M20C Difficult to close cabin door

[BrettKS]

My M20C has a cabin door that is difficult to close. I replaced the weather seals on it recently that made it even more so, but the problem existed before replacing the strip and now that the strip has been installed for several months, I'm thinking there is more to it.

It is the style that has one lever that operates two latches, one on the side of the door, one on the top. I use the typical technique of pulling the handle aft then pushing firmly forward (from the inside), and it makes a loud snap as the door secures. The amount of pressure required is borderline uncomfortable, I feel like the lever is going to break. I'm wondering if the latch is misaligned somehow but am not sure how to go about troubleshooting. Has anyone had similar experiences?

 

[Shadrach]

 Are you Holding the door against the door frame forcefully when you rotate the latch?If the latch rotates easily when the door is open and the pins and hook articulate properly then the problem lies either with the receivers of the door hardware or it’s a technique problem. By 67F has the same style door at your aircraft. When I close the door, I pull it hard enough so that the door conforms with the doorframe.  Mine requires a fair amount of force to hold closed. So much so that it’s challenging to close the door from the passenger seat due to the lack of leverage.

Edited December 28, 2018 by Shadrach

[BrettKS]

16 minutes ago, Shadrach said:

 Are you Holding the door against the door frame forcefully when you rotate the latch?If the latch rotates easily when the door is open and the pins and hook articulate properly then the problem lies either with the receivers of the door hardware or it’s a technique problem. By 67F has the same style door at your aircraft. When I close the door, I pull it hard enough so that the door conforms with the doorframe.  Mine requires a fair amount of force to hold closed. So much so that it’s challenging to close the door from the passenger seat due to the lack of leverage.

Yes, I am holding it forecefully. My force of holding is limited by the leather strap that closes the door (I think it was part of a new interior that was done). Also, interestingly, the door is easier to close using the outside lever. I don't know whether ti has to do with a longer lever arm or the ease of pushing the door closer to the airframe.

[skydvrboy]

I have the opposite problem.  My door is easy to close and doesn't provide a solid seal around the top rear corner.  It's just enough of a gap that it sucks some of the wife's hair out of the plane.  Anyone know if the top latch is adjustable? 

I know it's not on the frame and I haven't had time to take the door apart to see if there is any way to adjust it inside the door.  If not, I'll need a thicker door seal to close the gap.

Edited December 28, 2018 by skydvrboy

[ArtVandelay]

Is the door flush with the body? Did you try it with the door seal removed?


Tom

[BrettKS]

45 minutes ago, ArtVandelay said:

Is the door flush with the body? Did you try it with the door seal removed?


Tom

The door is flush when it's closed. It doesn't become flush until the lever is actuated and the latch secured. It was difficult to do before I put the new door seal on. The old door seal was so thin I doubt it caused much resistance--and if it did, I think there is some other issue to address because it's designed to have a seal of some sort right?

 

Edited December 28, 2018 by BrettKS

[ArtVandelay]

The door is flush when it's closed. It doesn't become flush until the lever is actuated and the latch secured. It was difficult to do before I put the new door seal on. The old door seal was so thin I doubt it caused much resistance--and if it did, I think there is some other issue to address because it's designed to have a seal of some sort right?
 

If you want to check the door seal, use a dollar bill (or a $100 bill if you want to impress your friends) and shut the door on the bill, it should be securely held by the door seal pressure.
Try operating the latch with the door open, that will tell you if it’s internal problem inside the door.
Assuming it’s ok above, then you can make adjustments (on a J anyway) by turning the latch pin or whatever it’s called (mushroom part that is grabbed) while holding the nut, in your case you want to unscrew it.


Tom

[Igor_U]

I had a same problem years ago.

IIRC, when I replaced the seal, I needed to trim it somewhat in the area where door latches to the frame in order avoid the interference.

This was 11-12 years ago so my memory is fuzzy however, my door closes with ease and latching the handle provides satisfying "clunk" and positive locking feature.

It's 67F and YMMV.

[BrettKS]

6 hours ago, Igor_U said:

I had a same problem years ago.

IIRC, when I replaced the seal, I needed to trim it somewhat in the area where door latches to the frame in order avoid the interference.

This was 11-12 years ago so my memory is fuzzy however, my door closes with ease and latching the handle provides satisfying "clunk" and positive locking feature.

It's 67F and YMMV.

Thanks, I will take a closer look at the seal itself.

11 hours ago, ArtVandelay said:

If you want to check the door seal, use a dollar bill (or a $100 bill if you want to impress your friends) and shut the door on the bill, it should be securely held by the door seal pressure.
Try operating the latch with the door open, that will tell you if it’s internal problem inside the door.
Assuming it’s ok above, then you can make adjustments (on a J anyway) by turning the latch pin or whatever it’s called (mushroom part that is grabbed) while holding the nut, in your case you want to unscrew it.


