Registering plane in Georgia

[M20F]

Any goofy tax implications or other concerns?

[rbridges]

You're going to be given an annual assessment based on the hull value of your plane.  It's considered property in Georgia.  Ideally, go to a county that has a lower mil rate if that's an option for you.  

 

[tony]

In general you will pay a tax on 40% of the assessed value of your airplane.  Its called an ad valorem tax.  So when you fill out the form, I don't think I would mention the new engine overhaul,, or the new paint job, or the new avionics suite you just installed.....

 

 

[GeeBee]

Yep, you pay the same rate as if it were a house. So a 200K airplane pays the same rate as a 200K house. It is based upon 40% of the market value. Basically figure about 1.2% of your market value will be what you pay annually. The only way out of it, is if your airplane is used in air carrier service. You are also required to fill out a tax return due by the end of April and under penalty of perjury, you are required to describe your airplane accurately, including copies of log book pages to prove time SMOH for the engine.

 

 

 

[Hank]

38 minutes ago, tony said:

In general you will pay a tax on 40% of the assessed value of your airplane.  Its called an ad valorem tax.  So when you fill out the form, I don't think I would mention the new engine overhaul,, or the new paint job, or the new avionics suite you just installed.....

 

 

In Alabama, much like with a car, the county just looks up the value somewhere and there it is! I think my last bill was $200?

[Hank]

5 minutes ago, GeeBee said:

Yep, you pay the same rate as if it were a house. So a 200K airplane pays the same rate as a 200K house. It is based upon 40% of the market value. Basically figure about 1.2% of your market value will be what you pay annually. The only way out of it, is if your airplane is used in air carrier service. You are also required to fill out a tax return due by the end of April and under penalty of perjury, you are required to describe your airplane accurately, including copies of log book pages to prove time SMOH for the engine.

That's awful! I just fill out a form, it's taxed as a business asset and it doesn't matter that I do not now, have not in the past and have no plans in the future to own a business or be a partner in one or even a principal in a business. Still taxed at business rates, by the county where it is based not the one where I live . . . .

Logbook copies? Detailed equipment lists? SMOH time? That's awful, and a hassle to comply with!

Edited May 24, 2022 by Hank

[GeeBee]

On the other hand, we made one heck of a business case for our airport when we pointed out the property taxes paid and how little services the city and county have to provide vs a subdivision of equal value. When you see how developers covet airport property, the taxes collected offer protection.

The ad-valorem tax also applies to boats, personal water craft, tractors etc. They used to have it on autos, but changed the method by which that tax is collected at the time of sale.

[M20F]

Thanks all.  While I do not appreciate your information, I appreciate YOU!

[KLRDMD]

It is a flat rate of $25/year in Arizona for most private airplanes.

[Hank]

In Ohio, it was $5 per seat, or $20 for any Mooney. That's not enough to make me want to live there . . . .

[Unit74]

It’s not ad valorum guys.  That’s on vehicles and a one time fee.  Aircraft are assessed in Ga. as personal property and paid to the county where the plane is stored, hangared, mostly parked, visits most the time, etc. I just spent 30 min in my county tax office trying to explain to them my situation with an AOG in a different state.  They said that sucks, but the plane is still registered here and you are a county resident, so pay up. 
 

If you owned a boat, and it was in another state on Jan 1st, it’s not assessed. I guess “Break Out Another Thousand” is somehow different than an airplane as far as where it is and what it can do.  So most boat owners move the boat, make sure to buy gas for it, or have a service receipt out of state and voilà, no property tax.   But if your plane is out of state, even in another country on Jan 1st, pay up as location is irrelevant on planes. 

[elimansour]

I believe that GA also imposes a use tax of 4% (+1-4%) on any tangible personal property brought into GA.   

[Hank]

14 minutes ago, elimansour said:

I believe that GA also imposes a use tax of 4% (+1-4%) on any tangible personal property brought into GA.   

Wow, it'll be expensive to move home . . . . Reckon I'll just stay here. 

[GeeBee]

48 minutes ago, Unit74 said:

It’s not ad valorum guys.  That’s on vehicles and a one time fee.  Aircraft are assessed in Ga. as personal property and paid to the county where the plane is stored, hangared, mostly parked, visits most the time, etc. I just spent 30 min in my county tax office trying to explain to them my situation with an AOG in a different state.  They said that sucks, but the plane is still registered here and you are a county resident, so pay up. 
 

If you owned a boat, and it was in another state on Jan 1st, it’s not assessed. I guess “Break Out Another Thousand” is somehow different than an airplane as far as where it is and what it can do.  So most boat owners move the boat, make sure to buy gas for it, or have a service receipt out of state and voilà, no property tax.   But if your plane is out of state, even in another country on Jan 1st, pay up as location is irrelevant on planes. 

No, ad-valorem means, "according to value" not "vehicles". All property taxed according to value regardless of "real" or "personal" is an "ad-valorem" tax. Read the first line here

https://georgiadata.org/sites/default/files/property_tax_guide_for_georgia_citezens_0.pdf

Second, removing a boat on January 1, does not relieve you of the property tax liability. It is based upon where the boat is located 184 days of a year, and if not, the place where the boat is located more than any other. I would draw your attention to GA form PT-50M:

"BOATS SHALL BE RETURNED TO THE COUNTY WHERE LOCATED 184 DAYS A YEAR OR MORE. LIST THE FAIR MARKET VALUE OF ALL BOATS AND MOTORS BELOW (EXCLUDE TRAILER)." 

Airplanes are like manner form PT-50A

 

AIRCRAFT SHALL BE RETURNED TO THE COUNTY WHERE PRIMARY HOME BASE IS LOCATED. LIST THE FAIR MARKET VALUE OF ALL AIRCRAFT UNDER TAXPAYER RETURN COLUMN BELOW.

The only effect of the date "January 1", is the fact that it is the date upon which the value is determined. It makes no difference if the boat or airplane is in state or out of stat

 

 

PT-50M_Marine_Personal_Property_Tax_Return_and_Schedules.pdf PT-50A_Aircraft_Personal_Property_Tax_Return_and_Schedules.pdf

[thinwing]

23 hours ago, KLRDMD said:

It is a flat rate of $25/year in Arizona for most private airplanes.

Also it is not even June yet and temp is a balmy 97 degrees!

[A64Pilot]

There are ways around it, I bought my airplane in Ga, it was registered to an LLC and he paid no tax, he offered me the LLC, but I didn’t want to own a Ga company.

‘He had bought the airplane from his buddy and they transferred the LLC, and no tax was due.

[KLRDMD]

59 minutes ago, thinwing said:

Also it is not even June yet and temp is a balmy 97 degrees!

Yep. Anything below 100º is comfortable. 100º-105º starts to get a bit warm. 105º-110º is hot and over 110º is just no fun. People always say it but it is true, it is a dry heat. One day last week we had humidity below 1%. It is below 10% most of the year. 105º in Tucson is much more comfortable than 90º in Houston. But we don't have near as many hot days per year that people think. Only in June and July is the average daily high temperature above 100º. 

There is a huge differenrence bewteen Tucson and Phoenix. In Phoenix it may be 105º during the day and it will be 100º at night. In Tucson it will be 100º during the day (only 5º cooler, what's the big deal?) In Tucson it will be 70º at night. We regularly see 30º-40º swings between night and day in Tucson, the entire year.

Tucson sees an average of about 65 days per year at 100º or higher, 55 of those are in June/July/August. There are an average of 286 days per year of sunshine in Tucson.

Overall taxes are reasonable, living expenses are reasonable, limitations on freedom are minimal and 300 days per year are gorgeous. There are a lot of places with less than 300 beautiful days per year.

[A64Pilot]

While I’ll make no promises or whatever you may want to look into this https://www.49dollarmontanaregisteredagent.com

The wealthy have their games too, like no Yacht in Fl flies the US flag, even though they are based in West Palm, the bizjets I’m sure aren’t owned by the person who flies in it, but s holding company or whatever the proper name is.

On edit, aircraft link

https://www.49dollarmontanaregisteredagent.com/montana-vehicle-registration/aircraft

Edited May 25, 2022 by A64Pilot

[GeeBee]

3 hours ago, A64Pilot said:

There are ways around it, I bought my airplane in Ga, it was registered to an LLC and he paid no tax, he offered me the LLC, but I didn’t want to own a Ga company.

‘He had bought the airplane from his buddy and they transferred the LLC, and no tax was due.

We are not talking about sales or transfer taxes. We are talking annual property taxes. The LLC would incur an annual tax liability based upon the value of the airplane. Some counties are better than others. If all they do is buy the "GA address registrations" from the FAA rather than go out to the local airport, you can dodge the assessor, but not the assessment and the penalties add up if they locate you. The county where I am at opens up every hangar on the airport, and records the N numbers. Lots of people who think Delaware LLC's is a shield get a rude awakening. The county where my boat is at, assessors walk the docks of the marinas. I always love to walk the docks in April, about 30% of the "new boats" have delinquency notices and are chained to the docks. My wife's niece is a Tax Commissioner for a GA county (an elected position). She loves people who think Delaware corporations shield them from annual assessment. The 10% penalty goes right to improvements in the tax office.

I might also add, that if the value of the aircraft is over 100K, the corporation also owes GA Net Worth tax in addition to ad-valorem on the aircraft, so  in that case it actually is more money than personal ownership. 

[A64Pilot]

Depends on how it’s done, I was talking sales tax, but an out of State Registered airplane, has an out of State address, so registration checks won’t catch you. Sales tax is not trivial

They way they would catch you in a ramp check type of thing is by hangar rental, I believe like a boat it has to spend the majority of the time in State, the burden of proof is I believe on you, so your guilty until proven innocent. Proving it was out of State can be tough, I can’t prove even where I was last year, much less my car, boat or airplane.

Tax people walking the docks in a Marina or airport is rare, I know because I lived aboard a boat for four years and spent time in Brunswick, one of only about three Marina’s in the State where you could legally live aboard. I’ve also kept airplanes for decades in Ga and never received a tax bill, but in small towns, I assume where your talking about is a large city. I’ve heard of the docks being walked in Fl, but never seen it, in Fl if a boat is in Fl for 90 days, law says it must have a Fl registration sticker.

I had a boat that I kept at the Navy Base in Panama City Fl, Ga sent me a tax bill, I went to the tax office in Albany and she said “You gots to pay you taxes” I read up on the law, got a statement from the Military marina that the boat had spent the whole year in Fl, took that to the tax office, she said prove you paid Fl taxes, I replied Fl doesn’t tax boats. Her answer “you gots to pay you taxes”. I knew I could get a Lawyer and win, but at a cost greater than the taxes and almost did, but just gave them their money and sold the boat. Your guilty until you prove your innocence, but even then sometimes they just want the money, they don’t care about right and wrong

The wealthy do it, there is a legal way, probably not ethical, but legal, look it up.

Edited May 26, 2022 by A64Pilot

[tony]

16 hours ago, A64Pilot said:

There are ways around it, I bought my airplane in Ga, it was registered to an LLC and he paid no tax, he offered me the LLC, but I didn’t want to own a Ga company.

‘He had bought the airplane from his buddy and they transferred the LLC, and no tax was due.

your friend was just lucky.  The airport just didn't report it to the county or he kept the airplane at a private strip.   For people like you describe, GA has a use tax.  The use tax is calculated the same way as the ad valorem tax....imagine that.  

[Igor_U]

23 hours ago, thinwing said:

Also it is not even June yet and temp is a balmy 97 degrees!

Is that good, or... 

[Mooneymite]

18 hours ago, GeeBee said:

.... you can dodge the assessor, but not the assessment ...

Wisdom.....

[GeeBee]

12 hours ago, A64Pilot said:

Depends on how it’s done, I was talking sales tax, but an out of State Registered airplane, has an out of State address, so registration checks won’t catch you. Sales tax is not trivial

They way they would catch you in a ramp check type of thing is by hangar rental, I believe like a boat it has to spend the majority of the time in State, the burden of proof is I believe on you, so your guilty until proven innocent. Proving it was out of State can be tough, I can’t prove even where I was last year, much less my car, boat or airplane.

Tax people walking the docks in a Marina or airport is rare, I know because I lived aboard a boat for four years and spent time in Brunswick, one of only about three Marina’s in the State where you could legally live aboard. I’ve also kept airplanes for decades in Ga and never received a tax bill, but in small towns, I assume where your talking about is a large city. I’ve heard of the docks being walked in Fl, but never seen it, in Fl if a boat is in Fl for 90 days, law says it must have a Fl registration sticker.

I had a boat that I kept at the Navy Base in Panama City Fl, Ga sent me a tax bill, I went to the tax office in Albany and she said “You gots to pay you taxes” I read up on the law, got a statement from the Military marina that the boat had spent the whole year in Fl, took that to the tax office, she said prove you paid Fl taxes, I replied Fl doesn’t tax boats. Her answer “you gots to pay you taxes”. I knew I could get a Lawyer and win, but at a cost greater than the taxes and almost did, but just gave them their money and sold the boat. Your guilty until you prove your innocence, but even then sometimes they just want the money, they don’t care about right and wrong

The wealthy do it, there is a legal way, probably not ethical, but legal, look it up.

If the wealthy have a way that I do not,  I should fire my lawyers and accountants.

 

[A64Pilot]

I’ve never had a Lawyer myself, but next time your in West Palm beach, Miami, Ft Lauderdale or anywhere the Yachts hang out, try to find one with a US flag. Good luck though trying to find out who actually owns a bizjet

https://www.icij.org/investigations/paradise-papers/offshore-gurus-help-rich-avoid-taxes-jets-yachts/