Seriously considering letting AOPA membership lapse

[aviatoreb]

Where's my hat?!!!  They sent a hat 6 years ago when I first signed up but I lost it - how come you guys keep getting hats?

 

That's it, I'm quitting!  Where's the love?

[DrBill]

When Phil Boyer was president, I was always interested in his town meetings and he would come to Charlotte about once every other year or so. I felt he REALLY wanted to hear what we had to say. When he left, so did the communication link. When the AOPA insurance quote was way more than the others, it was time for me to go. They really lost touch with us GA pilots. Perhaps that's what they wanted, to represent the Lear, Citation and other pilots more. Fine, then they dont need my money.

Maybe the new president will be better. Only time will tell and if he brings back the regional meetings and surveys, I'll return to the fold. I really like the magazine.

Bill

[Sable1]

Where's my hat?!!!  They sent a hat 6 years ago when I first signed up but I lost it - how come you guys keep getting hats?

 

That's it, I'm quitting!  Where's the love?

I was thinking the same thing.  I've been a member for about 12 years, never got a hat, flight bag, stationary., nothing!  And then I signed up for auto-renew a couple of years ago - sure I was going to win the sweepstakes plane with the extra entries, but that did not work out so well either.  I should have cancelled my membership there!

 

Like a lot of others, I'm also curious to see what the new guy does.  I don't feel that Craig Fuller did a whole lot in his time in office, hopefully Baker does better.

And maybe it's a visibility thing.  Maybe they need to do a better job of letting us know what they've actually been effective in accomplishing. 

But it does drive me nuts the amount of effort and expense they go through trying to squeeze more money from me.

[DrBill]

Oh the hats !... Those CHINESE made pieces of advertising.  You mean they could not find a US maker for these and some better quality?

  I'm also a HAM and the ONLY way to get free stuff from the ARRL (American Radio Relay League,.... similar to AOPA for ham ops) is to let your membership lapse and then the offers of free stuff flood in.  I dropped for 5 years or so and this year they offered me two free books worth $50 ea for a 2 year $74 membership.  I donated the books to my 501c3 club and voila the membership will be almost free.

I still have one of the original AOPA hats I got that were made in USA of good stuff.

 I think the ARRL gets donations from large radio corporations and that they are the big provider for that organization although I have no proof. They claim they represent the little guy but they supported a no Morse code Extra class when their membership supported a minimal code class. Obviously the no code classes bring in more hams who buy more equipment.  Guess who gets the benefit here?

Same with our medical. Given a DL class 3 equivalent, that means more pilots buying more airplanes.  That would make more $ for the manufacturers,  and dealers.  Probably the higher dollar supporters of AOPA.  They like the member numbers though so they can claim that they represent XX,000 pilots.

We'll see if AOPA follows the ARRL and entices me to return !!

BILL

[Dave Marten]

Pilots,

 

Here it come so put on your thick skin and pull your head out!

 

Who the heck do you think is fighting for GA (AND YOU) on the hill? What have YOU done to support GA? Does not a large portion of your own livelyhood depend upon a vibrant aviation economy? How many times have you personally engaged your elected representatives and/or organized community outreach in your area? I'm glad AOPA, working with other industry partners like AOPA and NBAA, is able to effectively represent us and take to the podium in my place.

 

For all you guys who will join an organization for the free hat you are sorely misguided and narrow-minded. I would much rather they spend my money effectively advocating and articulating issues and promoting aviation safety then give me a free hat.

 

User fees, increasing homeland security harassment, airport access, medical reform, a dwindling pilot population, and streamlining aircraft/avionics certification processes are all very real issues.

 

I am a pilot and always will be. I will pay my dues to the organization supporting my right to fly and I will always be actively engaged. Supporting like-minded aviation organizations is as essential as maintaining basic flight proficiency. I do NOT want to see the European GA system on our shores! 

 

Choice is yours, but when its time for me to fly west and they pull my wallet from my cold, dead body you can bet your ass that tucked behind my pilot's license will be a current EAA and AOPA membership card!

 

FLY ON!

[johnggreen]

Unfortunately, I have to agree with Dave.  However,  I'm going to take a deep breath and be a little more diplomatic even if I don't really want to.

