilot, well, traffic lookout is a big part of that job. And if, it's a general dislike of non-towered airports, you really need to get over that. Good chance your best deviation option some IFR cross country day when the bad weather is heading your way is going to be non-towered.

 

The other thing to consider including is proficiency exercises. How about, after the missed on the first (because the weather was too low) you decide to deviate. Although you may plan where in advance and in the real world you would probably do this in advance as soon as you were aware of the possibility of needing to go missed, make a point of not briefing the second airport approach until on the missed off the first one.

 

That's just an example. There's all sorts of stuff you can come up with to make currency flights do a bit more on the proficiency side.

[yvesg]

OK, found it.

 

In the June 2014 FAA Airman Knowledge Test Bank (instrument Rating)

the ILS approach can be credited only if you use a view-limiting device.

 

Robert

 

http://www.faa.gov/training_testing/testing/test_questions/media/ira.pdf

Can my baseball hat be considered a view-limiting device?

Yves

[Bob - S50]

I like the plan. The only part I question is avoiding non-towered airports. If you do them in actual, they will be pretty quiet; if you do them with a safety pilot, well, traffic lookout is a big part of that job. And if, it's a general dislike of non-towered airports, you really need to get over that. Good chance your best deviation option some IFR cross country day when the bad weather is heading your way is going to be non-towered.

 

The other thing to consider including is proficiency exercises. How about, after the missed on the first (because the weather was too low) you decide to deviate. Although you may plan where in advance and in the real world you would probably do this in advance as soon as you were aware of the possibility of needing to go missed, make a point of not briefing the second airport approach until on the missed off the first one.

 

That's just an example. There's all sorts of stuff you can come up with to make currency flights do a bit more on the proficiency side.

Thanks.  I have nothing against non-towered airports.  I'm based at one.  I don't mind going there at all when I'm VFR/VMC.  However, when I'm just practicing approaches I'm less likely to have to break off the approach (affecting my training) at a towered airport.  Not a problem when IFR/IMC because there shouldn't be any local traffic at the non-towered airport.  If I'm going to a non-towered airport as a destination I'll be flying the approach to get through the weather.  If I break out VMC high enough that there is local traffic I have no problem cancelling IFR and merging in with the local traffic.

 

Interesting idea about diverting.  I've had to do that in the real world several times.  When I'm choosing an alternate I look at what approaches are available so I'm already somewhat familiar with the approaches but obviously don't have them down in detail.

 

When I was going through pilot training and we had some slack time, one of my classmates (a future astronaut) and I would go grab some time in the old 'Link' trainer.  Whoever was sitting in the instructor seat would look through the approach plates, find the most difficult one he could find, position the Link 10 miles from the IAF, hand the approach to the other guy, turn on the motion, and tell them they were cleared for the approach.  Good training.

 

Bob

[mikefox]

There was an FAA legal counsel opinion in 1992 that suggested that instrument approaches should be conducted to MDA or DA to be used for currency.  It makes sense anyway, since the final few hundred feet can be the most challenging from the perspective of precise aircraft control.

 

I log all approaches but make sure that I have 6 to MDA or DA for currency.  Besides, that is a minimum - I usually prefer to fly several approaches each month to maintain proficiency - currency does not equal proficiency!!

[WardHolbrook]

Can my baseball hat be considered a view-limiting device?

Yves

Since you asked, yes they can - on turbojet aircraft.

[JohnB]

I make sure I do 6 approaches, holding and tracking on a simulator (or airplane) with an instructor 2x yearly at least every 6 months, which keeps me legal to fly IFR and I usually end up flying 1 IMC instrument approaches/ takeoffs monthly which also helps keep me proficient. Its also great to fly with other pilots, then you can pop your hood on and get another one in for practice.

 

I know this is somewhat off topic, but my favorite are the GCA / PAR approaches you can get at most military facilities. Their controllers like the practice and it is such a cool approach to do!

[jlunseth]

Text of a letter from FAA from 1992 published on the internet:.

...

For currency purposes, an instrument approach under Section 61.57(e)(1)(i) may be flown in either actual or simulated IFR conditions. Further, unless the instrument approach procedure must be abandoned for safety reasons, we believe the pilot must follow the instrument approach procedure to minimum descent altitude or decision height.

....

Donald P. Byrne

Assistant Chief Counsel

 

It really doesn't say the entire approach must be in IFR conditions, but you can't log it if you break it off early. At least that's how I interpret it.

Well, always read all the language a lawyer writes just exactly the way it is written.  This part of the letter says two things.  First, for currency purposes, an approach can be actual or simulated IFR.  Duh. 

