Unapproved radio calls poll, which are you?

[DXB]

53 minutes ago, MikeOH said:

My $0.02:

The following potential scenario is why I specifically state the runway I am clear of.  Say the airport has TWO runways and there just happens to be TWO Cessnas in the air each one going to DIFFERENT runways.  I am waiting to take off and one of the Cessnas lands on the runway I'm waiting for...then I hear Cessna XX "clear of all runways"...was that THE Cessna that just landed on my runway or the other Cessna on the other runway?  If I'm not fully engaged on whether it was Cessna XX or Cessna YY then I'm not certain.  Sure, you can blame me for not paying closer attention, but why is it so difficult to just state the actual runway you are clear of?  I don't see the upside of making it "all runways", or being non-specific.

Obviously, it's not necessary at airports with just one runway but I like to standardize my procedures as much as I can.

So that point is totally rational and makes a strong case for stating the runway you've just vacated at any field with multiple runways - a different argument from saying that people might somehow think you're declaring all runways clear and available to landing traffic by saying "Cessna XX is clear all runways."    

Then the question comes up should you say "Cessna XX clear 01" if that was the end you landed on or say "Cessna XX clear 01/19".  I'm not sure it matters much though it might prevent someone from screwing up the mental math of adding 18 if they were thinking about using 19.  

I suppose "Cessna XX is clear of the runway" is still equally useful to stating the number at a field with one runway? I'm not sure...

[MikeOH]

Just now, DXB said:

So that point is totally rational and makes a strong case for stating the runway you've just vacated at any field with multiple runways - a different argument from saying that people might somehow think you're declaring all runways clear and available to landing traffic by saying "Cessna XX is clear all runways."    

Then the question comes up should you say "Cessna XX clear 01" if that was the end you landed on or say "Cessna XX clear 01/19".  I'm not sure it matters much though it might prevent someone from screwing up the mental math of adding 18 if they were thinking about using 19.  

I suppose "Cessna XX is clear of the runway" is still better than stating the number at a field with one runway? I'm not sure...

Personally, I think the value of a consistent procedure (stating the runway number) outweighs avoiding stating the number because of possible confusion over runway 18 vs. 36 at single runway airports.  Honestly, this isn't an issue that I get all that worked up about...just my personal procedure and why I have it, that's all.

[wombat]

To remove ambiguity, I say "Traffic who might be in the vicinity of the Twisp airport, FAA airport code Two Sierra Zero, be advised that Mooney model Mike Two Zero Kilo, FAA Identifier Mike Two Zero Tango, November Fife Seven Seven Tree Sierra, Serial Number Two Fife Dash Zero Eight Four Two has now exited Runway One Zero.   I make no claims about the condition of this or any other runway, or about my position after exiting. Please contact my lawyer for all future communications.  Land at your own risk, warranty void if removed, offer void where prohibited by law, sign here to acknowledge your receipt of this radio transmission"

 

 

That was not actually true, it was a joke.  I say "Mooney 5773S clear of the runway"  If I'm at an airport with multiple runways, I'll often say "Clear of all runways"     But I do always include my full call sign.

@MikeOH If I extend your argument about two aircraft on different runways and someone inbound for landing getting confused about who is where, then what if one aircraft lines up while another is still rolling out?  The third aircraft in the pattern will think the runway is clear when it isn't.  They heard a call that someone was on final, then a call that someone was lining up on the runway, then a call that someone has cleared the runway.   So they've got no way of knowing if the runway is clear for landing.  Unless of course they look outside. 

[PeteMc]

50 minutes ago, wombat said:

Unless of course they look outside. 

Look OUTSIDE?!?!   Surely you jest!!!!   

That's why I have synthetic vision, Traffic on one screens, Wx on another screen.  WHY??????  Would anyone look out the window these days?!   

 

[MikeOH]

59 minutes ago, wombat said:

To remove ambiguity, I say "Traffic who might be in the vicinity of the Twisp airport, FAA airport code Two Sierra Zero, be advised that Mooney model Mike Two Zero Kilo, FAA Identifier Mike Two Zero Tango, November Fife Seven Seven Tree Sierra, Serial Number Two Fife Dash Zero Eight Four Two has now exited Runway One Zero.   I make no claims about the condition of this or any other runway, or about my position after exiting. Please contact my lawyer for all future communications.  Land at your own risk, warranty void if removed, offer void where prohibited by law, sign here to acknowledge your receipt of this radio transmission"

 

 

That was not actually true, it was a joke.  I say "Mooney 5773S clear of the runway"  If I'm at an airport with multiple runways, I'll often say "Clear of all runways"     But I do always include my full call sign.

@MikeOH If I extend your argument about two aircraft on different runways and someone inbound for landing getting confused about who is where, then what if one aircraft lines up while another is still rolling out?  The third aircraft in the pattern will think the runway is clear when it isn't.  They heard a call that someone was on final, then a call that someone was lining up on the runway, then a call that someone has cleared the runway.   So they've got no way of knowing if the runway is clear for landing.  Unless of course they look outside. 

