Help finding the right 201

[ArtVandelay]

ok, I have come to the conclusion that I am going to have to step up the budget to get a nice plane like I want. I do not have a certain budget in mind as long as the plane is what I am wanting. From what I am seeing by the time I buy one and do all the upgrades I am better off buying one that's ready to go.  Just got the itch to start flying again, actually never lost the itch

Or find a plane with no corrosion, no fuel leaks and otherwise airworthy and fly it and update as your wallet allows.
You’ll get exactly what you want, if this you’re long term plane, costs are amortized.

[gsxrpilot]

18 minutes ago, MATTS875 said:

I agree, I have used mooney flyer for values and there are things I do not understand, like if you add century or stec autolpilot if decreases the value and very little difference in adding for a 530 vs gtn750.  I guess everything is a learning curve

Matt,

Step 1 - find a plane that is structurally sound, that is airworthy without any corrosion. If it doesn't pass step one, move along.

For me, Step 2 is the panel. For some others, Step two is engine time. But for me, engine time is variable and has pro's and con's all directions.

So for Step 2 I'm looking for the avionics that I know I'm gonna want to have. For me this is three things. In no particular order, WAAS GPS, Autopilot, Engine monitor. Then I look at what it costs to buy/install/upgrade these items.
1. WAAS GPS - $15K
2. Autopilot - $20K (Stec 30 minimum with altitude hold is better, if the plane has electric trim I want altitude pre-select.)
3. Engine monitor - $2500 - $5K

Based on these rough numbers and the level of capability and enjoyment they add to a Mooney, I won't look at a plane that doesn't have the first two. I figure adding the engine monitor after purchase isn't too terribly expensive.

I evaluate engine time, paint, interior, speed-mods (C,E,F models) as a means to compare two planes with similar equipment.

My preference for engine time would be between 500 and 1000 hours since overhaul. At either end I have a preference for run-out over zero time. But none of this is a deal breaker for me.

There are lots of other things that are "nice to haves" like GPSS ($2000), second AI ($2000), HSI ($2000), glass ($$$$) and even ADSB ($2000 assuming WAAS GPS is already there).

Just my $0.02 

[MATTS875]

thanks for all the advice.   what are your opinions of the 86 201 that all American aircraft has for sale?

[MATTS875]

fast update, just got back the oil analysis on the 86 and has metal so it is a no go on that one for me

[KSMooniac]

Some metal is always present in oil...is your criteria for no metal at all, or above a certain threshold or relative to fleet averages?

Sent from my LG-US996 using Tapatalk

[MATTS875]

It was a higher amount of metal found was what he told me. I would like to be able to get one that I can fly for a while without an overhaul so quick

[thinwing]

Well that engine pretty high time so elevated metals is to be expected...the important question is what kind of metals?Also this report is based on one sample?Or do you mean metal in the screens and filter?

[MATTS875]

I was thinking of an overhaul because the original engine being 32 years old. I would have considered buying it at a good price but so far it is not happening

[LANCECASPER]

Here's a 93 J model with TKS for $100,000, but it's in Istanbul, Turkey. Even with having someone bring it back it may be a deal.

https://www.controller.com/listings/aircraft/for-sale/23383355/1993-mooney-m20j-mse

[MATTS875]

I saw that one but hopefully I can find one in the US. I keep watching all the sites hoping for one to come up. Thanks for the info

[MATTS875]

I am very excited. me and SAMFOX have agreed on everything and I will be buying his 97 201. It feels like Christmas time.  Can't wait to get it.

[Mooneymite]

I saw this while stopping for fuel.  I have no clue if it's even still on the market.

[jgarrison]

On 5/11/2018 at 2:34 PM, MATTS875 said:

fast update, just got back the oil analysis on the 86 and has metal so it is a no go on that one for me

Just to be absolutely clear, the oil analysis states that the metal in the oil is what would be found in a sample with 35 hours on it (i.e. a normal amount of metal for a 35 hour oil sample). Since the oil had 23 hours on it, the analysis states that it is a little higher than expected. It also states that if the engine has not been flown much lately (which is hasn't), that could be what is causing the elevated levels. The analysis firm in no way states that there is 'metal in the oil'. They advise the submitter to check the filter and if no metal in the filter, then just monitor going forward. 

I have a responsibility to the owner of the aircraft to sell the plane for him and I have no reason to believe that the engine is in any way unfit for flight. I have flown the plane several times and would not subject myself or anyone else to fly in a plane that was not safe. The engine is high time. It would be expected to need an overhaul at some time in the not-too-distant future. And that is the reason it is priced in the 80's and not in the mid to high 110's, as a mid 80's M20J would be priced with a low time engine.

