GTN-650 versus GTN-750

[Jsavage3]

I plan on one or the other...anyone with operational experience on both the GTN-650 and the GTN-750?  I would appreciate your feedback?

 

My panel space is limited, so I may be "stuck" with the -650...  Other than the spare KX-155, I really don't want to get rid of any equipment.

 

My panel picture is attached.

[jetdriven]

You can upgrade your audio panel to one with a built-in intercom, (or even better, the PS one with a COM in it)  slide the  COM 2 and autopilot down to right above the mixture, and put a GTN-750 in there

[Bennett]

I have them both, and the GTN 750 is far superior not only for the size of the display, but the interface is much easier to use. The 650 requires a split alphabet for entering waypoints, and entering VOR and ILS frequencies takes an extra step or two.  I am using the remote intercom (wonderful 3-D features for listening to two radios at once), the remote transponder, and remote box GDL 88 box for ADS-B in/out. This frees up panel space.  You would probably have to (want to) have new sheetmetal cut for the panel, but I think you will truly enjoy the GTN 750.

 

[Marauder]

I think the correct answer depends on your longer term plans, what you can interface with the hardware you have and how much you can afford. In my case, I was headed down the 750 path. What changed the situation for me was the fact I would have needed to upgrade one of my CDIs (both are ILS capable) to work with the 750. I also didn't have an HSI. So moving to an Aspen solved the HSI and CDI problem for me.

 

Based on what I see in your panel, I would try to see if a 750 with a remote audio panel will fit. I would remove the Sigtronics intercom, drop your AP controls down to that slot, move a KX-155 down, remove the second KX-155 and see how much space you will have. The remote audio panel can sit on top of the 750 (the screen is bigger than the electronics box). You may need to move the vacuum gauge and the rest of the items in the small sub panel at the top.

 

As a 650 owner, I am perfectly happy with the unit. Once you get your plan loaded, everything is ported over to the Aspens, so I spend little time looking at the 650 other than to change frequencies, modify the flight plan or load an approach.

 

One note on the remote audio panel. I believe if the 750 fails, the audio panel defaults to the other radio. Bennett can confirm this.

 

Here is my panel:

 

 

[chrisk]

I would suggest downloading the GTN simulator.  You can try it out as a 650 or 750.   As mentioned above, the 750 has a nicer interface in my opinion.  For me though, I could not justify the extra cost of the 750 (or pannel space) and ended up getting a 650. 

[Bennett]

Yes, in the event of the failure of the remote audio panel, radio two is fully functional.

[Oscar Avalle]

Try out the simulator. I liked the additional functionality of the 750 and went for it.

 

[Marauder]

I love every time I see your panel Oscar! Well done!

[rbridges]

I didn't realize the 750 would fit as high up in the center of the panel as it does.  I also didn't realize it had it's own audio panel built into it.  

[Marauder]

This gives a good look at how the 750 box is about the same size as the 650. There is enough room to put the remote audio panel on top on some Mooneys.

[Bennett]

I'm not sure about this, but I think the remote transponder, and the remote audio panel both will fit on top of the basic GTN 760 box. If the remote transponder is not there, I have no idea where the installer put it. For what it is worth, using these remote boxes bot only saves a good deal of panel space, but makes all the various functions easy to use, and to see what functions are in play.

[Marauder]

I'm not sure about this, but I think the remote transponder, and the remote audio panel both will fit on top of the basic GTN 760 box. If the remote transponder is not there, I have no idea where the installer put it. For what it is worth, using these remote boxes bot only saves a good deal of panel space, but makes all the various functions easy to use, and to see what functions are in play.

Good question. Looking on the Garmin site the combined height of the GMA35 and GTX33 look to be 4". Not sure there is that much space. One box is 11" deep the other around 8".

[Steve Dawson]

I have the GTN 750 with th remote audio and transponder. The transponder will fit in the area near the battery on the existing shelf and they were able to fit the audio above the 750. Make sure they put the unit high to enable the KX 155 below it.

I'd recomend the 750 over the 650. It has functions of an MFD showing a clear picture for situational awareness and easily gives more information without having to switch through screen pages as well as showing complete approach plates and geo referencing.

[Jsavage3]

What does the nav data base update subscription cost per month or year...?  What about the chart subscription cost for the 750?  How much does it cost to keep up-to-date?

[Bennett]

Too much.. Go to the Jeppesen website to find all the variations in plans and costs.

[larryb]

I have the 650. There are a few operational differences that you should be aware of:

 

1)  The 750 displays the default nav CDI on the Map page. In the 650 this is two separate pages.

