Screw Kits

[HRM]

6 hours ago, M20F-1968 said:

Just figure out what hardware you need (screw sizes, etc) and order those from Aircraft Spruce.  Much cheaper, and you can get just what you know you will use and need.

John Breda

 

5 hours ago, N201MKTurbo said:

$143.00 will buy a lot of screws!

Perhaps someone here, or the community should put together a comprehensive hardware list with human readable descriptions along with which models use them. Then when someone wanted to buy some hardware they could just get it from the list instead of drilling through parts manuals. It would sure save me a lot of time.

Well, there's the rub (Hamlet, Wm Shakespeare).

What would be wonderful is a Spruce wish list with a couple of each of all of them, because I have no idea which ones are which and so many annuals have mixed screws all over the place.

<sigh>

[Hank]

6 hours ago, N201MKTurbo said:

Perhaps someone here, or the community should put together a comprehensive hardware list with human readable descriptions along with which models use them. Then when someone wanted to buy some hardware they could just get it from the list instead of drilling through parts manuals. It would sure save me a lot of time.

That's the wrong approach! My Mooney only uses three screws in any quantity (four if you count those little one in the doghouse). Next annual, when she's all opened up, measure them and order 100 of each. (You get a nice price break at 100 each.) Save your ticket from Spruce, too. Mine may be at the hangar,  I'll check in the morning. 

[Andy95W]

It really is pretty simple.

1/2” 10-32- about 40

1/2” 8-32 countersunk - about 100

1/2” #8 PK (B type) - about 40

about 4 or so 1/2” 8-32 pan head

about 6 or so 1/2” 6-32 countersunk

pre-1966 cowling- add about 60 of the #8 PK

[Guest]

Mooney must have owned a screw factory in the day.

4R x3/8” gear doors, wing root fairings,

6R x1/2” tail close out strips,

8R x1/2” left and right exhaust ducts and early cowl sides,

10R x 1/2” some belly panels,

AN507-632R8 belly panel at nose wheel well

AN507-832-R6/R8 wing inspection panels

AN526-832R6/R8 wing inspection panels

AN507-1032R8 cowl nose bowls,

AN526-1032R8 belly panels, some cowl nose bowls,

Southco studs, rings and receptacles on avionics door, early

Camloc 2700 series studs rings and receptacles on avionics door later,

Camloc 2700 and 4000 series studs, grommets, rings and receptacles on cowls

That covers a bunch of the ones I’ve seen.

Clarence

[RLCarter]

There's something like 640 screws on the inspection covers on the bottom of the wings on my E, it's a crap load.of screws

[HRM]

4 hours ago, Hank said:

four if you count those little one in the doghouse

Exactly!

[bradp]

McMaster has good prices on the screws.  I usually get some before annual for the inevitable replacements. Last annual I replaced all the belly screws... it was much cheaper than AS or the kits. 

[Hank]

1 hour ago, bradp said:

McMaster has good prices on the screws.  I usually get some before annual for the inevitable replacements. Last annual I replaced all the belly screws... it was much cheaper than AS or the kits. 

I don't use those . . . The heads are smaller diameter than aircraft screws, and the countersink angle is different (only my belly screws are coumtersunk).

[N201MKTurbo]

1 hour ago, Hank said:

I don't use those . . . The heads are smaller diameter than aircraft screws, and the countersink angle is different (only my belly screws are coumtersunk).

McMaster may actually have the aircraft screws. What you won’t get from McMaster is any certs.

[jaylw314]

6 hours ago, bradp said:

McMaster has good prices on the screws.  I usually get some before annual for the inevitable replacements. Last annual I replaced all the belly screws... it was much cheaper than AS or the kits. 

You do need to make sure you get 100deg flat head screws if you do, NOT 82 or 90 deg.  100deg countersinking is universal in aviation, whereas it is very unusual in typical hardware. 

3 hours ago, N201MKTurbo said:

McMaster may actually have the aircraft screws. What you won’t get from McMaster is any certs.

