First Annual Inspection

[jelswick]

My first annual (at a Mooney service center) on my C model I started with was just a little over $5K.  I let the local mechanic do it the next year thinking I'd alternate each year local then service center and his on my 2nd annual was about $11K.  The items made sense and he'd caught things the service center hadn't and while it took months to quit stinging from that amount, I was glad he'd done it since my families lives depend on it when we go on vacations.  After that one, the airplane was whipped into shape from some neglect from the prior owner's lower maitenance (I was not a smart buyer on that first one) and future annuals were all in the $2-3.5K range.  I love that mechanic because he loses sleep worrying about what he might have missed and spends my money like it was his, so I never question when he says something should be addressed.  If he says it's getting close to requiring replacement or rework, I just tell him to go ahead and do it.

My current Mooney, an '81 J has been a dream from a maintenance perspective (I say as it goes into its 4th annual with me owning it, so knock on wood) and typically runs $2,500-3,500 per annual with almost no maintenance required between them.  I bought it from Wilmar trusting a little better their reputation and it's proven to be a good place to place my trust, a serious joy to own this aircraft.

[scottfromiowa]

Hey N4352H,

Did you re-rig before it was out of rig?  You know, "fix it BEFORE IT BREAKS?"

[Carl S]

[John Pleisse]

Quote: scottfromiowa

Hey N4352H,

Did you re-rig before it was out of rig?  You know, "fix it BEFORE IT BREAKS?"

[scottfromiowa]

N4352H:  REALLY. 

What about vaccum pumps, lights, Boost pumps?  Replace after a scheduled time or hours, or inspect and repair/replace when they fail.  REALLY?  I don't OWE patronage to anyone.  I pay a fee for a service.  When I experience a value and quality at a fair price I MAY choose to continue to utilize that individual/location for continued service.  As a customer I am OWED a quality service for an agreed upon price.  Do I value quality?  Absolutely.  Will I travel hours to get that quality at additional expense?  Maybe.  Do you have to work on Mooney's and ONLY Mooney's to be qualified to do engine and airframe work on Mooney's and be considered "qualifed".  Some obviously feel that is the case.  I do not.  If I lived right next to Wilmer or Don Maxwell or other service centers would I use them.  Maybe.  My Plane, my money.

[N33GG]

For what it's worth, there's not much that is unique to Mooneys here (yes, I know, Mooneys are different and have certain things that B, C, and P shops don't know).  I have bought several different aircraft over the years, and rarely get a plane that has been maintained to a level that I would prefer.  And if I buy a plane that is super well maintained, I would expect to pay a bit of a premium for it.  And further, when I sell an airplane, I usually get a premium because of the maintenance that I have paid for, and hence, get some of my money back. 

When I am shopping for a used plane, no matter how good the plane looks, and how well I am assured of great maintenance, I just expect to find a bunch of problems that range from annoying to rediculous.  And I am rarely disappointed.

There is not enough memory on the internet to list all of the horror stories I have seen and personally experienced. 

Last but not least, I do live near Don Maxwell, and am very glad that I do.  Over the years, I have used many different A&P's.  Don is awesome!  I highly recommend him.

[John Pleisse]

Benefits.....Factory trained, more time in type, accountability, reputation, availability of parts, experience on common mods, higher average tenure of A&P's, $2,000 increase in valuation on resale, more after market STC's developed and installed by MSC's than not. (probably a few on your E model)...............

Call the American Bonanza Society and have them give you the name of a factory trained Bonanza Shop or ask Beech Raytheon for information on the type cert of a V35 B....they won't. If you own a Mooney you've got it good and a Mooney Service Center is a great resource. Can't apologize for, or argue that. There's qualified.......and then there's bona fide.

 

 

 

 

[HopePilot]

I see you mentioned my "Guess How Long To Get A Rocker Switch" thread.  Guess what?  I'm still waiting!  That's not a joke...I'm serious!

[Carl S]

Quote: HopePilot

I see you mentioned my "Guess How Long To Get A Rocker Switch" thread.  Guess what?  I'm still waiting!  That's not a joke...I'm serious!

[1964-M20E]

I’m finishing up my first annual hopefully will be out for a test flight on Saturday.  No MSCs nearby that I can drive to when there is a problem.  My mechanic / IA is more than willing to do owner assisted annuals.  However after 5 weeks of going there most every evening and on Saturdays I’m ready to go flying again and be finished with the annual.   I have learned a lot about my Mooney and about aviation mechanics.  I have been completely through automobiles; houses etc. and while most things carry over there are a few things specific to aviation.

