M20F-1968 Posted September 26, 2015 Report Posted September 26, 2015 I have a Johnson bar plane that is highly modified and has an Ovation interior. The problem I am trying to solve is, if I am not careful, I can unlatch the pilot's seat belt when putting the gear down. I thought of 1) having the seat belt re-webbed so the strap is about 2" longer, placing the buckle more into the pilots lap, 2) grinding back the edge of the part of the buckle used to open the buckle and release the seat belt. I have not yet done anything about it, as if I careful, I am learning to put the gear down without disturbing the seat belt buckle, but it takes some thought. How have people fixed this problem? John Breda Quote
lahso Posted September 26, 2015 Report Posted September 26, 2015 Turn the buckle around, so that the latch is facing your lap. I do that for the passenger, too. 2 Quote
Marauder Posted September 27, 2015 Report Posted September 27, 2015 I have a Johnson bar plane that is highly modified and has an Ovation interior. The problem I am trying to solve is, if I am not careful, I can unlatch the pilot's seat belt when putting the gear down. I thought of 1) having the seat belt re-webbed so the strap is about 2" longer, placing the buckle more into the pilots lap, 2) grinding back the edge of the part of the buckle used to open the buckle and release the seat belt. I have not yet done anything about it, as if I careful, I am learning to put the gear down without disturbing the seat belt buckle, but it takes some thought. How have people fixed this problem?John Breda John -- with the mods you have done to your beautiful F, dare I say "J"?, why not just install electric gear? Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Quote
takair Posted September 27, 2015 Report Posted September 27, 2015 I have the same problem, but don't have the nice Ovation interior. I had considered rewebbing to move the buckle toward center, but I think the geometry of the shoulder harness would be wrong... I still don't have a long term fix.. Quote
carusoam Posted September 27, 2015 Report Posted September 27, 2015 (edited) One part memory, another part strength, and a third part technique... Al and his design team must have done that intentionally. It is the first of the two cognitive reminders that you are human. The other one is the GU scraping sound. With My C, if I remembered, I would intentionally move my arm and avoid the buckle. It helped to do it at the right airspeed... A small amount of stress, or a bit of a rush, the next thing that happens the seat belt has been disconnected in the traffic pattern interfering with the first GUMPS check. Two hands are needed to not fumble with the seat belt. The third hand is on the yoke. With my O, I put the gear down at a more leisurely pace prior to the traffic pattern. The O has a slightly different buckle than my C did. It might be worth looking at the O's buckle to see if it would be different enough to not catch as easily... Best regards, -a- Edited September 27, 2015 by carusoam Quote
Guest Posted September 27, 2015 Report Posted September 27, 2015 I have a Johnson bar plane that is highly modified and has an Ovation interior. The problem I am trying to solve is, if I am not careful, I can unlatch the pilot's seat belt when putting the gear down. I thought of 1) having the seat belt re-webbed so the strap is about 2" longer, placing the buckle more into the pilots lap, 2) grinding back the edge of the part of the buckle used to open the buckle and release the seat belt. I have not yet done anything about it, as if I careful, I am learning to put the gear down without disturbing the seat belt buckle, but it takes some thought. How have people fixed this problem? John Breda Contact Alpha Aviation, they have push button type belts. Clarence Quote
N601RX Posted September 27, 2015 Report Posted September 27, 2015 I have the alpha inerta reels and have never had them come unlatched when swinging the gear. Quote
nels Posted September 27, 2015 Report Posted September 27, 2015 I had the same problem. I noticed after landing that my belt was loose. I didn't like that at all. I found a couple small wide rubber bands and stretched one over each release which makes it a lot more difficult to accidentally release the buckle. Quote
steingar Posted September 27, 2015 Report Posted September 27, 2015 I have the same damn problem in my C. I just check the seatbelt after I put the gear down. Heck, its the "S" in "GUMPS". Quote
Hank Posted September 27, 2015 Report Posted September 27, 2015 (edited) I have the same damn problem in my C. I just check the seatbelt after I put the gear down. Heck, its the "S" in "GUMPS". and here I thought S stood for, "S#&@!! Put the gear down!" Edited September 27, 2015 by Hank 1 Quote
Shadrach Posted September 27, 2015 Report Posted September 27, 2015 John -- with the mods you have done to your beautiful F, dare I say "J"?, why not just install electric gear? Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Ha!... Why do you think he went to the trouble and expense to convert an old manual gear bird.?!?!? John, why not go with the alpha belts? They don't look as nice, but they have a push button release that should not be affected by the gear swing. 1 Quote