McMaster does sell screws that meet MS24693 and other standards.  If I understand correctly, there is no paperwork necessary for standard replacement fasteners that meet those requirements, right?

[HRM]

Just now, jaylw314 said:

100deg countersinking is universal in aviation, whereas it is very unusual in typical hardware. 

Indeed! Won't find them at Lowe's or the local ACE with those isles full of trays of parts. Another reason to just spring for the kit.

[N201MKTurbo]

3 hours ago, jaylw314 said:

You do need to make sure you get 100deg flat head screws if you do, NOT 82 or 90 deg.  100deg countersinking is universal in aviation, whereas it is very unusual in typical hardware. 

McMaster does sell screws that meet MS24693 and other standards.  If I understand correctly, there is no paperwork necessary for standard replacement fasteners that meet those requirements, right?

Well, actually, yes. But it is unlikely anybody will give you any trouble for it.

When my company does projects for the missile boys down south, we have to buy all the screws from a vendor who will send certs. Aircraft Spruce sends certs with everything they ship. When you buy a certified screw, you can literally trace it back to where the iron ore was mined.

[jaylw314]

11 minutes ago, N201MKTurbo said:

Well, actually, yes. But it is unlikely anybody will give you any trouble for it.

When my company does projects for the missile boys down south, we have to buy all the screws from a vendor who will send certs. Aircraft Spruce sends certs with everything they ship. When you buy a certified screw, you can literally trace it back to where the iron ore was mined.

Is that regulatory for part 91, regulatory for all maintenance, or only a "just in case we're audited" thing?

[N201MKTurbo]

5 minutes ago, jaylw314 said:

Is that regulatory for part 91, regulatory for all maintenance, or only a "just in case we're audited" thing?

The FAA is very serious about counterfeit parts. There have been some serious cases of people making fake aircraft parts. The only way you can prove the parts you are using meets the type certificate of the aircraft is to have certs.

If you worked for the airlines or a big repair station and the FAA inspector asked you to prove your screws were genuine, and you couldn’t, there would be hell to pay. 

The only way a shade tree aircraft mechanic would get in trouble, would be if they were ramp checked and the inspector found commercial screws in your airplane.

personally, I keep the receipts for everything I buy for the plane. The receipts can be traced too, so if anybody asked I can show them where I bought them. 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unapproved_aircraft_part

 

[jaylw314]

2 minutes ago, N201MKTurbo said:

The FAA is very serious about counterfeit parts. There have been some serious cases of people making fake aircraft parts. The only way you can prove the parts you are using meets the type certificate of the aircraft is to have certs.

If you worked for the airlines or a big repair station and the FAA inspector asked you to prove your screws were genuine, and you couldn’t, there would be hell to pay. 

The only way a shade tree aircraft mechanic would get in trouble, would be if they were ramp checked and the inspector found commercial screws in your airplane.

personally, I keep the receipts for everything I buy for the plane. The receipts can be traced too, so if anybody asked I can show them where I bought them. 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unapproved_aircraft_part

IIRC, there was an accident that resulted from counterfeit parts, which were counterfeited by the seller's suppliers.  It stands to reason the FAA would be interested in having a chain of authenticity through the supplier network, but once it got to into the mechanic's or owner's hands (assuming part 91).  It's hard to imagine the FAA would come after you if you bought a counterfeit part sold as authentic, for not having a certificate--if anything, you'd be the victim, not the counterfeiter. 

[N201MKTurbo]

15 minutes ago, jaylw314 said:

IIRC, there was an accident that resulted from counterfeit parts, which were counterfeited by the seller's suppliers.  It stands to reason the FAA would be interested in having a chain of authenticity through the supplier network, but once it got to into the mechanic's or owner's hands (assuming part 91).  It's hard to imagine the FAA would come after you if you bought a counterfeit part sold as authentic, for not having a certificate--if anything, you'd be the victim, not the counterfeiter. 

If you are the victim, then you have nothing to worry about. If you are buying and using parts that cannot be traced, then you are the purpatrator. 

