tls pilot Posted October 7, 2021 Report Posted October 7, 2021 Anyone stamp the number of gallons on the cap? Or just use number stickers on the AvGas sticker on the wing? Quote
carusoam Posted October 8, 2021 Report Posted October 8, 2021 A label that says XX gal 100LL next to the hole… Too many young bucks have difficulty putting the right fuel into Plane fuel tanks… If you put it on the cap… still put it on the wing next to the hole… A tank of Jet-A will run OK until you power up for T/O… Then you get to about TPA before the pistons have holes and no longer produce power… We have lost one Long Body around here that way… landed successfully in the ocean… Best regards, -a- Quote
Mooney Dog Posted October 8, 2021 Report Posted October 8, 2021 After my wings got repainted, one of the shop guys made me these nice stickers. 3 Quote
RobertGary1 Posted October 8, 2021 Report Posted October 8, 2021 What is the purpose of a label that says the tank capacity? Quote
ArtVandelay Posted October 8, 2021 Report Posted October 8, 2021 What is the purpose of a label that says the tank capacity?The placards are in the POH, so I assume they’re required by regs. Quote
RobertGary1 Posted October 8, 2021 Report Posted October 8, 2021 24 minutes ago, ArtVandelay said: The placards are in the POH, so I assume they’re required by regs. Maybe by year. My poh limitations doesn’t mention anything about capacity markings. Quote
tls pilot Posted October 8, 2021 Author Report Posted October 8, 2021 47 minutes ago, RobertGary1 said: What is the purpose of a label that says the tank capacity? Absolutely required Get ramped checked and you will find out… A friend got ramp checked and this was the ONLY issue….on another brand plane In fact an IA really should not sign off annual with out it Not certain about a requirement as it could not be located but the FAA inspector was adamant But my question is, the caps show “US Gallons” can you stamp the cap? say with 26 gallons as in pic above Quote
RobertGary1 Posted October 8, 2021 Report Posted October 8, 2021 1 minute ago, tls pilot said: Absolutely required Get ramped checked and you will find out… A friend got ramp checked and this was the ONLY issue….on another brand plane In fact an IA really should not sign off annual with out it But my question is, the caps show “US Gallons” can you stamp the cap? say with 26 gallons as in pic above Can you post where in the poh limitations you see that? I don’t see it in my poh. Quote
EricJ Posted October 8, 2021 Report Posted October 8, 2021 FAR 23.1557 says it has to say "Fuel" and the minimum grade. I don't know of any requirement that it show capacity. If I got dinged for that on a ramp check I'd make them cite the reg. Quote
RobertGary1 Posted October 8, 2021 Report Posted October 8, 2021 Just now, EricJ said: FAR 23.1557 says it has to say "Fuel" and the minimum grade. I don't know of any requirement that it show capacity. If I got dinged for that on a ramp check I'd make them cite the reg. That is my understanding too. Unless its in the POH limitations like some markings I'm not sure what reg they would cite you for. Quote
EricJ Posted October 8, 2021 Report Posted October 8, 2021 (edited) 15 hours ago, Mooney Dog said: After my wings got repainted, one of the shop guys made me these nice stickers. While this is a really nice placard, it appears to not be compliant with FAR 23.1557 since it doesn't include the word "fuel". Personally I probably wouldn't change it unless somebody with authority made an issue of it. EDIT: Nevermind, I was looking at a slightly wrong reg and AC 20-116 says "Avgas" is sufficient. Edited October 8, 2021 by EricJ Unfuxor the advice. Quote
RobertGary1 Posted October 8, 2021 Report Posted October 8, 2021 When my tanks were resealed they removed my sticker and repainted my wing walk. Not sure of the total process of resealing tanks but I guess its because the stuff eats stickers,etc on the plane??? Quote
