Looking for a pirep on KWYS

[Corvus]

Hey guys.

I am in the early stages of planning a flight up to west Yellowstone (KWYS) in my M20F in early July. Planning on just myself and the Girlfriend plus some basic baggage. We're planning on meeting friends who are driving up from the CA Bay Area. So being that I am looking at a potentially high DA (6650 MSL+ July) I plan on asking them to do the bulk of the camping gear transport. I am looking to see if anyone has any comments or input on taking the plane up there.

[231flyer]

Yellowstone NP is by far my favorite National Park in the lower 48 even though we have a place 15 minutes from Rocky Mountain NP.  We visit often and I have flown into all of the YNP trinity airports (KWYS, KCOD, KJAC).  Each airport has something unique to offer although KWYS has the most remote location and lack of development.  My friend's dad runs a dude ranch 10 minutes from the airport and she actually grew up in the area.  Nice airport with decent facilities including a mechanic.  Just make sure you book your rental car in advance and confirm before you arrive.  YNP gets real busy in July/August and rental cars are at a premium.  Not a lot near the airport so I assume you plan to drive into YNP and its host of facilities.  I highly recommend the Old Faithful lodge and the Lake Hotel.  Reservations are hard to come by so keep trying and hope you catch a cancellation.  Cody WY has the most facilities including several box motels, a Walmart, and a delightful Rodeo.  Jackson Hole has nice upscale lodges and hotels and a very vibrant apres-ski/apres-hike entertainment district.  KCOD is my preferred airport from KGNB but probably the least scenic of the three.  You should definitely plan flights to each of the airports regardless where you decide to base yourself.  YNP from the air is a breathtaking experience and should be on every pilots' bucket list.  

My 231 had no issues with the density altitude but you do need to be careful especially in a non-turbo a/c. ENJOY!!!!!  

[Corvus]

Thank you for the info, we plan on meeting those friends there, so ground transportation and accommodations are covered. Obviously a turbo Mooney is more in its element in those conditions, than my humble little F. It appears that the geography in the area doesn't provide too many immediate issues, which is part of what I was curious about if you have anything to report or watch out for in terms of mountainous terrain in the area.   

[carusoam]

Corvus,

Consider seeking out some training specific to mountain flying. Try searching on the topic, you may find some interesting threads that can point you in the right direction...

Best regards,

-a-

[kerry]

I would have more concerns when crossing the Sierras.  Not that I think you'll have any problems as long as your engine keeps running.  Lot of flat valley in SE Idaho and Western Wyoming.

[rahill]

West Yellowstone has one of the best airport campgrounds in the US.  Right on the airport, free hot showers, free firewood -- and inside the airport fencing so it doesn't have the same bear issues that other campgrounds in the area may have.

 

You'll be fine in an F.  We flew there in our J a few years ago and loved it.  The terrain is actually not threatening at all.  It is high, so density altitude is an issue, but the runway is long and there are no real mountains to worry about.

 

If you have time, some portions of the park are pretty cool to fly over - Grand Prismatic Spring was my favorite (see attached).  

 

Driving into the park is a bit lengthy but not bad, and the drive itself is pretty nice.  There can be traffic so don't be surprised to see that.  

 

Grand Teton is worth a visit too.  Surprisingly, even though they're right next to each other, Yellowstone is more of a "see it from your car" place (and if you get 1/2 mile off the road on any hiking trail you will be away from 90+% of the crowds) and Grand Teton is more of a hiking park.  

 

Rich

[RocketAviator]

I flew into the KWYS last summer in my Turbo Saratoga with my wife and two grand-kids a great airport... ok it was before I bought my Mooney Rocket!!!  A great single runway strip with GPS and ILS approach, great people.  Far lower cost fuel than say Jackson Hole!  Watch the winds when you get above the tree tops if you are not familiar with mountain flying or you & your passenger may get an unexpected thrill!!!  I just flew over it a few weeks ago again but it was closed as it is during the winter months FROM DEC 1 THROUGH MAY 31.  Definitively worth the time to fly over YNP but even better is to fly along the Grand Tetons in my opinion that is something that can only be seen from a plane and appreciate it's majestic appearance.    I plan to go back next summer and stay longer this time 2 days is not even close to long enough time in and around YNP!!!  I too give Two Thumbs up on the Old Faithful lodge and the Lake Hotel!  