[N201MKTurbo]

Here are some more ACs from the feds:

https://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/media/Advisory_Circular/AC_21-29D.pdf

https://www.faa.gov/documentLibrary/media/Advisory_Circular/AC 20-62E.pdf

 

Edited June 18, 2018 by N201MKTurbo

[HRM]

Good grief! That screws kit from Spruce is looking better all the time--and they do specify that it is for the Mooney M20 series.

[carusoam]

Harley do you have a MM and Parts manual for the Super plane you have?

Zipping through the parts pages you quickly see the most important fasteners in there... some of the names have been changed for SS, but the length and type haven’t changed...

You can always search every fastener in there.  A little time consuming but it can be done...

For the C, I bought a kit from AS&S.  Then year after year bought specific bits and pieces...by the dozen...

I like tossing old fasteners at the first hint of the tool slipping in the head...  and got a handful of screw driver tips to go in my powered driver...

Set the driver to the lowest torque... go slowly, then hand tighten the rest of the way...  PP working with a mechanic...

Best regards,

-a-

[RLCarter]

I use one of these Black & Decker, small and light weight, not a lot of torque, and buy good bits

 

 

 

[HRM]

12 hours ago, carusoam said:

You can always search every fastener in there.  A little time consuming but it can be done...

 

Anthony, again I quote the Bard--there's the rub.

[HRM]

11 hours ago, RLCarter said:

...and buy good bits.

Milwaukee SHOCKWAVE Driver Bits

[DualRatedFlyer]

On 6/15/2018 at 9:57 PM, M20Doc said:

Mooney must have owned a screw factory in the day.

4R x3/8” gear doors, wing root fairings,

6R x1/2” tail close out strips,

8R x1/2” left and right exhaust ducts and early cowl sides,

10R x 1/2” some belly panels,

AN507-632R8 belly panel at nose wheel well

AN507-832-R6/R8 wing inspection panels

AN526-832R6/R8 wing inspection panels

AN507-1032R8 cowl nose bowls,

AN526-1032R8 belly panels, some cowl nose bowls,

Southco studs, rings and receptacles on avionics door, early

Camloc 2700 series studs rings and receptacles on avionics door later,

Camloc 2700 and 4000 series studs, grommets, rings and receptacles on cowls

That covers a bunch of the ones I’ve seen.

Clarence

As someone who knows nothing about screws, but enjoys crawling under the oily belly to swap a stripped screw just as much as the next guy, is there a standard way to decipher these?

AN- aviation designation? 526? 832 is 8-32 thread size? R6/R8?

I.E- whats the difference between these two screws 

AN507-832-R6/R8 wing inspection panels

AN526-832R6/R8 wing inspection panels

[Hank]

A lot depends on the year. My 1970 C only uses three screws; not sure if the cheek & cowl dzus are the same size as the avionics panel or not.

I'll look up my Spruce invoice for sizes if you want (it's saved for reference):  spinner, wing & tail panels, one piece belly & cowl (countersunk with washers).

I generally buy 100 of each screw ti bring the prices down (~8 cents each that way).

[Andy95W]

3 hours ago, DualRatedFlyer said:

As someone who knows nothing about screws, but enjoys crawling under the oily belly to swap a stripped screw just as much as the next guy, is there a standard way to decipher these?

AN- aviation designation? 526? 832 is 8-32 thread size? R6/R8?

I.E- whats the difference between these two screws 

AN507-832-R6/R8 wing inspection panels

AN526-832R6/R8 wing inspection panels

AN- Army-Navy.  Designation replaced by MILSPEC, which adds a whole new set of numbers.

832 is 8-32 thread size (actually, #8 diameter, 32 threads per inch)

R6/R8 etc. is length in 16ths, so R8 is 8/16 inch, or 1/2 inch long.

AN507/526 etc. is the type of screw like pan head, countersunk, etc.

The best place to see the different type of screws is just by looking through the Aircraft Spruce and Specialty catalog and do a search for the AN number.  Pictures and descriptions pop up nicely.