 

Whether you like AOPA or disagree with "some" of their positions and efforts, folks, they are just about all we have. Admittedly, the EAA is a force as well, I just find them even more irritating than AOPA.  The one position of AOPA that really bothers me is the support for the big corporations to opt out of flight reporting, i.e.flightaware.

 

Basic AOPA membership cost $45 a year.  When I fire up the Aerostar, taxi out and climb out, I've spent $45 in fuel before I level off at 5,000'.  In your Mooney, you could probably climb to five thousand and fly what, 50 miles? PLEASE SOME IDIOT DON'T NIT PIC THOSE NUMBERS.  

 

The point is, they are the "most" effective GA advocate and the cost is NOTHING.

 

Like it or not, two things effect legislation of any kind; votes and money.  Politicians care about nothing else.  A voting bloc, any voting bloc, is the only way to have any say in what regulations and legislation are passed affecting GA.

 

I'll make an unusual comparison here.  Our local private golf club struggled for years financially.  There was always a significant number of members who opposed any reasonable increase in dues.  A ten year old idiot could count the numbers and see that, at some point, bankruptcy was imminent.  Did that stop them?  NO.  Some were quite "well to do".  They just wanted to bitch and put the burden on anyone but themselves.  The club went broke, of course, and those people were the first ones wringing their hands and asking why.

 

Two questions.  If you can't afford $45, what the hell are you doing pretending that you can afford an airplane?  You're just a broke ass "wanna be".  Secondly, if not AOPA, please tell me how you are going to make any difference in promoting or protecting GA?

 

I truly would love to hear a sensible response to those questions.

 

Jgreen

[fantom]

I truly would love to hear a sensible response to those questions.

Jgreen

John being diplomatic! What is the world coming to next we'll have dogs and cats living together.

I would be surprised if there are reasonable answers to the points you make. While there is much to take exception to with AOPA, and even more so with EAA, they are the only large organizations advocating for GA, which if anyone hasn't noticed, is in big trouble.

One of the major reasons little gets accomplished in DC is many people disagree on specific issues, stop supporting their team, create splinter groups, all to no ones advantage other than the media. Do we in GA want to do the same?

If not AOPA and EAA, then who? We burn more than their combined dues on a single morning flight to nowhere. Dropping membership is false economy IMHO.

[johnggreen]

OK I got spanked for starting a new line on this subject. And as a newbie to mooney space I guess I need to learn how you guys like to play. Just reading mooney flyer and I see where legislation has been introduced in congress to reduce the requirements on the 3rd class. What organization do you think may have been responsible for that. Oh and who do you think has been keeping the EPA and air resources board from eliminating our precious fuel. The way I see it if you don't like the way things are going you can take your jacks and go home or you can stay in the game and complain get involved and be a part for changing things. I'm sure most of you guys are not the quitting type and a lot have been advocates for change within AOPA and other pilot associations. I have great respect for pilots and have made friends with some in my area but hear is an observation I have made. It seems as a new pilot 4 years I have the enthusiasm of a young kid but I see a kind of jaded perspective of many of the long timers. Every one seems to agree That aviation needs lots of new blood but if you aren't willing to welcome that new blood then perhaps that is part of the problem. I speak mainly of pilots I have met and come to know personally.

I hope I haven't offended anyone cause I really like mooney space and I know I will learn lots from all of you.

 

On any site, there will always be those who are so obsessed with their opinions that they not only want to express them, they want to censor yours.  Start any thread you choose, with whatever opening question/opinion you wish.  The only right another member has to censor you is to simply ignore the thread.

 

When I suggested starting a forum on Bravos, several members objected.  Of course the forum became a popular place for Bravo owners and a very convenient place for them to look for information.  Some members are just pissed that I didn't get their permission first.

 

A pilot community is just like any other community.  After being a member of the pilot community for 53 years, since age 11, I recognize just how reflective it is of the population.  There is nothing special about pilots, IMO.  There are good, bad, smart, and stupid; arrogant, gracious, selfish, and generous.  If you adhere to every negative response, they will shut you out; which is exactly what they would like.  Then, there would only be room for their opinion.  

 

Post any question you like and ignore the trash that sits on the bottom.  And remember that the anonymity of this site, a bad thing, always attracts the coward, looking for a cheap shot.

 

Jgreen 

[N201MKTurbo]

A few points,

 

I will continue my AOPA membership. It is not that much money.

