I give up

[Patrick Horan]

I closed up all the gaps that I thought were causing the air to leak. But I'm still seeing +30 degree different on the entire right side of the engine, compared to the left. I've logged maybe 60 hours at most on this airplane. I am so done. I can't lean this airplane without my CHT exceeding 420.

I purchased this plane from a VERY well know mooney shop. Even though I got the paper work saying an annual was done. There was no chance that a mechanic even looked at it. Between 2 faulty batteries,  both fuel tanks leaking gallons of fuel, prop leaking oil, both push rod tubes on cylinder number 5 were cracked and leaking tons of oil leading to having to replace cylinder #5, and the entire pitot static line was leaking. I'm just ranting, but after this experience, compared to the M20C this is making me regret everything. 

[DCarlton]

1 hour ago, Patrick Horan said:

I closed up all the gaps that I thought were causing the air to leak. But I'm still seeing +30 degree different on the entire right side of the engine, compared to the left. I've logged maybe 60 hours at most on this airplane. I am so done. I can't lean this airplane without my CHT exceeding 420.

I purchased this plane from a VERY well know mooney shop. Even though I got the paper work saying an annual was done. There was no chance that a mechanic even looked at it. Between 2 faulty batteries,  both fuel tanks leaking gallons of fuel, prop leaking oil, both push rod tubes on cylinder number 5 were cracked and leaking tons of oil leading to having to replace cylinder #5, and the entire pitot static line was leaking. I'm just ranting, but after this experience, compared to the M20C this is making me regret everything. 

I'm no expert but a 7% difference between the left and right side doesn't sound like much.  It'll be interesting to see what the engine experts say.   

[Patrick Horan]

12 minutes ago, DCarlton said:

I'm no expert but a 7% difference between the left and right side doesn't sound like much.  It'll be interesting to see what the engine experts say.   

It's definitely a big difference. All three cylinders on the right side (1,3,5 are 30-40° hotter) cylinder number 1 being my hottest 

[Niko182]

did you bring it to brian kendrick?

[Scott Ashton]

Patrick, just a crazy idea, but swap the oft and right probes, wires, everything on one probe on the left and one on the right and see if the temps are reading accurately.   If you move your #5 probe/wiring over to #6 and vice versa.   If #5 (which is now in the #6 cylinder ) stays hot, then you have a measuring issue.   
did you verify you have the right injectors installed on that side?  Maybe something got missed there and they aren’t flying right.
you checked the induction system already for leaks, if I recall, right?

At low power cruise, full rich, are the temps more even?  If so that probable eliminates a probe offset/bias issue….does the spread increase only as you start to lean?

what happens when you lean at say, 55% power, are you getting the same high temps in the CHT?

i hope you figure out out and it’s something simple…

 

don’t get discouraged.    No matter how good the airplane, your first two years is full of surprises.   By the time you get it perfectly right exactly how you want it, you’ll be itching for an Acclaim.
 

[takair]

Consider posting pictures of the engine compartment to see if folks can help identify opportunities. 

[Fritz1]

Crudest way to check fuel flow is take injectors out stick each into measuring cup, run boost pump with full throttle mixture rich for let's say 1 min and compare cups, if this does not show anything do lean test at 24" record fuel flow for each cylinder egt to peak, make sure mags are wired correctly, one mag fires bottom plugs on one side, top plugs on the other side, persistence wil get you a perfect running engine

[Schllc]

8 hours ago, Fritz1 said:

persistence wil get you a perfect running engine

This x100. 
This is just shakedown, it’s normal, even if it’s frustrating. 
at the end you will know your airplane better, and you may be able to help someone else later experiencing the same problems. 
Don’t give up!
 

[PilotX]

There is some variation in temps, some good advice above. We have been babying #2 battery for a year because $1K is a lot. Mooney’s leak fuel, I had a pretty significant drip drip drip above 35 gal, so I filled to 30 until I could get it in the shop. I am pretty sure leaking gallons grounds the plane, I am also certain there is some hyperbole in the OPs statements. It took 15 hours of labor to seal the tanks but a new seep just showed up in a new spot. I had a guy that offered to buy my plane for $240 (listed initially at 260) if I put 60K into it (paint, complete tank reseal, interior) I kept the plane, got a partner and just put some new avionics in. The LHS is fabulous, thanks @Warren

[Patrick Horan]

14 hours ago, PilotX said:

There is some variation in temps, some good advice above. We have been babying #2 battery for a year because $1K is a lot. Mooney’s leak fuel, I had a pretty significant drip drip drip above 35 gal, so I filled to 30 until I could get it in the shop. I am pretty sure leaking gallons grounds the plane, I am also certain there is some hyperbole in the OPs statements. It took 15 hours of labor to seal the tanks but a new seep just showed up in a new spot. I had a guy that offered to buy my plane for $240 (listed initially at 260) if I put 60K into it (paint, complete tank reseal, interior) I kept the plane, got a partner and just put some new avionics in. The LHS is fabulous, thanks @Warren

I wish there was a hyperbole. Unfortunately it's just been a mess. I will say the mooney shop did fix the leaks, after my mechanic did most of the work to get it flyable.

