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After!

Been touring around a little. Denver to tonopah to Merced for a few days Merced to 0q5 for a couple 0q5 to mfr for a few Mfr to Heber City Utah Then home Wednesday. Haven't taken too many pics but there's a few Messing around with power settings some. Trying to find the balance. We've seen Yosemite, Crater lake, a bunch of water falls, a weird hot spring in a cave that is who knows how deep.

Finally got 68Q home. Now the slow work starts. Don't know which is more tired. Trailer that was used so many years ago to move it or the plane. Would have preferred to remove the tail from the tailcone but bolts broke instead of sliding out.

I read somewhere that you should only cycle the prop with full flaps if you have an AOA indicator, otherwise you'll burn up the cylinders.

I know many on the forum think little about hearing loss simply because they have not noticed loss themselves. I have been aware of my own hearing loss recently as I've finally passed that threshold of realization. When I got back into flying four or five years ago I bought a set of Lightspeed state of the art noise canceling headsets thinking it was my best deterant for hearing loss. I think I was wrong. I've seemed to kept the low frequency hearing fairly well but have just about lost the high frequency range. It's pretty disheartening when you can no longer wake up in the morning and hear birds sing just outside your bedroom window. Someone mentioned in a previous post that they use foam ear plugs under their headset so I tried this the other day and was amazed at the improvement! I could hear the conversation way better, actually turned the volume down, and I assume the high frequencies were probably substantially blocked by the plugs while the low frequencies were blocked by the noise cancelling headset. I only wish I had taken this approach five years ago, maybe I'd still be able to hear birds sing in the AM. So, in my book, don't be lulled down the path thinking noise cancelling headsets give great all around hearing protection, I don't think they do. I'm not an audiologist but I think the best hearing protection might be a set of Clarity Aloft type with a secondary noise cancelling set on top of these. If nothing else just try the foam earplugs under your headset. Once your hearing is gone it doesn't just somehow come back. Take care of it while you can!

Flew to Toronto yesterday. I intended to pick my daughter up in Boston today to come stay with me for the summer in Erie, but she wasn't feeling well and wanted me to get her tomorrow. A free day with no plans and nothing to do - where to go? I ended up deciding on Lake Placid, New York (KLKP). I called the Lake Placid Lodge and asked the manager if they wanted to make a last minute deal and if they could pick me up from the airport. I got a very nice response, and here I am. The manager came out to the airport and helped me push the plane into the tie down spot. KLKP has a 4196*60 ft runway. However 32 has a 1200ft displaced threshold. My shortest runway to date in my Mooney has been 3500. I know that most of you guys can get it in there no problem, but the pucker factor was high with gusting crosswords and my shortest runway to date. It ended up not being an issue at all. There was a little turbulance descended in the mountains, but nothing bad. I enjoy doing these sort of things. I have gotten comfortable with 8000ft runways everywhere I go. This sort of thing is good for me. Now I get to sit and relax with a bottle of wine. And I'll go get my daughter tomorrow and bring her back for a great summer in Erie.

I don't. I own the plane, it barely costs me anything to taxi back, I enjoy my time spent flying, I don't like the risks involved with touch and goes so I see no purpose. Hypothetically, if I were to do it, I would land full flaps, retract on the ground, and take off no flaps. The runway would have to be ridiculously long.

I purchased a 231 (N231JY) from Don Maxwell in October of last year and decided on a panel redo a couple months ago. I came out of an Avidyne equipped Cirrus and really enjoyed and became accustomed to the all glass panel. So I went with all glass in the new panel. We are in the final stages of completion now and thought I would post a few pics of the process. This is what we started with... First day of tear down.... Second day of teardown.... New circuit breaker panel..... Very clean work.... Back of main panel cleaned up... Fitting instruments. Everything is flush mounted. Radio stack.... Checking for fitment... First power up...

There are reasons why we had that little revolution...

I'm actually a big fan of the "City FBO". Typically a small building with a unicom combination lock on the door, a slot to pay for overnight parking, and the managers phone number posted. I simply get to park my plane, where no one will move it and mess up the the nose truss. I can go inside to use the bathrooms, call for a weather briefing, and use the computer. If I want fuel, I can pump it myself. Some even have a courtesy car you can sign out on the honor system. Typically an old city car which has seen far better days. I wish there were more of these.

If you're gonna respray the wheel wells white, be sure and get permission from @jetdriven, he's already got white wheel wells.

Cycle the prop with full flaps, cowl flaps half open, and 50 degrees LOP while slowly richening to 100 degrees ROP.....

Every landing is like a box of chocolates.