RobertGary1 Posted October 8, 2021 Report Posted October 8, 2021 7 minutes ago, EricJ said: While this is a really nice placard, it appears to not be compliant with FAR 23.1557 since it doesn't include the word "fuel". Personally I probably wouldn't change it unless somebody with authority made an issue of it. Is it "fuel" or "avgas". § 23.1557(c)(1) (i) For reciprocating engine-powered airplanes— (A) The word ‘‘Avgas’’; and (B) The minimum fuel grade Quote
EricJ Posted October 8, 2021 Report Posted October 8, 2021 7 minutes ago, RobertGary1 said: Is it "fuel" or "avgas". § 23.1557(c)(1) (i) For reciprocating engine-powered airplanes— (A) The word ‘‘Avgas’’; and (B) The minimum fuel grade D'oh! Yes, "Avgas" is sufficient. AC 20-116 says it can be subsituted, too. Cornell Law sent me to the wrong page and I was looking at 25.1557. Derp. Quote
carusoam Posted October 8, 2021 Report Posted October 8, 2021 Made me want to look it up… For the cap… Found in the limitations section of the POH… In 1994… But, is it really on the fuel cap, or just next to it? -a- 1 Quote
RobertGary1 Posted October 8, 2021 Report Posted October 8, 2021 36 minutes ago, carusoam said: Made me want to look it up… For the cap… Found in the limitations section of the POH… In 1994… But, is it really on the fuel cap, or just next to it? -a- Ok, must be something they added for later models. Quote
201Mooniac Posted October 8, 2021 Report Posted October 8, 2021 Not so new, it is in the M20J POH dated 11-15-77 2 Quote
tls pilot Posted October 8, 2021 Author Report Posted October 8, 2021 OK The question remains, the cap is stamped US Gallons Can we tap it with a number before it? There are ways to tap that Al cap, obviously off the aircraft Quote
carusoam Posted October 8, 2021 Report Posted October 8, 2021 If you look close at the cap’s surface… You may even find a flat spot there already…(?) Let me invite our MSer with the most fuel cap experience to the discussion… ( @OSUAV8TER ) Osu has OH’d quite a few of these things… in the past. Best regards, -a- Quote
RobertGary1 Posted October 8, 2021 Report Posted October 8, 2021 2 hours ago, 201Mooniac said: Not so new, it is in the M20J POH dated 11-15-77 So must have started with the 201 1 Quote
PT20J Posted October 9, 2021 Report Posted October 9, 2021 If a placard is listed in the Limitations section of the AFM/POH, it needs to be there. The Limitations section is the only part of the manual that the FAA approves. We rejected the new panel because the placard said THROTTLE and PROP but left off the PUSH INCREASE under each. Also, any placards required by STC need to be there. It looks from a lot of panel pictures I see that some are leaving off the required placard for the speed brakes., Skip 1 Quote
Guest Posted October 9, 2021 Report Posted October 9, 2021 And by extension the PoH will have to be the part number called out in the type certificate and be the current revision from the manufacturer. Clarence Quote
RobertGary1 Posted October 9, 2021 Report Posted October 9, 2021 47 minutes ago, PT20J said: If a placard is listed in the Limitations section of the AFM/POH, it needs to be there. The Limitations section is the only part of the manual that the FAA approves. We rejected the new panel because the placard said THROTTLE and PROP but left off the PUSH INCREASE under each. Also, any placards required by STC need to be there. It looks from a lot of panel pictures I see that some are leaving off the required placard for the speed brakes., Skip Yes but the only question is which mooneys have that in the limitations. It appears is was introduced in the 201 since I don’t have that in the F model poh. 1 Quote
PT20J Posted October 9, 2021 Report Posted October 9, 2021 2 minutes ago, RobertGary1 said: Yes but the only question is which mooneys have that in the limitations. It appears is was introduced in the 201 since I don’t have that in the F model poh. If it's not on the TCDS and not in the limitations then I agree that there is no regulatory requirement for it 1 Quote
EricJ Posted October 9, 2021 Report Posted October 9, 2021 Yes, the FAR requirements apply regardless, and anything in the POH limitations applies to the affected model(s). The M20J Limitations also include placards for under the wings saying, "HOIST POINT". I wonder how many in the fleet have those. 1 Quote
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