 

 

[Patrick Horan]

21 hours ago, Schllc said:

This x100. 
This is just shakedown, it’s normal, even if it’s frustrating. 
at the end you will know your airplane better, and you may be able to help someone else later experiencing the same problems. 
Don’t give up! V

Thanks,  I put to much work (and mooney ) to give up. Just disappointed in the work that the shop did.

[Patrick Horan]

On 1/19/2025 at 5:53 AM, Fritz1 said:

Crudest way to check fuel flow is take injectors out stick each into measuring cup, run boost pump with full throttle mixture rich for let's say 1 min and compare cups, if this does not show anything do lean test at 24" record fuel flow for each cylinder egt to peak, make sure mags are wired correctly, one mag fires bottom plugs on one side, top plugs on the other side, persistence wil get you a perfect running engine

THANK YOU!! that's really a great idea. Ill look into this rightvaway!!

[Schllc]

32 minutes ago, Patrick Horan said:

Thanks,  I put to much work (and mooney ) to give up. Just disappointed in the work that the shop did.

I’ve been there as well. Best option is to chalk it up to experience and move on to someone more compatible. There are good shops out there as well, take care of them and they will take care of you. 

[Patrick Horan]

2 hours ago, Schllc said:

I’ve been there as well. Best option is to chalk it up to experience and move on to someone more compatible. There are good shops out there as well, take care of them and they will take care of you. 

Definitely going to try and book something with Brian kenndricks

[Schllc]

You will not find anyone more honest or knowledgeable. 
he is an all around solid guy and doesn’t mind if you get your hands dirty with him. 

[Fritz1]

Second Brian Kendrick, known him for almost 30 years, he ran the factory service center for a while and also was a company test pilot, he can test fly Mooneys to trouble shoot what few shops can do, did prepurchase on my airplane and 3 annuals thereafter, he test flew the airplane, figured stall warning was not coming on because mounted too low from factory, had to redrill TKS panel for new rivnuts to move stall warning up, he will find stuff that other people don't, airplane had 190h on factory reman, still spent at least $50k on repairs not counting upgrades in the first two years, biggest line item tanks, think 11k at the time, Brian replaced stuff in a preventive manner like flap limit switches because he knew they were going to fail rather sooner than later, re-glued TKS stall triggers because he knew they were about to come off soon, doing an annual with him and dropping the bird off for let's say at least 4 weeks will make most of your trouble go away, whatever he does not have time to fix he will explain to you so you can get it done locally

[dkkim73]

1 hour ago, Fritz1 said:

Second Brian Kendrick, known him for almost 30 years, he ran the factory service center for a while and also was a company test pilot, he can test fly Mooneys to trouble shoot what few shops can do,...

^this

I've only worked with Mr. Kendrick remotely; he has been very helpful and knowledgeable. At some point I would like to get him the airplane (logistics a bit off this year to do the annual down there, and was at MFSC last year) as some things really would benefit from a Mooney-knowledgeable test-pilot. E.g. subtle mixture and fuel bugs, flight characteristics, etc.

Most shops won't have a guy who will check the boxes (as a pilot) for your insurance company and know Mooneys well.

D

 

Edited January 21, 2025 by dkkim73

[Patrick Horan]

I just got off the phone with Brian Kenndrick! I'll be taking the plane to him next week and he'll be working on it February 23

[PilotX]

On 1/20/2025 at 7:34 AM, Patrick Horan said:

I wish there was a hyperbole. Unfortunately it's just been a mess. I will say the mooney shop did fix the leaks, after my mechanic did most of the work to get it flyable.

 

I have seen all of those. Leaks pooling in the speed brakes, oil on the tires. Some TLC and she will be right as rain. One of the things that likes to leak on mine are the valve cover gaskets, I replaced mine with the GB supplied ones when I re-did the baffles, not leak but the screws get loose over time, so every oil change is a good time to make sure everything is snug, also had "oil drain back clamps" loose as well as one of the turbo v band brackets (cool air side - phew) come loose and a turbo mounting bold fall out. Our fair share of quirks, probably largely due to the Lyc vibrations. Gonna get our prop worked on too. We tend to run 2200 rpm but the LYc just vibrates more. 

Once you get it dialed in (I am about 3 years and 330 hours into ownership) you will have a super capable traveling machine.

[Dammit Bill]

That’s Brian Kendrick putting my bird in the hangar (annual time). Flew her DFW-FXE on the 1st. Edison did a superb job resealing the tanks (I’ll do a separate post on that).
Brian is awesome. He knows you’re coming, Patrick.

1,055 miles w a :30 min fuel stop.
Headwinds suck


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Jetpilot86]

Where is Kendrick located?

[Niko182]

KHYI

[philiplane]

if #1 is hottest, that means that air is diving under the front of the cylinder, and that makes the entire side hot. Most air leaks are at the front of the engine, around the starter, alternator, and prop. 

[Patrick Horan]

17 hours ago, Dammit Bill said:

That’s Brian Kendrick putting my bird in the hangar (annual time). Flew her DFW-FXE on the 1st. Edison did a superb job resealing the tanks (I’ll do a separate post on that).
Brian is awesome. He knows you’re coming, Patrick.

1,055 miles w a :30 min fuel stop.
Headwinds suck


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I can't wait to take my plane there. I might fly it out on Wednesday 

[Fritz1]

If you hang around Hilton Garden Inn is about 10 min from airport, Black's Barbecue is awesome, rental cars are typically better priced in town, 7 min Uber ride