 

I do have a question for the audience.  Do you disassemble the shock discs at each annual?  The mechanic was reading the manual and that popped up.

 

Just curious to see what other do or if the factory has changed the procedure.

 

I’m going to try and contact Mooney today.

[danb35]

Quote: 1964-M20E

I do have a question for the audience.  Do you disassemble the shock discs at each annual?

[thinwing]

God no!!!That would be torture and not at all necessary to determine condition...the accepted procedure is measure them for rebound 1/2 hr after jacking,look for crazing/cracking rubber,check to makesure they donot freely rotate...its all in the mooney 40 point inspection guide..you are using the inspection guide right???kp couch

[richardheitzman]

(drinking cool aid this morning).

I love the discussions about taking a Mooney aircraft into a Mooney Service Center or not. As most of you know I ran the Mooney Service Network for about 4.5 years. I did one "on site" annual factory training program and then developed the "online" version. I used to tell the mechanics " I am not teaching you how to be a mechanic, I am teaching you about Mooney Aircraft". SO what's the biggest deal about going to a Mooney Service Center for your Mooney Aircraft:

1. Access to Mooney factory parts at a reasonable price (sometimes they can and will pass on a percentage of the discount they get from Mooney off list price to you)

2. Factory trained mechanics some with 20+ years experience working on Mooney aircraft (and other aircraft but we are talking Mooney)

3. They are contractually required to carry at least $ 1 million in completed operations insurance. (does your "local guy" do that?)

4. They have the financial resources to back up thier repairs and service with a warranty. They have all the Mooney specific tooling.

5. Most carry a great reputation and do a fantastic job. (Don Maxwell, LASAR, etc)

Also they are a great bunch of people who stand by the aircraft and have the passion for them that can not be found elsewhere. They know where to go to find that hard to get part.

I love you guys and I know that some of you would never set foot in a MSC if your life depended on it, and that is your choice. Some of you think that your local guy is the best and he may be, and that's ok. I am a great mechanic and carry my A&P and my pilot's license with pride, but I will be the first to tell you that rigging (correctly) a landing gear system on a Mooney (by the book) is a complete pain in the a$$ and I have seen more aircraft nose down on the runway because some "great" local mechanic screwed up. (remember that completed operations insurance?).

Remember we didn't teach them to be mechanics, we taught them how to work on Mooney aircraft.

Also BTW, Stacy is the only one left in Technical/Customer support at Mooney. If you want answers and help on your technical questions you better be calling a MSC, because Stacey is busy helping MSC questions. He will not have time to answer your questions.

Rich

 

[fantom]

Quote: richardheitzman

....I am a great mechanic.....

Also BTW, Stacy is the only one left in Technical/Customer support at Mooney. If you want answers and help on your technical questions you better be calling a MSC, because Stacey is busy helping MSC questions. He will not have time to answer your questions.

[Hank]

And you can renew your driver's license through the mail!

No income tax . . .

[carusoam]

Rich,

I keep drinking the Kool-aide...

Going to the MSC is the only place where there are always 10 - 20 mooneys all opened up for various new ideas and upgrades.  Its fuel for the addiction....

Best regards,

-a-

[fantom]

Two of the finest Mooney views I ever recall are the Las Vegas MAPA meeting a number of years ago with about 100 Mooneys tied down is a single straight abreast line. From the open air  top floor of the terminal it was an amazing sight that took my breath away. Someone must have a photo of it.

The second great view was the first time, in 2000, I landed and taxied to a far group of hangers at this sleepy little airport in Gladewater, Texas, finally spotting an old Mooney logo sign above two of the hangers and about 6 or 7 Mooneys outside. It was a lousy WX afternoon, but Don Maxwell comes out and looks the plane over, we go for a short hop so he can get the feel of her, and as soon as we're back, room has been cleared in the hanger and two mechanics walk her in, all the while checking lights and other stuff that Don is telling them, as the plane rolls into position in the hanger. It was another sight to behold.

Mooney heaven Kool-Aide...

[Mooney_Allegro]

My annual at the factory MSC was $23,843 last year.  I had a lot done last year, however there were some items that were cosmetic.  A lot of these items were not airworthy items, so it was my choice to get them addressed & I chose to.  Many of the items were on my descrepancy list I brought to Mooney, so it was no surprise that it would be an expensive annual.  Here is a list of items:

1) Fuel smell in cabin - replaced fuel pickup assembly gasket w/new.