 

If you don't like the way it is run, get involved with AOPA and try to change it. It seems like they give plenty of opportunity to do that.

 

On another note from earlier in this thread; What elite person has the biggest personal airplane in the world and doesn't seem to mind using it frivolously without spending a penny of his own money to operate it?

[Marauder]

 

 

On another note from earlier in this thread; What elite person has the biggest personal airplane in the world and doesn't seem to mind using it frivolously without spending a penny of his own money to operate it?

 

Now that wins the award for the most tactful way of starting a political discussion. Well done.

[fantom]

Now that wins the award for the most tactful way of starting a political discussion. Well done.

What's political about Richard Branson?

[BigTex]

Was Richard in Hawaii as well?

[fantom]

Was Richard in Hawaii as well?

He may own Hawaii

[Sabremech]

Pilots,

 

Here it come so put on your thick skin and pull your head out!

 

Zero benefit to AOPA....really? Allow me to be blunt......Yours is the opinion of an ignorant fool.

 

Who the heck do you think is fighting for GA (AND YOU) on the hill? What have YOU done to support GA? Does not a large portion of your own livelyhood depend upon a vibrant aviation economy? How many times have you personally engaged your elected representatives and/or organized community outreach in your area? I'm glad AOPA, working with other industry partners like AOPA and NBAA, is able to effectively represent us and take to the podium in my place.

 

For all you guys who will join an organization for the free hat you are sorely misguided and narrow-minded. I would much rather they spend my money effectively advocating and articulating issues and promoting aviation safety then give me a free hat.

 

User fees, increasing homeland security harassment, airport access, medical reform, a dwindling pilot population, and streamlining aircraft/avionics certification processes are all very real issues.

 

I am a pilot and always will be. I will pay my dues to the organization supporting my right to fly and I will always be actively engaged. Supporting like-minded aviation organizations is as essential as maintaining basic flight proficiency. I do NOT want to see the European GA system on our shores! 

 

Choice is yours, but when its time for me to fly west and they pull my wallet from my cold, dead body you can bet your ass that tucked behind my pilot's license will be a current EAA and AOPA membership card!

 

FLY ON!

  Dave,

  It's usually the small things that will taint a persons feelings toward an organization. For me, it was applying for aircraft financing through AOPA and being told twice that my loan request was too small and to look elsewhere. I didn't see that anywhere in their advertising that there was a minimum loan amount required to get a loan. It sure seemed to me that they weren't about supporting all aspects of aviation, but only those aspects with the deep pockets.

  I felt at that time that they didn't care about the little guy, the guy looking for a $30K loan to buy a Cherokee or years later, the very Mooney that I now own no thanks to AOPA financing.  This is where AOPA failed me, this is where they lost me as a supporter. Maybe I'll change my mind some day, but for now I give my support to the EAA (who I feel represents the little guy) and the NBAA to be my voice in DC.

 David

[bonal]

_{Ok I'll give it one more try, just a little story. When I was a teenager my folks had friends that owned a Bonanza and that was my first experiance flying They had several aircraft over the years. any way}

_{one day he gave me an AOPA sticker that I put on my first car and I was always proud of that sticker because I knew what a great man this fellow was and how much I loved to go flying. this was back in the late 70's. but i never did anything to deserve it (not a pilot not an owner) well fast forward to 2009 i own my 150 and in 2010 I receive my PPL. the first thing I did was join AOPA I got that sticker and on the car it went only now it means something very special it's not about the organization it's about flying and aviation.}

_{Best wishes}

[Sabremech]

Edit.

[fantom]

Geez....I just checked and my AOPA membership needs to be renewed.

 

What to do....what to do

[scottfromiowa]

On any site, there will always be those who are so obsessed with their opinions that they not only want to express them, they want to censor yours.  Start any thread you choose, with whatever opening question/opinion you wish.  The only right another member has to censor you is to simply ignore the thread.

 

When I suggested starting a forum on Bravos, several members objected.  Of course the forum became a popular place for Bravo owners and a very convenient place for them to look for information.  Some members are just pissed that I didn't get their permission first.

 

A pilot community is just like any other community.  After being a member of the pilot community for 53 years, since age 11, I recognize just how reflective it is of the population.  There is nothing special about pilots, IMO.  There are good, bad, smart, and stupid; arrogant, gracious, selfish, and generous.  If you adhere to every negative response, they will shut you out; which is exactly what they would like.  Then, there would only be room for their opinion.  