Jimmy  

[KLRDMD]

34 minutes ago, jgarrison said:

Just to be absolutely clear, the oil analysis states that the metal in the oil is what would be found in a sample with 35 hours on it (i.e. a normal amount of metal for a 35 hour oil sample). Since the oil had 23 hours on it, the analysis states that it is a little higher than expected. It also states that if the engine has not been flown much lately (which is hasn't), that could be what is causing the elevated levels. The analysis firm in no way states that there is 'metal in the oil'. They advise the submitter to check the filter and if no metal in the filter, then just monitor going forward. I have a responsibility to the owner of the aircraft to sell the plane for him and I have no reason to believe that the engine is in any way unfit for flight. I have flown the plane several times and would not subject myself or anyone else to fly in a plane that was not safe. The engine is high time. It would be expected to need an overhaul at some time in the not-too-distant future. And that is the reason it is priced in the 80's and not in the mid to high 110's, as a mid 80's M20J would be priced with a low time engine.

Sounds like a buyer that "doesn't know what he doesn't know" and missing out on a great airplane due to not seeking appropriate advice. Too bad.

[gsxrpilot]

Trying not to be too critical of Matt, but some people know how to buy airplanes and some don't. 

None of these vintage airplanes are perfect but there are certainly fewer available every year. I'm as critical as anyone on this site about planes that come up for sale. But when a good one comes up for sale, one has to be prepared to make a deal and write a contract. 

[MATTS875]

Thanks for everyone's input. I agree that I am new to the buying process and have a lot to learn. This is a learning experience for me and when the right one comes up I will buy it. When he said there was metal in the filter, he asked me if I was in or out and being unknowledgeable as to how to read the oil analysis I said I was out. Probably prematurely but I did not know the appropriate questions to ask. They sell really nice airplanes and would in no means discredit that. Thanks again for all your input

[KLRDMD]

5 minutes ago, MATTS875 said:

Thanks for everyone's input. I agree that I am new to the buying process and have a lot to learn. This is a learning experience for me and when the right one comes up I will buy it. When he said there was metal in the filter, he asked me if I was in or out and being unknowledgeable as to how to read the oil analysis I said I was out. Probably prematurely but I did not know the appropriate questions to ask. They sell really nice airplanes and would in no means discredit that. Thanks again for all your input

Was there metal in the filter or was there a "metal" reading higher than average for the sample time on the oil analysis ? Those are two VERY different things !

Sounds like you would benefit from a buyer's agent in this process.

[Oldguy]

29 minutes ago, MATTS875 said:

Thanks for everyone's input. I agree that I am new to the buying process and have a lot to learn. This is a learning experience for me and when the right one comes up I will buy it. When he said there was metal in the filter, he asked me if I was in or out and being unknowledgeable as to how to read the oil analysis I said I was out. Probably prematurely but I did not know the appropriate questions to ask. They sell really nice airplanes and would in no means discredit that. Thanks again for all your input

Then call them back and see if it is still for sale! If the oil analysis was what was bothering you about the plane, do something like @KLRDMD suggested and get a knowledgeable buyer's agent to assist in your search. Even if it costs you a couple AMU spent on a buyer's agent to find the right plane, it can protect you from a significantly higher AMU expense and may bring out some planes you might otherwise bypass.

We here on MS will answer any and all questions you ask, but having someone working on locating your plane who can carry on a conversation IRT about it will accelerate the process.

[LANCECASPER]

On 5/23/2018 at 8:58 AM, MATTS875 said:

Thanks for everyone's input. I agree that I am new to the buying process and have a lot to learn. This is a learning experience for me and when the right one comes up I will buy it. When he said there was metal in the filter, he asked me if I was in or out and being unknowledgeable as to how to read the oil analysis I said I was out. Probably prematurely but I did not know the appropriate questions to ask. They sell really nice airplanes and would in no means discredit that. Thanks again for all your input

Here you go, Jimmy from AAA just put this one online during the night I bet it doesn't last too long. https://www.controller.com/listings/aircraft/for-sale/25979153/1994-mooney-m20j-mse?OHID=25979153

[mccdeuce]

Matt - give me a few days.  I had been unsure of what I was planning with my Mooney, found out I am moving to japan this afternoon so will probably sell her.  Just need a couple days to process.