 

2)  The 750 shows the NAV frequency all the time. The 650 does not. It can be important during an ILS or VOR approach to verify and identify your nav source. In the 650 you must press the knob to switch the display from com freq to nav freq. Sure, good proceedure will eliminate this issue, but it's one extra thing that needs to be done.

 

3)  The 750 can display your nav plates, the 650 cannot.

 

4)  If you get something like a GDL88 and want to display traffic and weather on the map, the 650 display gets awfully crowded fast.

 

I am happy with my 650, since I have a 796 right next to it in the panel for the "big" display. But as I've gotten to use the 650 for the last 150 hours, I have realized these shortcomings that I didn't totally appreciate when I made the choices.

 

Larry

[Oscar Avalle]

What does the nav data base update subscription cost per month or year...?  What about the chart subscription cost for the 750?  How much does it cost to keep up-to-date?

Use the subscription for the 795/796 instead. You can buy a 795/796 for the price of the software key for the 750. Jeppview plates for the 795 are much cheaper than the 750 subscription.

[Marauder]

What does the nav data base update subscription cost per month or year...? What about the chart subscription cost for the 750? How much does it cost to keep up-to-date?

Basic Nav package is $425 from Garmin or Jepp. If you want the complete Garmin PilotPak package (Nav, obstacle, terrain, base, SafeTaxi, charts) it is $862 for the Americas https://fly.garmin.com/fly-garmin/pilotpak/ $750 from Jepp BUT you are limited to 1 download per cyclem for the obstacle, terrain and SafeTaxi. As Bennett said, your first born child...

[Marauder]

I have the 650. There are a few operational differences that you should be aware of: 1) The 750 displays the default nav CDI on the Map page. In the 650 this is two separate pages. 2) The 750 shows the NAV frequency all the time. The 650 does not. It can be important during an ILS or VOR approach to verify and identify your nav source. In the 650 you must press the knob to switch the display from com freq to nav freq. Sure, good proceedure will eliminate this issue, but it's one extra thing that needs to be done. 3) The 750 can display your nav plates, the 650 cannot. 4) If you get something like a GDL88 and want to display traffic and weather on the map, the 650 display gets awfully crowded fast. I am happy with my 650, since I have a 796 right next to it in the panel for the "big" display. But as I've gotten to use the 650 for the last 150 hours, I have realized these shortcomings that I didn't totally appreciate when I made the choices. Larry

I have the 650 as well. If I did not add the Aspens, I would have went with the 750 for the reasons Larry stated.

[flyboy0681]

I have the GTN 750 with th remote audio and transponder. The transponder will fit in the area near the battery on the existing shelf and they were able to fit the audio above the 750. Make sure they put the unit high to enable the KX 155 below it.

I'd recomend the 750 over the 650. It has functions of an MFD showing a clear picture for situational awareness and easily gives more information without having to switch through screen pages as well as showing complete approach plates and geo referencing.

 

Steve, are you sure you have enough GPS receivers 

[Jsavage3]

My work provides me with an I-Pad which contains a complete & current set of Jepps and enroute charts...yes, on Company dime.  As such, I do not intend to pay for my own Jepps, so the charts capability of the 750 is really a mute point for me.  The traffic could eventually be displayed on my Aera-560, I think.  

 

I like the sounds the more-user-friendly 750, but panel space and difference in price are swaying me towards the 650.

 

Still evaluating though...

[Jsavage3]

GPSS question...  Will GPSS, installed along with this upgrade, work with my KAP-100 autopilot and my directional gyro (I do not have an HSI)?

 

My avionics man is not sure yet (he will find out tomorrow) and it being a holiday weekend, I thought I'd throw the question on here...

[Steve Dawson]

Steve, are you sure you have enough GPS receivers 

The Garmin 510 is for weather and extra enroute information (time to next waypoint, I love the rose compass display!-wish it was on the 750) and the AV8TOR was used with the Zaon for traffic display. (that didn't always work well)

And I hate getting lost, ha ha

[Marauder]

GPSS question... Will GPSS, installed along with this upgrade, work with my KAP-100 autopilot and my directional gyro (I do not have an HSI)? My avionics man is not sure yet (he will find out tomorrow) and it being a holiday weekend, I thought I'd throw the question on here...

Looks like you need a module: http://mooneyspace.com/topic/5761-gpss-steering-with-kap-100/

[Jsavage3]

I went with the 750 & remote audio panel, Icarus GPSS and the 60PSS.  No pictures yet as she's still down for the work, but will post them once they're available.

 

Can't wait to enjoy the goodies...