 

Post any question you like and ignore the trash that sits on the bottom.  And remember that the anonymity of this site, a bad thing, always attracts the coward, looking for a cheap shot.

 

Jgreen

Autobiographical?

[scottfromiowa]

Hey Mooneyspace, can we have a topic header for Aerostars?

[scottfromiowa]

Even the bottom trash on occasion gets to ride on top in the truck...Wheeeee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Sabremech]

Unfortunately, I have to agree with Dave.  However,  I'm going to take a deep breath and be a little more diplomatic even if I don't really want to.

 

Whether you like AOPA or disagree with "some" of their positions and efforts, folks, they are just about all we have. Admittedly, the EAA is a force as well, I just find them even more irritating than AOPA.  The one position of AOPA that really bothers me is the support for the big corporations to opt out of flight reporting, i.e.flightaware.

 

Basic AOPA membership cost $45 a year.  When I fire up the Aerostar, taxi out and climb out, I've spent $45 in fuel before I level off at 5,000'.  In your Mooney, you could probably climb to five thousand and fly what, 50 miles? PLEASE SOME IDIOT DON'T NIT PIC THOSE NUMBERS.  

 

The point is, they are the "most" effective GA advocate and the cost is NOTHING.

 

Like it or not, two things effect legislation of any kind; votes and money.  Politicians care about nothing else.  A voting bloc, any voting bloc, is the only way to have any say in what regulations and legislation are passed affecting GA.

 

I'll make an unusual comparison here.  Our local private golf club struggled for years financially.  There was always a significant number of members who opposed any reasonable increase in dues.  A ten year old idiot could count the numbers and see that, at some point, bankruptcy was imminent.  Did that stop them?  NO.  Some were quite "well to do".  They just wanted to bitch and put the burden on anyone but themselves.  The club went broke, of course, and those people were the first ones wringing their hands and asking why.

 

Two questions.  If you can't afford $45, what the hell are you doing pretending that you can afford an airplane?  You're just a broke ass "wanna be".  Secondly, if not AOPA, please tell me how you are going to make any difference in promoting or protecting GA?

 

I truly would love to hear a sensible response to those questions.

 

Jgreen

Hi Jgreen,

I'll answer those two questions. It's not at all that I can't afford $45. I just spent $58 on Mooney S/B 202. It's about getting something tangible for that money. For me, it was about getting aircraft financing from who else than the group who advertises as the advocate for all things aviation. I was sadly disappointed not once, but twice. It wasn't from bad credit, but from the age of the aircraft and the amount requesting to be financed. I bet that if I was financing a $1.5 million P-51 and could make the payments, age wouldn't matter and it would be all about the money.

In regards to who to have promote GA, simple, I'm a member of EAA and NBAA.

 

[PMcClure]

I will be renewing my AOPA membership but will not renew my Flying magazine subscription. 

[quik flite]

I  started the discussion to get every ones opinion and see what everyone thought,  and every one is entitled to do what they want with their money . I am pretty sure, it is not the money or the hat , although I do think the hat thing was funny...It is the principal of it .  I just feel like occasionally, a message needs to be sent, that if all we get is talk and not much action , If I pay dues, they assume everything is O.K..    , Of all the things that were mentioned,  dwindling pilot population , medical reform, avionics certification, airport access ,unleaded avgas, are all things AOPA has been talking about for years, I just do not see much progress, I may be missing something.  It just seems almost like our government, to big and wasteful, and maybe to busy to look out for the people it was intended to look out for.       I did not support  most of them either.   Again, Thanks for all the responses.

[John Pleisse]

OOOOOooooooooooo........... don't want to lose my number:

 

 

 

John,

Our records indicate your membership has expired, and we have not yet received your renewal payment.

Because you are a valued member, we want to honor your loyalty and support by preserving your original membership number. But we can only guarantee it until 1/31/2014.

Please renew your membership now to retain your original number and remain on our membership roster.

Thank you for your continued support. We look forward to another great year together.

Sincerely,
Charles Lehman
AOPA Member Services

P.S. We don't want to lose you. Please renew now to ensure your original membership number, and we'll also send you an AOPA Pilot's Cap as our thank you gift!

 

 

[carusoam]

I sense you may be cleverly working the system!

Go free hat!