Tom

Will look for the pin to turn. Thanks

[Guest]

Lubricate the seal with DC4 or Vaseline.  Rub thoroughly with your fingers working t into the seal.

Clarence

[Hank]

When I replaced the windlace on my door, it was difficult to close. I made sure to close and latch the door in the hangar for the next couple of months and it got easier. It still takes a good pull on the leather strap to let the door latch catch, and I only have the one latch in the middle.

[Buckeyechuck]

Caution. If your door latch turns hard, make certain you keep a set of vise grips or similar tool in your flight bag. If the pin in the door latch breaks you'll be stuck in your airplane.

I replaced my door seal two years back. It was very difficult to close initially but is better now, although still tight. 

[DXB]

6 hours ago, M20Doc said:

Lubricate the seal with DC4 or Vaseline.  Rub thoroughly with your fingers working t into the seal.

Clarence

This is a great place to start!  Wish I'd tried it first before futzing around ad nauseam with a similar problem.  

[BrettKS]

1 hour ago, DXB said:

This is a great place to start!  Wish I'd tried it first before futzing around ad nauseam with a similar problem.  

Yes, I'll give this a try!

2 hours ago, Buckeyechuck said:

Caution. If your door latch turns hard, make certain you keep a set of vise grips or similar tool in your flight bag. If the pin in the door latch breaks you'll be stuck in your airplane.

I replaced my door seal two years back. It was very difficult to close initially but is better now, although still tight. 

That'd be an annoying problem! Good suggestion.

[carusoam]

A good hex wrench can...

• remove BK radios from the panel and
• double as a door handle... if the roll pin gets away...

New seals and windlace are known to make door closing challenging.

 

You know you are a new Mooniac with the words windlace and roll pin...

Best regards,

-a-

[Hank]

31 minutes ago, carusoam said:

A good hex wrench can...

• remove BK radios from the panel and
• double as a door handle... if the roll pin gets away...

New seals and windlace are known to make door closing challenging.

 

You know you are a new Mooniac with the words windlace and roll pin...

Best regards,

-a-

Yep, I've had the door handle break at the roll pin. After landing with a total electrical failure, so I couldn't call for help. Fortunately the only other person at the airport noticed me waving my hat out the storm window and opened the door to let my CFII and I out.

[BrettKS]

6 minutes ago, Hank said:

Yep, I've had the door handle break at the roll pin. After landing with a total electrical failure, so I couldn't call for help. Fortunately the only other person at the airport noticed me waving my hat out the storm window and opened the door to let my CFII and I out.

Now that's some luck!

[Guest]

6 hours ago, Hank said:

Yep, I've had the door handle break at the roll pin. After landing with a total electrical failure, so I couldn't call for help. Fortunately the only other person at the airport noticed me waving my hat out the storm window and opened the door to let my CFII and I out.

That happened to a buddy of mine who got trapped in his Twin Comanche.  It might be a good idea to have a small pair of Vicegrips under the seat.

Clarence

[Hank]

2 hours ago, M20Doc said:

That happened to a buddy of mine who got trapped in his Twin Comanche.  It might be a good idea to have a small pair of Vicegrips under the seat.

I keep a toolkit in the back, but it was easier to be rescued than to climb over the seats and get it. There's also a Swiss Army knife in the seat pocket under my knees.

[mike_elliott]

On 12/29/2018 at 6:51 AM, M20Doc said:

Lubricate the seal with DC4 or Vaseline.  Rub thoroughly with your fingers working t into the seal.

Clarence

and do this every year to keep the seal in good shape

[mike_elliott]

3 hours ago, M20Doc said:

That happened to a buddy of mine who got trapped in his Twin Comanche.  It might be a good idea to have a small pair of Vicegrips under the seat.

Clarence

Kelly McMullen sat on a hot ramp in Gladewater TX because of the roll pin falling out of his 66 E's handle. Dmax couldnt understand why he didnt get out and come inside. Eventually, Dmax went out to see what was going on, only to find a frantic McMullen he let out.

Upon hearing that story about 15 years ago, I safetywired the roll pin in place on my F's door handle.

Stewie on the other hand in the Commanche was fortunate Clarence was in the chase plane and could rescue him!

[moodychief]

I keep a small pair of vice grips next to the front passenger seat.  I always brief the emergency procedure using vice grips should the pin break.  Actually had to use the vice grips yesterday in 20 degree weather when the pin broke.

[Hank]

3 hours ago, mike_elliott said:

Kelly McMullen sat on a hot ramp in Gladewater TX because of the roll pin falling out of his 66 E's handle. Dmax couldnt understand why he didnt get out and come inside. Eventually, Dmax went out to see what was going on, only to find a frantic McMullen he let out.

Upon hearing that story about 15 years ago, I safetywired the roll pin in place on my F's door handle.

Stewie on the other hand in the Commanche was fortunate Clarence was in the chase plane and could rescue him!

Safety wire wouldn't have helped me, the handle cracked through the two roll pin holes . . . Finding a replacement was challenging.