2) Adjust trailing edge of RH and LH wings to prevent chafing on leading edge flap.

3) Replace nose tire

4) Replace cabin door seal

5) 2 screws stripped on nose tire hubcap

6) install throw rugs w/Mooney emblem 2 front carpets

7) Replace no step decals

8) Replace fuel cap and fuel grade placards

9) Adjust stall warning (comes on early)

10) Replace step skid material

11) Replace fuel cap o-rings

12) corrected installation of Lt and RT cowl flaps, and repaint scraped areas.

13) replace top cowling camloc holes w/hysol and repaint

14) Remove spare belly transponder, fiberglass repair and paint to match

15) Replace compass housing

16) Replace baggage placards

17) Install clear pocket for airworthiness cert. & registration cert.

18) Replace MLG and NG tire pressure placards

19) Replace do not push empenage placards

20) Adjust baggage door so it closes straight

21) Replaced baggage door seal/windlace

22) Replace front carpet and lower side panel carpets

23) Replace battery w/new Concorde

24) Replace nose truss placards

25) Replace baggage door handle with new unpainted

26) Replace gascolator drain decal

27) Paint emerg. engage handle and install new placard

28) Downbleed brakes and replenish fluid to remove congealed hyd. fluid at calipers

29) Shimmed cabin door for proper clearance

30) Do Honeywell SM292 Service Memo(sent out pitch, roll and trim servos for proper operation) $2575 just for this!

31) Comply w/Bendix King Install Bulletin IB343

32) Repair pitch servo after it blew up after re-install after doing the SM292. $500

33) Comply with ICA to Precise Flight 100 speed brakes

34) Flap indication needs adjustment

35) #3 & #4 EGT probes loose

36) Mag timing out

37) Replaced RAM air duct w/new

38) Replaced RH heater duct clamps w/new

39) Replaced LH engine baffle assembly due to crack

40) Replaced all 4 engine mounts ($1808.68)

41) Engine heater pad wire harness loose

42) Dress prop blades

43) Mixture friction tight

44) LH and RH exhaust cavities need to be sealed at firewall

45) Rigged aileron control system neutral and travels to spec

46) Rigged rudder neutral to 1 degree to the right

47) Rigged landing gear system to spec

48) Cleaned RH and LH brake caliper and resealed w/o-rings

49) rotate tires

50) tightened oil filler tube and resaftied

51) Replace LT brake linings

52) Fabricate cover for emerg. gear handle

53) Added pockets to pilot and copilot side panels

54) Cleaned, polished and lubed RH Aft wemac

55) inspect behind panel for chafing wiring

56) Corrected installation of LT and RT aft light lenses for nav lights

57) Replaced cabin vent window Do Not Open w/new

58) Replaced speedbrake cartridge exterior screws and touched up

59) Replaced more decals..fuel drains, pitot drains, static drains, speed brake

60) Removed and replaced baggage carpet w/new

61) balance propeller

62) Replaced Tanis eng. heater wire

63) Replaced master relay (broke at Mooney) $603

64) Autopilot would not pass test(broke at Mooney), $1485 for repair by Mid-Continent

65) Replace cabin windlace

66) Replace gear well boot duct tape w/aluminum tape smoothed

67) Replace gear up limit switches (1 broke at Mooney), decided to replace the other one too $869

68) Mooney SBM20-289 due on aileron control link rodends

69) Pilot seat armrest broken(happened at Mooney) $343

70) pilot seat back bottom broken

End of list.  I expect this years annual to be $2400. Hopefully I'll get last years annual paid off by then!  Most of the items on this list were items where I could have rejected, but I decided to have them done. The people at Mooney were great. I had constant contact through emails, text messages, and phone calls throughout the entire annual.  I tried to get down to Kerrville every week to 2 weeks to physically check on the progress.  The annual took about 2 months, but we did have an extensive list of items.  If I took my plane back to Mooney this year (if they were open), I anticipate it would cost about $2400-$2500.  The plane is 13 years old, and I like to maintain it so that it looks like new & is reliable.  1st year annual cost $6000, 2nd year cost $4800 (both Mooney Service Centers in GA), 3rd year (non-Mooney Service Center cost $2400).  Last year was off my scale, but I never expect another annual like that for a long time.  If I had to do it all over again, I would take it to Mooney in Kerrville.  They treated me the best w/excellent customer service.