Thanks Scott, this is the advice of someone who is one of my real life hero's, Bob Kromer. A couple of very competent, high time pilots were filling the front 2 seats of Dmax's J model (I have a few hours in that bumble bee) when the second last maneuver they did (unsure who was at the controls) was a forward slip, followed by their last maneuver, an unsuccessful unusual attitude recovery. RIP Joel Smith, Max Rae. From Bob Kromer From the Mooney List December 2, 2005 by Bob Kromer Slipping a Mooney During development and certification on the M20K 252 at the factory, I encountered the aerodynamic buffeting while slipping on approach as described by Dan Eldridge in his posting on slips in his M20K 231. Obviously, this gets a test pilot's attention and we began an investigation. Thought you might be interested in what we found. For our slip tests, we flew the M20K, the M20J and the Mooney/Porsche engineering prototypes that were at the factory at the time. This gave us a good cross section of different aircraft configurations (short/long fuselage, different pitch trim requirements on approach, etc.) What we found was 1) All airplanes were fine above 85 KIAS in full rudder deflection forward slips, flaps up and flaps down. 2) But somewhere between 80-85 KIAS and lower, AERODYNAMIC BUFFETING FROM THE HORIZONTAL TAIL/ELEVATOR occured in the M20K and the Mooney/Porsche airframes ALONG WITH A SLIGHT LOSS OF ELEVATOR EFFECTIVENESS AND A SLIGHT NOSE DOWN PITCHING MOMENT. These conditions were worsened with flaps down compared to the flaps up. Aerodynamic tufting of the horizontal tail revealed what was happening. In the M20K and the Mooney/Porsche with their more forward CGs, almost full nose up pitch trim is required for a "hands off" approach at the target approach airspeed. This puts the horizontal stabilizer of the Mooney tail at a high negative angle of attack (to keep the nose up). With the horizontal tail at this high negative angle of attack and especially with flaps full down, the local airflow over the horizontal tail is getting pretty close to max alpha, the angle of attack where the tail will stall. I want to emphasize that IN NORMAL FLYING, THERE IS PLENTY OF MARGIN - no need to worry about the tail stalling in your M20K or long body Mooney. But start slipping the airplane at 85 KIAS and below or have a little ice on that stabilizer leading edge and those margins can get mighty thin. Combine a slip maneuver with some pretty good yanking on the control wheel in turbulence and you might get a partial tail stall. We did in flight test - in the M20K the result was buffeting felt in the control wheel and the slight nose down pitching moment. So my advice from the test pilot's seat is don't go there - especially if you fly a Mooney model that requires lots of nose up pitch trim on the approach. An aggressive forward slip in those airplanes with the speed low and the flaps down puts the tail in an extreme airflow condition. The airplane will warn you with buffeting and a slight pitch down, but who knows - add some ice and look out. This is not the way to fly your Mooney. My bottom line opinion - keep the ball near center on the approach and you're flying the Mooney design correctly and safely with the safety margins it was meant to have. Best Regards; Bob Kromer

Ah that's right I forgot, all people from Omaha are clueless and none of them run for-profit businesses. Oh, hang on, isn't Warren Buffett from Omaha?

The first and last time someone tried to pull the landing fee plus ramp fee plus security fee routine on me, I got steamed, asked the agent at the desk where was the sign located that would have told me about those fees before I used their ramp and thier security. I also reminded her that my taxes already paid for the runway that I just landed on. She had nothing to say. I then told her that there was NO CONTRACT between us for those fees and that I WOULD NOT PAY THEM. I turned and left with my party and baggage. When I returned 3 days later, we were charged for Normal tie down fees only. Getting assertive and standing your ground works. PS. It was Signature in AVL

I have bought my airplane twice. Once in 1993, a brand new MSE. I flew it for four years and then sold it to buy a Cessna 310. I flew that for nine years before fuel and maintenance costs became excessive. I sold it and went without for a couple of years, then saw my Mooney back on the market. I picked it up in 2009 and upgraded it. Sure felt good to get her back. Here are the before and after pictures. The first two are from 1993, the last three are current.

The risk of a gear-up or a prop strike is too high for touch and goes on high performance retractable airplanes for me.

I'd love to trade my lawyer, account, dentist etc hour for hour. For some reason they think they're worth 3-4 times what I'm worth. Clarence

Oxygen is cheap. Why debate the merits of flying at the edge of hypoxia when there are none?

If you claimed copyright to "Happy Birthday", would you feel that someone singing it without your permission was somehow wrong? I don't feel that it is at all ok to steal intellectual property rights, I just don't see how it applies in this case. This is a FACTORY PAINT SCHEME, if anyone has intellectual property rights it would be Mooney. It's in the public domain, it can't be protected under copyright. It's not an original design. Just because someone slaps the words "copyright" under an image on a website doesn't make it so. It's not registered, and no one in their right mind would not be able to see that its a copy of an extremely popular factory paint scheme. It's the same color, you certainly can't copyright a color.

Some "Annual inspections" include working on the airplane and the log books, others only include the log books. Clarence

Back to the subject of T&G's: Don't do them if you're not comfortable with them, but why haven't you become comfortable? T&G's do allow more landings in a shorter amount of time. Prior to the advanced simulators, we did T&G's in single and multi-pilot Navy aircraft. The airline did them for years with new pilots in big and small airplanes. I do them in all the airplanes I've owned, or rented. To me, a T&G is simply a maneuver. Practice and learn until proficient...or not.

I can feel another food fight coming along.

I agree completely! I make it a goal to try to get along with everyone. The one thing I have a hard time ignoring though are lies. If PTK slams Garmin or Avidyne or Mooney or anyone Mooneyspace member with things that absolutely are untrue I have a hard time with self control, wanting to correct an injustice. But I'm done. Anyone who reads all the way through the post will see it for what it is. He can continue to post whatever he likes on this and I won't directly respond. There's nothing that makes someone who likes to argue more frustrated than someone who won't argue back. On to much more positive things . . . Avidyne offers things on their IFD550 GPS/NAV/COM that aren't available anywhere else, so it will be well worth the effort for Thinwing to allow Garmin and Avidyne to get things sorted out. When the IFD550 was introduced they allowed current IFD540 owners an upgrade path at a reasonable cost with a new warranty and zero install costs. I just swapped mine out a few days ago and am looking forward to flying with it. The architecture on the Avidyne IFD mean that many more good things are in the pipeline for down that road.

Hey guys, I recently bought this M20K Rocket a few months ago and just signed up here at Mooneyspace yesterday. I'm new to Mooney ownership as well, any tips/things to watch out for? I just dropped it off for annual last week so hopefully get flying again here soon. -Jeremy

I gave up on aopa. EAA gets my dues now. Check to see if EAA has a more proactive and pragmatic approach to winning this battle.

Details to follow from Bob, Oscar and me...

Well,,, