SFO to HNL VFR or IFR?

[SkyPilot]

I'm planning a ferry flight to Honolulu from SFO in my Mooney. Has anyone here done it, and can it be done VFR or is IFR mandatory? Also, do the rules require the use of an HF radio? It is really difficult to find info on the web. Even Earth Rounders is not too helpful.

[Rwsavory]

Have not done it, and probably never will.  But I found this:  http://www.priortrip.com/    Click on Itinerary, and you will find a description of his leg from Oakland to Hilo.  Very interesting.  You might want to call AOPA Pilot Information Center if you are a member.  A quick search on their site indicates that HF is required for oceanic operations due to VHF being limited to line of sight.  Good luck!

[Piloto]

All the Oceanic crossings I have done were under an IFR flight plan and with HF radio onboard. I always carry a handheld marine VHF radio, 406MHz PLB, raft, life jackets and flares. Anytime you are over 200nm offshore you will need HF to maintain contact with ATC. The Icom 706 is he most popular HF radio ferry piots use. Check http://www.aircraftdelivery.net/ferrypilotforms/706_In_Airplane.pdf for installation in a Mooney. You can get a new 706 for about $1000 and the antenna tuner for about $300. The Icom 706 is very reliable but a little bit more complex to operate than traditional HF aircraft radios since it has multiple operating modes.

I would not risk doing the crossing under a VFR flight plan because it limits to 6000 feet. At over 10,000ft you can reach a boat on the marine radio at 100nm and have the time and range to coordinate a rescue should you need to ditch.

Of veeery important consideration are the winds aloft. These can reduce your range significantly. For winds check http://aviationweather.gov/iffdp/fdwndh

Check the oil consumption rate in your plane. Also make provisions for self relieving. Make sure the autopilot is working because you will nap at times.

Good Luck

José

[OR75]

just wondering what extended range fuel tank options do you have.

[carusoam]

Diatribe coming, fair warning!

Consider this type of flight as the highest level of professional flying. The risks are high and the back-ups are minimal.

What's your longest non-stop, cross country, in your plane, flight so far?

José has done this before and his preparation will allow him to do it again, in case the plane doesn't feel like finishing the trip...

Be cautious, prepare like it won't be a successful flight. Then when it is a success, you can brag about how good the Mooney was...

Consider hiring an experienced pilot to help plan and execute the flight.

Known bad Trans-Pacific Mooney Experiences:

(1) There is a video of a Mooney, on the web, performing a water landing, near a lightship. Apparently head winds caused a fuel shortage, resulting in plan B. the pilot lived, but the Mooney was lost...

(2) An Ovation pilot was lost recently on departure to Hawaii from Califoria. The plane came in contact with ag equipment in a field.

Seek more help, get help, third opinions if necessary. Make informed decisions. Don't save money in trade for safety.

Sorry if this was too direct, but I would hate to lose another Mooney pilot this way. Life is short and the Pacific is not...

Best regards,

-a-

[Piloto]

just wondering what extended range fuel tank options do you have.

For an M20J you will need at least 150 gals for a 20% reserve (400nm). If the plane has long range tanks (100 gals). You will need another 50 on the back seat. This is typically added with a 55 gallon drum strapped on the back seat. A fuel selector valve is added to select either the ferry tank or the right wing tank. After take off you select the ferry tank to empty this one first. Make sure the ferry tank is properly vented outside the cabin. Carusoam is very right. This is not a trivial trip. Make sure you are familiar with the HF operation and ferry tank. Dual GPS is a most with one of them coupled to the autopilot. Carry with you a listing of the HF frequencies for the area http://www.hamuniverse.com/aerofreq.html Best frequencies varies with distance and time of day.

José

[BigTex]

Not sure the objective but I would personally consider separating the Wing from the fuselage, crating and shipping the aircraft over to Hawaii.

[Piloto]

Not sure the objective but I would personally consider separating the Wing from the fuselage, crating and shipping the aircraft over to Hawaii.

Not a bad option until you look at a Mooney Ovation or Acclaim with so many linkages (ailerons, gear and flaps) wires and bolts holding the wing. Most Mooneys are actually ferried in one piece with good results. Although there is a potential risk it is much less than in the days before GPS or internet. My first oceanic flights relied on ADF and one day old wet fax paper wx forecasts like those in Santa Maria (LPAZ). With today GPS navigation is not an issue. With Internet instant and accurate satellite WX forecast you have a better idea of what to encounter or how long to wait before departing. Nevertheless prior long flight experience helps you in knowing your capabilities and biological needs. Nothing worse than a real bad smelling plane when you arrive. Know your limitations and those of your machine and you will be safe.

José

[WardHolbrook]

All the Oceanic crossings I have done were under an IFR flight plan and with HF radio onboard. I always carry a handheld marine VHF radio, 406MHz PLB, raft, life jackets and flares. Anytime you are over 200nm offshore you will need HF to maintain contact with ATC. The Icom 706 is he most popular HF radio ferry piots use. Check http://www.aircraftdelivery.net/ferrypilotforms/706_In_Airplane.pdf for installation in a Mooney. You can get a new 706 for about $1000 and the antenna tuner for about $300. The Icom 706 is very reliable but a little bit more complex to operate than traditional HF aircraft radios since it has multiple operating modes.

I would not risk doing the crossing under a VFR flight plan because it limits to 6000 feet. At over 10,000ft you can reach a boat on the marine radio at 100nm and have the time and range to coordinate a rescue should you need to ditch.

Of veeery important consideration are the winds aloft. These can reduce your range significantly. For winds check http://aviationweather.gov/iffdp/fdwndh

Check the oil consumption rate in your plane. Also make provisions for self relieving. Make sure the autopilot is working because you will nap at times.

Good Luck

José

Very good info stuff Jose. How hard has it been to get the FAA to approve the installation of the Icom 706 and antenna? I'm assuming it was done with a 337?

[Piloto]

Very good info stuff Jose. How hard has it been to get the FAA to approve the installation of the Icom 706 and antenna? I'm assuming it was done with a 337?

If you are a licensed ham operator the field approval is straight forward. Even though the 706 is not TSOd it is FCC approved and MIL spec rated like many components in a plane.

José

[N201MKTurbo]

This sounds like an Awsome adventure, why are you trying to talk him out of it? I would do it...

[SkyPilot]

Hey folks thanks for all the interesting and helpful information. The trip is only the first leg as it looks like I am being transferred full time in 6 months to a year. Final destination is Borneo. I'll be preparing the bird a huge amount including an engine overhaul if necessary but at the moment it runs great. Being only an M20F with a cruise speed of 142kts, the range is limited. I'm planning the 100 gallon Monroy mod, plus a 100 gallon turtlepac in the back seat. Presently I'm working on the instrument panel to upgrade it to IFR and if I have room will add an ADF, but space is limited. I'm also working on my own fuselage and jogging 4 km per day. Excellent health can keep you alive in bad situations and I have proven this to myself at least once...

 

I had the airplane for sale looking for a faster one, but the market is horrible as you all know. I've got more into the bird now than I'll ever get out of it, plus I am comfortable with the old beastie..

 

Keep the comments rolling it's all appreciated.

[SkyPilot]

If you are a licensed ham operator the field approval is straight forward. Even though the 706 is not TSOd it is FCC approved and MIL spec rated like many components in a plane.

José

This is something I never thought of. I'll look into getting rated. I'm a Canadian eh so probably not too many ham operators out there.

[Piloto]

This is something I never thought of. I'll look into getting rated. I'm a Canadian eh so probably not too many ham operators out there.

I don't think you will have any problem with canadian officials. I have been at CYYR and CYYT and never been asked about paper work for the HF. However ham radio knowledge helps you in understanding HF.

José