Need a Little Install Help

[TWinter]

The shop called trying to get the new shafts installed on 41M today. Ran into a snag and can't seem to get it squared away. I need this favor pretty quick as this is what is holding up 8 weeks of non-flying. I tried to reach out to the guy I bought them from and no joy on return calls. When all else fails you call your Mooney brothers/sisters.

I need a picture and or clarification of the shaft mount under the dash. The old yokes were sold and the manuals are not very clear on this. The shop looked at it and I looked at it and I'm a bit stumped. If someone could snap a picture ASAP or tell me what looks wrong in the attached pictures I would be grateful. I might even be able to fly again soon. When we put these in we are not getting maximum deflection. We were working on the co-pilots side. The shop says the guy I bought them from had them mislabeled as far as pilot and co-pilot, but we have tried every configuration and can't seem to get it sorted. We get movement further on one side vs. the other. As they say what's wrong with this picture. Co-pilots side. We've removed the standard E model and are attempting the J model style. I'd even settle for a picture of your set up. No Mooney's at my field and this is not something they do all the time. Just binding up and even the holes for the yokes are vertical position and not horizontal. What say you experts?. You may have to cock your head to understand the photos, but if you are answering I'm sure you know what you are looking at? Help and any photos please?    This first pic is laying on the passenger floor looking up and to the rear. As you can see the thicker shaft is hitting the frame tube with the block in it (closest to my thumb). Picture 2 shows the same from a different angle.  The bottom picture shows it best..hitting the frame tube at the notch. The last is the shaft itself. Does this even look correct as identified as a passenger side shaft? Just trying to answers as quick as possible. Thanks

Sold my old shaft to a forum member..don't have anything to reference to..

 

-Tom

[mooneyflier]

There's a screen shot from a "J" parts manual in one of the replies at the above topic. Might help....

[mooneyflier]

You might find your answer in this thread. One member "Lood" checked his and said the installer apparently turned the shaft by 90 degrees by drilling horizontal holes. Hope this helps.

[TWinter]

Still able to determine what I need to see..It almost looks like he is reversed and what he has labeled as co-pilots is pilots..Just need a real picture or clearer idea. This shaft I brought home looks to me to be the pilots side, but is labeled as co-pilots..Still looking..any help is appreciated. I'm at a standstill until this is squared away. I'd settle for any picture of the yoke shaft attachment..

 

-Tom

[N601RX]

I can't tell from your pictures but there should be a second bolt that goes into the center rear of the shaft to support it. It's the bolt that also connects it to the elevator cross shaft. I have a pic but not able to upload. 

[TWinter]

5 minutes ago, N601RX said:

I can't tell from your pictures but there should be a second bolt that goes into the center rear of the shaft to support it. I have a pic but not able to upload

Yes, There is a block that goes in the center and then a bolt through it. Then the swivel goes in, but when the center bolt is installed it restricts the deflection. Does this even look like the co-pilots side? I've been looking through the web and manuals and there are no good pictures to get an idea. I wish I had better pics. They called me late in the day and we were all frustrated. Still looking.

[N601RX]

I emailed you the drawing. It looks like you need to flip the support over so it comes up through the bottom of the yoke shaft instead of the top and possibly swap left and right yoke shafts

[TWinter]

14 minutes ago, N601RX said:

I emailed you the drawing. It looks like you need to flip the support over so it comes up through the bottom of the yoke shaft instead of the top and possibly swap left and right yoke shafts

I'll take a look..

[TWinter]

Mike,

Got the drawing..Replied and asked a quick question in email.

 

-Tom

[Yetti]

I can't tell from the angles, but on mine the bolt hole should be straight down when yokes are centered.  So maybe adjust the rods so they are straight down.  Also add a Adel camp to the rear of the bolt to hold the wires that run down the shaft.

 

[TWinter]

9 hours ago, daver328 said:

Tom,

I've got the old drawings from when a previous owner put 201 shafts in ... I can also try to take some pictures ... text me (you should still have my #) and I'll go,to,the hanger tomorrow ...

Okay thanks..cell is 731-612-7233 or email at tpwinter@bellsouth.net      Thanks..

Mike gave me some info and I'm heading over to the shop first thing this morning and see if I can figure them out. The actual pictures of how the linkage and rod connects under the dash would still help.

 

-Tom 

[TWinter]

After another few hours at the shop this morning and double checking it looks like I was sent the wrong shafts ( I guess you would say I got the shaft). I think at this point they are going to retro-fit the new yokes to the original E style shafts if we can find some. Anybody have a good source for both shafts. I sold my originals with my old yokes..go figure my project is on hold until I find the shafts. Been down since July and now to have the shafts be the only hold up.. Just my luck. I'll start making the usual calls to Maxwell, Lasar etc.. If anyone has a set or knows of a set please let me know.. I just want to get back in the air at this point.

 

-Tom 

[mooniac15u]

This guy might have what you need:

 

[TWinter]

10 minutes ago, mooniac15u said:

This guy might have what you need:

 

I've called a few times..No answer. Actually just got a hold of him..He has some from a 67, but sure if they are the same as 73.

[yvesg]

Lesson learned: Don't sell old parts until the new ones are installed and log book signed off!

Yves

[TWinter]

1 hour ago, yvesg said:

Lesson learned: Don't sell old parts until the new ones are installed and log book signed off!

Yves

Thanks..that's about what I needed to hear today..Only reason I sent the other ones off early was because I didn't want the MS member to have to wait an extra month for them until my shop was ready for the new ones to get installed. No lesson, just trying to help a MSer get his installed early and not wait..my mistake, it will all work though. Got to have faith  

 

Might have it resolved... Finally.

 

-Tom

[M20F-1968]

If it helps I have the original shaft from an F model.  They would get you back to original and flying for little money.  My e-mail is john.breda@gmail.com and my cell phone is (617) 877-0025.

John Breda

[mike20papa]

I'm enclosing a photo of my yoke end ('59 A Model) - shows the elev. control attachment and the aileron push/pull rod and end.  That's what's puzzling about the photo you have - where's the elev. control attachment?

[mike20papa]

Okay, I looked again - and to me the yokes you have put in are upside down and left/right are incorrect.

[TWinter]

I think we have it figured out...The yoke shafts at the linkage connection are way short and the angle was different not allowing the linkage connection. The guy I bought from said they were the correct ones for the conversion..guess what?,,nope.

Some of the pics I posted above were just from different positioning thinking we were doing something wrong. We were just trying any possible configuration. Here is a picture of them unattached. Look at the length of the "dogear" as we call it. It's about 1/2" +/- shorter than yours. Not enough room to allow the linkage to connect or allow for full deflection left and right. Yours are much longer allowing for connection and the angle is slightly different. Problem figured out.

I'm not sure if the (J) uses these shorter ones and the Es, Fs etc use ones with  longer "dog ears", but I think everyone will see what we ran into in these pics. Maybe save someone this problem in the future. Just the wrong length. Problem explained, not solved yet, but explained. Hopefully, solved soon.

 

-Tom

[mooniac15u]

1 hour ago, TWinter said:

I think we have it figured out...The yoke shafts at the linkage connection are way short and the angle was different not allowing the linkage connection. The guy I bought from said they were the correct ones for the conversion..guess what?,,nope.

Some of the pics I posted above were just from different positioning thinking we were doing something wrong. We were just trying any possible configuration. Here is a picture of them unattached. Look at the length of the "dogear" as we call it. It's about 1/2" +/- shorter than yours. Not enough room to allow the linkage to connect or allow for full deflection left and right. Yours are much longer allowing for connection and the angle is slightly different. Problem figured out.

I'm not sure if the (J) uses these shorter ones and the Es, Fs etc use ones with  longer "dog ears", but I think everyone will see what we ran into in these pics. Maybe save someone this problem in the future. Just the wrong length. Problem explained, not solved yet, but explained. Hopefully, solved soon.

 

-Tom

It looks like the "dog ears" are shorter on the J shafts because the bolt assembly that fits in the notch and attaches to the elevator controls is much smaller.  On the older style controls it is apparently a larger block.  Can you swap out the bolt assembly and make it fit?

[Pictreed]

Wow.  I've been out sick since I went to Denver and didn't know all of this was going on. 

I'll pm you my number. 

Tim