HRM Posted September 27, 2015 Report Posted September 27, 2015 I have a Johnson bar plane that is highly modified and has an Ovation interior. The problem I am trying to solve is, if I am not careful, I can unlatch the pilot's seat belt when putting the gear down. This is in no way a judgement, but I had the exact same problem. I lost 45 pounds, the problem magically went away. Possibly because the latch is now nearer my navel as opposed to the J-bar Lastly, all things having to do with a Johnson improve with some weight loss. 1 Quote
Danb Posted September 27, 2015 Report Posted September 27, 2015 Especially when joining the mile high club..now I wouldn't know about that I haven't been able to join yet! Quote
Ned Gravel Posted September 27, 2015 Report Posted September 27, 2015 I have the alpha inerta reels and have never had them come unlatched when swinging the gear. +1 for the Alpha Aviation sets. Cost about $300 a side. Quote
Marauder Posted September 27, 2015 Report Posted September 27, 2015 Especially when joining the mile high club..now I wouldn't know about that I haven't been able to join yet! Jeepers Dan, everyone knows that is why you install an autopilot with altitude hold! Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk 1 Quote
Guest Posted September 29, 2015 Report Posted September 29, 2015 Jeepers Dan, everyone knows that is why you install an autopilot with altitude hold! Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Mission Impossible with your girls! Clarence Quote
M20F-1968 Posted September 29, 2015 Author Report Posted September 29, 2015 Thanks for the responses. I have the seat belts with inertia reels from the Ovation and the inertia reels are welded into the airframe just like the new models. So, changing to a new inertia system does not make sense. However, if Alpha aviation has a buckle with a push button release, that would be helpful. It would even be better if that buckle would accept the other 1/2 of the Ovation buckle so that only one side need be changed. I see from their web site that they use Amsafe parts. I have Amsafe belts so that may work. I have thought of the elastic band thing but have not tried it yet. Am looking for a longer term fix. Has anyone tried turning the edge of the buckle handle down or grinding it back so the edge of the buckle is protected inside the steel frame of the buckle? The Johnson bar is so simple, I don't want to put electric gear in. Perhaps when I am 80? John Breda 1 Quote
1964-M20E Posted September 29, 2015 Report Posted September 29, 2015 John -- with the mods you have done to your beautiful F, dare I say "J"?, why not just install electric gear? Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Marauder Convert to electric gear?????? blaspheme!!! you heathen you will rot in he!! 1 Quote
Bob_Belville Posted September 29, 2015 Report Posted September 29, 2015 Marauder Convert to electric gear?????? blaspheme!!! you heathen you will rot in he!! Don't burst an artery '64E, Marauder suffers JBar envy. His F model was born way too late to be a truly vintage Mooney, but he has a nice little airplane. Bless his heart. Quote
TTaylor Posted September 29, 2015 Report Posted September 29, 2015 Changing to electric gear will not solve the problem. I have the same issue when adjusting the trim wheel. I have had belts unlatch several times during approach to landing. I think I have gotten better about how I place my hand on the wheel to avoid it now but I have thought about making a sleeve that slips over the seatbelt latch so I don't accidently release it. Quote
gsxrpilot Posted September 29, 2015 Report Posted September 29, 2015 Practice worked for me. The first 20 hours or so, this was a constant issue. But I rarely unlatch the seatbelt now. The muscle memory tells me where the latch is, were my arm should be and how much effort it takes. Just go fly, you'll work it out. Quote
Marauder Posted September 29, 2015 Report Posted September 29, 2015 Changing to electric gear will not solve the problem. I have the same issue when adjusting the trim wheel. I have had belts unlatch several times during approach to landing. I think I have gotten better about how I place my hand on the wheel to avoid it now but I have thought about making a sleeve that slips over the seatbelt latch so I don't accidently release it. Found a solution for you here too. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk 2 Quote
Shadrach Posted September 30, 2015 Report Posted September 30, 2015 Found a solution for you here too. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Chris, I know that you're partial to full figured...what's that fancy plane of yours weigh? Quote
Marauder Posted September 30, 2015 Report Posted September 30, 2015 Chris, I know that you're partial to full figured...what's that fancy plane of yours weigh? I have a useful load enough for one of my women, me and a Big Mac... Useful is 962. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Quote
Marauder Posted September 30, 2015 Report Posted September 30, 2015 And oh yeah, enough fuel to get to the next McDonald's Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Quote
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