Enjoy, fly safe.

[AmigOne]

I'm going from Oshkosh after the fly-in to Rapid City to Seattle (first time) in my 68 Ranger and will return to Virginia via the lower route (kind of I-10) which I have done a few times, never in the middle of summer though. The good advice is always "get some mountain flying training" but considering that I'm not planning to land on any 1500'long, 8000' high runways what specifically is recommend that I should train on?. I have seen many youtube videos on the subject, have Sparky Imeson book on mountain flying and I live next to the Appalachians, not the Rockies but they can be tough.

[rahill]

Just noticed that your F is based at KPAO.  We made the trip to KWYS from Palo Alto and, as others have said, by far the most threatening terrain is the Sierras.  Nevada is threatening in a bleak sort of way, but that's about it.  We stopped for fuel in Twin Falls, ID and then continued on to West Yellowstone.  You cross the Continental Divide south of West Yellowstone, but unless you're looking at a map, you won't notice it - it's not particularly mountainous there at all.

 

With 2 of you in the F, you should be well below gross unless you go crazy with camping gear.  

 

In addition to the showers and firewood, the campground also has bicycles for the trip into town.  However, if you're meeting friends with a car you won't need that.

[Corvus]

Great info everyone!

I greatly appreciate it, and now after hearing about it, am very much looking forward to it.
I was planning on getting some mountain instruction soon specific to airplanes. I was once upon a time a Helicopter CFI and took students up into the foothills outside of yosemite/ sequoia, and did a a lot of off airport landings on range tops and in valleys as part of thier commercial ratings, and "mountain time" is valued experience in the world of commercial helicopter work. So I am familiar(far from expert} with conditions unique to mountain flying. Thats obviously apples and oranges in terms of the equipment, and 3000 hrs ago...

Good spot rahill, 7753M is based out of KPAO. are you based there is well? I looked at your routing, and that looks to be like a good way to go. did you go direct over lake tahoe? or did you head north for a little ways? great photo of grand prismatic spring by the way

[rahill]

Yes, we're at KPAO (N201CD).  We flew over I-80 to Truckee and then more or less followed the V6 airway across NV (it pretty closely follows I-80 but is a little more direct than the freeway) to Elko (BQU VOR).  From Elko it's a straight shot to Twin Falls, ID.  After that, you can follow the wide Snake River valley towards KWYS.  

 

You will likely get some turbulence over NV unless you leave very early.  After Twin Falls there are a series of lava flows that result in surface heating (they're black!) and turbulence.  It's a pretty interesting area actually, a nice change from Nevada.

 

Our return route was more complicated - over the park to Jackson, WY (Grand Teton) then south to Heber, UT, then home (actually we flew to Lakeport, CA from Heber, UT for a LASAR event and then home after that - that was a long day).  All of this was with a family of 4 and camping gear.

 

Rich

[TTaylor]

Great info everyone!

I greatly appreciate it, and now after hearing about it, am very much looking forward to it.

I was planning on getting some mountain instruction soon specific to airplanes. I was once upon a time a Helicopter CFI and took students up into the foothills outside of yosemite/ sequoia, and did a a lot of off airport landings on range tops and in valleys as part of thier commercial ratings, and "mountain time" is valued experience in the world of commercial helicopter work. So I am familiar(far from expert} with conditions unique to mountain flying. Thats obviously apples and oranges in terms of the equipment, and 3000 hrs ago...

Good spot rahill, 7753M is based out of KPAO. are you based there is well? I looked at your routing, and that looks to be like a good way to go. did you go direct over lake tahoe? or did you head north for a little ways? great photo of grand prismatic spring by the way

I like crossing at I-50 at TVL for the better safety margin (only a few miles without an airport in reach) and then towards LOL (just enough to clear the restricted airspace if it is active) and then I would go toward PIH. Depends on if you want to stop for fuel or bladder break. BAM is not fancy but is fast at turning fuel (no food) and EKO has self-serv as well as full with a nice FBO at north end of the field. An other good fuel stop is 06U (Jackpot), good fuel prices and you can stop at the Casino for food. I am based at LGU and fly from Northern Utah to Central CA several times a year. Radar service is marginal below about 12K across most of Northern Nevada. Do not shy away from flying through the MOA's, just talk to the controlling center (Desert at Fallon and Clover at Salt Lake.