 

Second, "..unless the instrument approach procedure must be abandoned for safety reasons, we believe the pilot must follow the instrument approach procedure to minimum descent altitude or decision height."  This says you need to fly down to MDA or DH, but it says absolutely nothing about the conditions, in other words, it does not say that you need to be in IMC down to MDA or DH for the approach to count, just that you need to fly to MDA or DH.  Why would it be important to fly the approach to MDA/DH even if you are in VMC?  Because in a real life approach the pilot must be prepared to go missed, even if the approach looks good, if something happens before the MDA/DH.

 

On some of the other comments, and on the issue of the ATP test question, I have read quite a bit of the stuff put out by the FAA and various authorities and self-styled authorities, and there is no good definition or rule on when to count an approach in actual.  I understand and can follow the logic of the guidance that you must be in IMC at some point after the IAF for the approach to count.  The logic is that if you are not in IMC after the IAF, then you were never in IMC while on the approach, only during the descent to the approach, so it does not count. 

 

That, of course, leaves the whole question of when a Vector to Final approach may count, since there may not be an IAF, only vectors, descent instructions, and a clearance sometime before the FAF.  Personally, I count those approaches if I am in IMC any time after receiving the "cleared for the approach" instruction, since that is the point when I am on the approach.

 

The ATP test question answer is not helpful.  Remember, those answers are a commercial vendor's suggested answers to the questions in the test bank, they are not FAA material.  And the FAA wants you to choose the best of the three choices, not necessarily the perfect choice. 

 

On the subject of proficiency v. currency, I tend to do quite alot of practice without a hood, in VMC.  Approaches, to my way of thinking, are mostly about the procedures and not skipping any steps.  If you get the sequence of steps right, you will get the approach right.  Of course its better to get continuing instruction, but for those for whom that is a monetary stretch, the VMC practice route works pretty well.

[kortopates]

IMHO, the whole point of FAA Chief Counsel letter is to advise pilots that are unable to use a safety pilot or CFI that starting an approach in IMC that quickly turns VMC well before minimums should not count for proficiency requirements. They really want you to put a hood on with a qualified pilot in the right seat so that you can fly the entire approach to minimums (land or fly the missed also under the hood); regardless if you are able to start the approach in IMC. 

 

Undeniably, anyone flying the approach without a hood and safety pilot is still getting great practice but of course its not adequate practice to then go fly an approach to minimums in IMC which is what the FAA is worried about making the point for. (And of course does not count towards currency requirements).

 

Unfortunately the same holds true for the pilot whom mostly relies on the autopilot to fly the approach and then find the autopilot is not working properly in IMC conditions. But that's another topic. 

[thinwing]

Ok..none of my three actual approaches to Nanaimo,whitehorse,dawson I flew last week counted.At the time,all three airports were reporting ifr conditions,enroute weather was imc for at least an hour on each leg onto IAF ,twice in icing conditions,all three were rnav gps approaches cleared by atc or tower.All three were visual (but under 3 mile vis)well before FaF...hmm...all I can say is all three required published approaches,airport lighting systems to complete landings.Dang..I was going to count those three approaches for currency!!Now all I got are the three under foggles under cloudless 90 degree skys done in Sacramento valley!Oh well .at least I can still count the 2 1/2 hours in the clag enroute as actual!...k

[larryb]

I've been counting the approach if I fly any part of the published approach in imc. But... I've been using a redbird td2 a lot lately. I have free access to one at one of my airports. I have found it very helpful and all of the approaches count for currency. I'm thinking a combination of real and simulated is very good for actual competency. The simulator is harder to fly than my plane is.

[flyboy0681]

The way I combat the currency issue is to fly the approach under the hood anytime I have a fellow pilot in the right seat. Thus far it's worked out well and I continually exceed the number of required approaches needed to satisfy the currency requirement. It also does a world of wonder for the skills set.

[Awqward]

Here is a scenario:

January 1st - 1 approach

February 1st - 1 approach

March 1 st - 1 approach

April 1st - 1 approach

May 1st - 1 approach

June 1st - 1 approach

July - no approach

I am current since I have 6 approaches in last 6 months.

But by August 1st I have only 5 approaches within last 6 months. So I am not current anymore even of I flew the approaches on regular basis?

Is better to wait until last minute and then do 6 approaches in one day to be current for next 6 months?

I am probably missing something because it doesn't make any sense.

By my understanding as of Aug 1st you only have FOUR approaches in the last 6 CALENDAR months....ie March to August....

[Hank]

The PREVIOUS six calendar months. August is not yet a previous month.

[Awqward]

Phew...that makes better sense