You make a compelling argument to just go NORDO

[Hector]

I didn't do it to annoy anyone, but I use "Clear of the runway" as well.  I'm not just clear of runway 10, I'm clear of runway 28 as well.    Once I'm off, you can land any direction you want, for all I care!   
 

At my home airport KHEG (uncontrolled) it is a necessity to state you are clear of the runway. The main runway 25/7 has a hump at the middle such that you can’t see the opposite end of the runway from either end. If I’m waiting to take off on 25 or 7 and another plane has just landed I lose sight of that plane once he rolls past the hump midfield. I have to wait until he calls out he is clear of the runway before I initiate my takeoff roll. The locals all know this and are pretty good about calling out when they are clear of the runway but the transients not so much. It is not unusual for me to get on the radio and ask if they have cleared the runway if they don’t offer that info after a reasonable amount of time. For me it is standard practice no matter where I land to always call out clear of runway x


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[DXB]

15 hours ago, wombat said:

To remove ambiguity, I say "Traffic who might be in the vicinity of the Twisp airport, FAA airport code Two Sierra Zero, be advised that Mooney model Mike Two Zero Kilo, FAA Identifier Mike Two Zero Tango, November Fife Seven Seven Tree Sierra, Serial Number Two Fife Dash Zero Eight Four Two has now exited Runway One Zero.   I make no claims about the condition of this or any other runway, or about my position after exiting. Please contact my lawyer for all future communications.  Land at your own risk, warranty void if removed, offer void where prohibited by law, sign here to acknowledge your receipt of this radio transmission"

 

 

That was not actually true, it was a joke.  I say "Mooney 5773S clear of the runway"  If I'm at an airport with multiple runways, I'll often say "Clear of all runways"     But I do always include my full call sign.

@MikeOH If I extend your argument about two aircraft on different runways and someone inbound for landing getting confused about who is where, then what if one aircraft lines up while another is still rolling out?  The third aircraft in the pattern will think the runway is clear when it isn't.  They heard a call that someone was on final, then a call that someone was lining up on the runway, then a call that someone has cleared the runway.   So they've got no way of knowing if the runway is clear for landing.  Unless of course they look outside. 

Though satirical, you highlight the overall point of how best to meet the related goals of (1) being courteous, (2) enhancing safety, and (3) covering your butt. The AIM-codified best practices goes a long way toward all three but gets a little silly in some situations and may not go far enough in a few. At the same time, trying too hard to go above and beyond clogs up the freq. with people who just enjoy the sound of their own voice.  Saying you've vacated the runway in some form is one of those situations where going above and beyond just make sense to help meet those goals.

Also if you're not talking at all in the pattern (and you're not a J3 cub at your own private field) one can reasonably assume you're an a-hole who was too busy meowing on guard.

 

[Pinecone]

On 9/4/2024 at 8:40 AM, DXB said:

still makes zero sense to me - i am only reporting my own position and i dont see how it could be construed otherwise. Here “Mooney’s clear all runways” is elegant shorthand for “Mooney has  exited 01/19 and has not turned  onto 10/28 in the process in case anyone is using that one”. If I had turned onto another runway in the process its my obligation to say so. There is no situation where reporting your own position leads to inference of anyone else’s at nontowered field so I fail to see why it would here.

What is there is a plane on 10/28?  You land on 01 and call clear of all runways.  Other pilots assume that 10/28 is also clear.

If you call clear of 01, it is clear that you are clear of THAT runway only.

[Will.iam]

I think the horse died on page one of this topic. If not for sure by page two and I definitely didn’t see any movement by page three, for sure no breathing by page four, no pulse by page five, flies and rotting smell by page six. Only bones now on page seven. 

  

[tony]

2 minutes ago, Will.iam said:

I think the horse died on page one of this topic.   

I think so too

[Mufflerbearing]

I'm late to the party, but my .02 is with pilots that simply announce whatever but never listen to the radio.  I would rather hear some stuff that mildly bothers me than have a pilot do something stupid because he's not listening. 

About a month ago, coming into KCOE, my home drome, the seasonal tower was active.  It was a super busy day and 10 miles out, I couldn't get a word in anywhere.  My traffic screen was totally lit up and later learned we did 580 ops that day.  Thinking it better not to go in closer than 5 miles out, I just circled over Lake Coeur 'd Alene.  I finally had a break in the radio and they thought it ok for me to do a few more circuits which I was happy to do.  Got the call directing me to a Right downwind RW24.  I was then #2 behind a fire tanker jet.  In between the jet and me, the tower had an amphib take of from RW 24 which was ok.  Plenty of room.  IF that pilot actually started to take off!  Apparently that pilot was unaware of the busy nature of our airport that day and just sat on the RW numbers until I had no choice but to go around.  The tower was a little excited about the situation and told him to move it and do an immediate right turn as soon as he lifted off.  No harm, no foul, but darn it, listen and visualize where the planes are in the area!