Ovation 1 to Ovation 3 via the Midwest STC

[BorealOne]

Anyone done this? I'd love the inside on the process and price as I approach TBO on my IO-550G. I understand that a IO-550N plus new Hartzell scimitar tip prop are involved - but what does it do in terms of real world performance vs the original O1?

[carusoam]

I got a chance to fly the Screamin' eagle with the IO550N and Hartzell Scimitar prop. I used the CloudAhoy app to measure take-off distance as well.

CloudAhoy gave distance for take-off as 795'. But it started measuring when the plane was going 16 Kts. Take-off occurred at 61 kts.

Since it is one data point, it is not very scientific.

Pricing for IO550(G) vs the IO550(N) are very close, factory reman from Continental, installation and break-in are essentially the same. You will probably need a change in your tach for 2700 rpm max.

You get 310hp in place of 280. cylinder cooling fins are slightly different, new sheet metal is included.

The prop comes in three choices, standard, thin and composite. I believe the standard version is slightly heavier than the original Mccauley.

Keep in mind 2700 rpm is audible and has a FF to match...

If you are considering a factory reman and want the latest design in props and 30 more HP, it's a great deal...

This is clearly my opinion, and requires your own research... I only got a couple of flights in the Eagle, but would do it again and collect more data as well.

Unfortunately the TNIO550(G) is not available for the Ovation....

Overall you get O3 performance without G1000 pricing.

Best regards,

-a-

[harrispa]

The 310 hp stc does not require a different engine. It is basically a power boost by allowing the engine to turn 2700 rpm for the 310 hp. It also requires the 3 blade Hartzell prop and perhaps a governor mod. This has been written about on previous topics on Mooneyspace, and there are write ups on this subject if you search online. I recently talked briefly to Midwest about this and I recall the paperwork costs in the 2k range for the stc, but you should call them to confirm. Also, the Mooney factory uses this stc for the Ovation 3. I have a copy of the POH supplement for this stc which I found online. Send me an email if interested.

Paul

[harrispa]

Here is a link to the POH supplement found online for the 310 hp STC.

http://www.deltaaviationllc.com/Nav%20Page/ovation3/Ovation3%20STC.pdf

[BorealOne]

If you are considering a factory reman and want the latest design in props and 30 more HP, it's a great deal...

This is clearly my opinion, and requires your own research... I only got a couple of flights in the Eagle, but would do it again and collect more data as well.

Unfortunately the TNIO550(G) is not available for the Ovation....

Thanks - that's where my thinking is going. Carasoam, sounds like you and I are at the same point in decision-making on 'what next' for our Ovations. Maybe Midwest would cut us a package deal :-)

[jhbehrens]

The 310 hp stc does not require a different engine. It is basically a power boost by allowing the engine to turn 2700 rpm for the 310 hp. It also requires the 3 blade Hartzell prop and perhaps a governor mod. This has been written about on previous topics on Mooneyspace, and there are write ups on this subject if you search online. I recently talked briefly to Midwest about this and I recall the paperwork costs in the 2k range for the stc, but you should call them to confirm. Also, the Mooney factory uses this stc for the Ovation 3. I have a copy of the POH supplement for this stc which I found online. Send me an email if interested.

Paul

Indeed. The STC involves;

- a modification to your governor to allow 2700 RPM

- a new tach which redlines at 2700 RPM (choice between EI and Horizon)

- a 3-blad McCauley Scimitar prop (the expensive item)

On my Eagle (which shiped from the factory at 244 HP @2400 RPM max) it had the following benefits;

- Greatly reduced take-off distance

- Less float on landing

- better clim performance

- Increased take-off weight from 3200 lbs to 3368 lbs

- Increased max fuel from 75 Gal to 89 Gal

At the expense (other than cash) of higher fuel flow when using higher power settings and slightly reduced glide range.

The Eagle is a different plane after the upgrade and typically has around 1,000 lbs payload.

After the governor/prop modification you set it up like an IO-550N but it remains an IO-550G. When you change the engine I believe you can use either.

Jorgen

[carusoam]

Jorgen,

Did you get new cylinders as well when you upgraded? The cooling fins are visibly different on the N. sheet metal changes go with that.

I like the shorter take off distance.

Compared to the lower HP and two blade prop of the Eagle, the Screamin package must be really nice.

Best regards,

-a-

[harrispa]

Here is the actual stc listed on the FAA site:

http://rgl.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guidance_Library/rgstc.nsf/0/9371FDC1A346714F86257840007AFEBA?OpenDocument&Highlight=sa02193ch

[carusoam]

That is the STC for the engine, how about the one for the prop as well?

Or is there one STC for both the engine and Prop?

Best regards,

-a-

[Cris]

I got a chance to fly the Screamin' eagle with the IO550N and Hartzell Scimitar prop. I used the CloudAhoy app to measure take-off distance as well.

CloudAhoy gave distance for take-off as 795'. But it started measuring when the plane was going 16 Kts. Take-off occurred at 61 kts.

Since it is one data point it is joy very scientific.

Best regards,

-a-

As Anthony points out the T/O distance is but one data point but it is a very important one. The POH on the Ovation 3 which uses the Midwest STC only shows T/O distance over a 50' object. In my case I was coming from several mid body Mooney's and wanted similar T/O performance to what I had. Anthony's CloudAhoy T/0 is about half of the Ovation's which is substantial if your are operating out of a high density or relatively short field. One other point is the higher operating rip at altitude. Often at 9-11 K I will operate at 2550 LOP and achieve 190 kts with reasonable fuel burn. This STC provides a great deal of performance options not available otherwise. With that said it provides more value when installed on an Eagle than on an Ovation but if I were close to TBO on an Ovation engine and prop I'd spend the 5-6 K to get this option just for the safety and performance enhancements. You will get all or more of that back on resale according to Vref.