[Cris]

Price is what you pay & value is what you get. Over the years I have used both MSC's & independant mechanics/shops with great results from both albeit at differant rates. I often tell folks the differance between a smart guy & a dumb one is that the smart guy knows what he dosen't know. That analogy works for mechanics. If you use a trusted mechanic for whatever reason who is not an MSC your confidence will be rewarded if he says "This is really Mooney specific ie rigging etc & I'd recommend you take it to an MSC". I have to admit it has been almost a decade since I last owned a Mooney & with my previous 6 Mooney's never recalled that you had to take it to an MSC to maintain it properly nor did anyone really ascribe any extra value to it. In addition I like to do owner assisted annuals which many MSC's frown over so for me the value is in the learning & the confidence is in the trust. I purchased my low time Eagle this year only to find the circuit breaker on the load+ would constantly trip but their was no specific load or time in flight that would cause it to happen. My 75 year old mechanic looked at it as well as the minor fuel leaks and said "this needs to go to Air-Mods Robbinsville NJ"-an MSC. Turned out to be a washer lodged behind the circuit breaker which Air-Mods found quickly & fixed efficiently as well as the tank leaks. They also checked & adjusted the rigging since one gear door had been repaired without a log entry. No issue but I felt better!  The old owner paid just prior to the pre buy for a new alternator & battery that was not needed! When that did'nt work he installed a backup alternator! That is the issue with so many mechanics these days they are parts replacers & not diagnosticians. I can replace parts with a little supervision but my diagnostic skills.... So as my A/C comes out of an owner assited inexpensive annual I have brought up to date all service bullitens as well as A/D's. I have the confidence to know everything was checked according to the book since we used the Mooney Maintenance & Service Manual which I supplied. I have begun to use the Ad Log system to keep meticulous records & I know that if I have an issue that requires more Mooney expertise my mechanic will send me on my way. In short I have true value-for me.  

[PTK]

Quote: N6784N

I guess I don't have to tell you it's best to take the plane to a mooney service center. My first annual was pretty inexpensive somewhere around 3k but last year I took the plane to a service center and they dinged me for around 20k but the plane does fly alot better. I had gear door problems and it was hard to get the gear up due to binding so maybe it is a common thing. I'm still not quite sure why people let aircraft get so out of shape and still fly them much less sell them to another person but I guess thats the world we live in today. Good luck with the annual

[PTK]

Quote: Cris

Over the years I have used both MSC's & independant mechanics/shops with great results from both. I often tell folks the differance between a smart guy & a dumb one is that the smart guy knows what he dosen't know. That analogy works for mechanics. If you use a trusted mechanic for whatever reason who is not an MSC your confidence will be rewarded if he says "This is really Mooney specific ie rigging etc & I'd recommend you take it to an MSC". I have to admit it has been almost a decade since I last owned a Mooney & with my previous 6 Mooney's never recalled that you had to take it to an MSC to maintain it properly nor did anyone really ascribe any extra value to it. In addition I like to do owner assisted annuals which many MSC's frown over so for me the value is in the learning & the confidence is in the trust. I purchased my low time Eagle this year only to find the circuit breaker on the load+ would constantly trip but their was no specific load or time in flight that would cause it to happen. My 75 year old mechanic looked at it as well as the minor fuel leaks and said "this needs to go to Air-Mods Robbinsville NJ". Turned out to be a washer lodged behind the circuit breaker which Air-Mods found quikly & fixed efficiently as well as the tank leaks. They also chceked & adjusted the rigging since one gear door had been repaired without a log entry. No issue but I felt better!  The old owner paid just prior to the pre buy for a new alternator & battery that was not needed! When that did'nt work he installed a backup alternator! That is the issue with so many mechanics these days they are parts replacers & not diagnosticians. I can replace parts with a little supervision but my diagnostic skills.... So as my A/C comes out of an owner assited inexpensive annual I have brought up to date all service bullitens as well as A/D's. I have the confidence to know everything was checked according to the book since we used the Mooney Maintenance & Service Manual which I supplied. I have begun to use the Ad Log system to keep meticulous records & I know that if I have an issue that requires more Mooney expertise my mechanic will send me on my way. In short I have true value-for me.  

[Magnum]

Quote: allsmiles

  The answer I received was that my donuts need replacement  (oh really?) and we can do that! I said to the man do you have the Mooney tooling? He said no but I can do it without it!  I ran and didn't walk!