New Garmin auto-pilot for light sport/exp. Make u angry?

[scottfromiowa]

Just read article on new Garmin. Awesome, but not for certified aircraft...under 5aMU's. anyone else disgusted with certification process and inability for us certified plane owners to get reasonable prices for systems? The existing system for certification appears broken and we the tax payer are punished with antiquated and outrageous prices due to expense and liability of certification process. Enough already.

[co2bruce]

I couln't agree more. The current system is broken.

[AmigOne]

Enough already?? in all honesty what can we do to change this absurd situation where experimental aircraft using these same systems can legally fly in the IFR system.

[Mooneymite]

Sure, we can be mad, but it's wasted energy.  There are a lot of reasons the system will never change significantly.  I think we are all aware of the money forces at work.

 

The simple solution is to go to the dark side.  Dump that Mooney and get an experimental.

 

I have friends and neighbors that fly the same airways I do with that "dangerous" experimental stuff!

 

While a C-150 is "legal" to fly IFR with a 50 year old nav/com, that same C-150 equipped with state of the art portable WAAS GPS, iPad display of ADS-B weather and traffic is "illegal".  Rules is rules!

 

When it comes time to replace my certified aircraft with something else...it will not be a certified something else.

[David Mazer]

Despite all the correct things you have all said, certified airplanes still have a dramatically better safety record.  I don't believe for a minute that using state of the art electronics only available in exp airplanes has anything do with that (seemingly to be counter intuitive) but there are factors that make certified safer.  I fly both and I can tell you that exp airplanes aren't always designed, built, or maintained to the same standards as certified.  The biggest problem is knowing which exp are designed, built, and maintained properly and which aren't.  At least to a larger degree than with certified.  Even my own exp (bought already built) had numerous, dangerous, flaws that only came out in flight.

[Mooneymite]

Despite all the correct things you have all said, certified airplanes still have a dramatically better safety record.  I don't believe for a minute that using state of the art electronics only available in exp airplanes has anything do with that (seemingly to be counter intuitive) but there are factors that make certified safer.  I fly both and I can tell you that exp airplanes aren't always designed, built, or maintained to the same standards as certified.  The biggest problem is knowing which exp are designed, built, and maintained properly and which aren't.  At least to a larger degree than with certified.  Even my own exp (bought already built) had numerous, dangerous, flaws that only came out in flight.

.

 

 

I agree with you, the statistics are what they are.

 

I own both a Mooney and an experimental and live on "both sides".  To me it is humorous that the Ford alternator on my Mooney with PMA tag costs $800+ while the Ford alternator on my RV cost only $40....same exact alternator except for the tag.  Which one is "safer"?  $600 to rebuild a 1950's design Dukes electric fuel pump on my Mooney, or $85 for a new state-of-the-art electric fuel pump for the experimental.  Which is "safer"?

 

No doubt about it, the experimental world does not have so many safety nets as the certified world, but that's what we're complaining about, right?  Each of those nets adds cost and confusion.  I think the intent of the OP was to question the value of those certification "safety" nets.

 

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[M016576]

Just read article on new Garmin. Awesome, but not for certified aircraft...under 5aMU's. anyone else disgusted with certification process and inability for us certified plane owners to get reasonable prices for systems? The existing system for certification appears broken and we the tax payer are punished with antiquated and outrageous prices due to expense and liability of certification process. Enough already.

Yes.

[Jamie]

Must have certified equipment in airplane, so we do without if we can't afford it.

 

Must report all doctor's visits on medical, so there's an incentive to not go when we need to.

 

Isn't it great our Safety is a priority with the FAA?

[aviatoreb]

Yeah - its stunning:

http://www.eaa.org/news/2013/2013-03-25_garmin-rolls-out-new-g3x-with-free-autopilot.asp

 

$8k for a two screen system that includes a "free" garmin autopilot that can fly a coupled approach and has an upset recovery button, and you can even input an AOA sensor for an $199.

[Lionudakis]

I've said many times, experimental targeted cockpit goodies put their efforts into quality and customer service. Certified companies spends 10 fold and years On certification, and often lack any real customer service. Garmin gets 1k to fix a knob that quits working a week out of warranty ?? Let the exp companies try that and see how long they stay around.

[timpercarpio]

I agree with all of the comments. Why isn't AOPA working on this to help out it's members? Is there any way to get a grass roots movement started to force change? Also, why does an engine of 1960's technology cost so much to buy or overhaul?

[triple8s]

Wouldnt it be nice if the various types of equipment had a record of hours used "tested" in the experimental side and once a satisfactory threshold had been met the part/piece could be applied for use in certified? I do remember i took an experimental to get its annual for a friend and it had EFIS and an A/P, was pretty choppy and I remember that A/P would hold heading at all. Another friend of mine had volunteered to pick me up in my Mooney. When we landed I was complaining about the A/P and he said "Really? I had no trouble at all" and sure enough on the return the old Mooney w/Stec would hold course and when it did get nudged off it would make the appropriate correction and come right back on course. I know there are differences on lots of things but other things are just ridiculous, 600$ Visors??? Are you kidding me?

[spaz]

Maybe I am off base but could you convert to an experimental ticket to investigate the newer avionics on a previously certificated aircraft?

 

Mike

[scottfromiowa]

First the US tried genocide (native Americans), then we just tried locking them up (Japanese Americans) now we search old women and mothers before they fly and eliminate all references to Islamic Fundamental Extremists from FBI training...my original point was can we not strive for an improved process that benefits all GA? Lets put some choice and individual accountability back in the certification process...or just let our certified fleet whither and die. How about an "antique class of airplane" like cars....and curio for firearms? They are still on the road. Can there be a time when it can be liability free fly at your risk? That STC's are not being done two lights on a cowl, providing improved safety and efficiency is just ridiculous. Who is to blame? Who can make it change?

[scottfromiowa]

My point above was to question when does the government get it "right"...