[jhbehrens]

Did you get new cylinders as well when you upgraded? The cooling fins are visibly different on the N. sheet metal changes go with that.

Nope - no changes to the engine itself actually, just to the governor and prop. Of course the shop will have to set up the engine (RPMs and fuel flows at bottom and top of the range) again.

The engine doesn't become an IO-550N, the STC just specifies you have to set it up like one and also says you can replace the G with the N if you wish.

That is the STC for the engine, how about the one for the prop as well?

Or is there one STC for both the engine and Prop?

There are actually two STCs, one to increase the power output of the engine bij modifying the governor (held bij AvPower LLC) and one to change the prop and spinner held by MidWest M20. The Midwest M20 STC includes the AvPower STC is my understanding but anyhow when you buy the 310HP upgrade from Midwest you get both STCs, a new prop, spinner and tach.

Jorgen

[harrispa]

The STC SA02193ch specifies the engine and prop upgrades.

Paul

[DAVIDWH]

Present cost of STC from Midwest is $6,750

 

Govenor, about $750

 

3 blade Hartzell  $12,275

 

plus Tach and fuel

 

Looks like $20,000 and change

[carusoam]

Go the distance and get the (n) mods on the cylinders, then you can say you have an O3 powered Ovation...

Most of the fun comes from the 200rpm bump, then the prop, then... 310hp is nice.

I'm no expert on the mechanics, but, the POH mods from the STC indicates the T/O distance goes from 1200’ down to 800'.

YMMV, check your POH.

Just saying....

-a-

[DAVIDWH]

Airmark just quoted me an additional $3,800 to convert to IO-550N from IO550G.

 

Titan cylinders, add $3000

 

Factory new cylinders, add 4000.

 

In for a penny, in for a pound.

[carusoam]

Now you have an O3 without the G1k hassle?

-a-

[gsengle]

I have a question that never got answered by this thread.  I understand with the Eagle, you get Ovation fuel capacity and a bump in useful load.  If at overhaul I did the O3 thing with my O1, is there any increase in max gross?  I'd assume not; I assume in an Ovation, the weak link is the gear at that point...

 

Second, since Midwest is out of business, does anyone know if I just work with Mooney on the STC?  Anyone done an O1 or O2 -> O3 lately?

 

g

[Jeff_S]

Max gross for an O3 is still 3368...I assume that's what you have on the O1.  Since Mooney now owns the STC, that's who you would have to contact.

[carusoam]

Early Eagle's GW is limited by its GHP...

I believe there are two STCs that are part of the conversation. 310hp and TopProp may be separate...?

The O1 (280hp) has a separate GTOW and Max landing weight.

The O3 (310hp) has the same GTOW and Max landing weight.

Since the landing gear doesn't have any changes, the LW isn't going to change.

The 10% increase in power really decreases the T/O ground run and climb rate.

I don't think there is an official increase of GTOW related to the increase in HP.

High cost of paperwork with some significant testing to prove the plane will take off with more weight under standard conditions at sea level but still have to land with the same gear limitations....

It would be nice to say full seats and full fuel in the O is possible. That would require four really close well adjusted people.

Best regards,

-a-

[gsengle]

My feeling is that this set of upgrades, including the N engine is worthwhile even for an O1 just for the runway performance, when done at overhaul... Thoughts?

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[StevenL757]

I have a question that never got answered by this thread.  I understand with the Eagle, you get Ovation fuel capacity and a bump in useful load.  If at overhaul I did the O3 thing with my O1, is there any increase in max gross?  I'd assume not; I assume in an Ovation, the weak link is the gear at that point...

 

Second, since Midwest is out of business, does anyone know if I just work with Mooney on the STC?  Anyone done an O1 or O2 -> O3 lately?

 

g

Greg, your assessment of the useful load differences between Eagle and Ovation are accurate. I did the conversion last year. As Jeff states, you need to contact Mooney to arrange a purchase of the STC. Bob Minnis (from whom Mooney purchased the STC) is happy to answer questions to guide you correctly, and will listen to your needs to ensure you're spending your money on the right things. He can be reached at 678-361-5696. I speak with him regularly, and he's always happy to discuss individual situations. I highly recommend you engage Bob before you make a purchase decision one way or another. You can reach out to me individually offline to discuss also. Happy to help.

[carusoam]

Three years ago when my prop and engine OHs came upon me...

1) factory reman (N)

2) thin blade TopProp

An Eagle at my home drone followed suit the next year.

I was easily persuaded by taking a ride in a NJ Screamin' Eagle.

You don't need no sky radar instrumentation to get a feel for the performance improvement.

My chances of wearing out the thin bladed TopProp are slim...

Best regards,

-a-

[gsengle]

That was my thought I like the idea of the lighter prop, is it dramatically less overhaulable?

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[carusoam]

It limits the number of times the blades can be re-cut...

I have not had any blades recut in 15 years of flying.

I would think this is an erosion specific environmental situation?

Ask Cody (MS' prop guy)...?

Best regards,

-a-

[gsengle]

Sounds good. Did you go O1->O3? Any comments on your real world runway/climb/cruise performance changes?

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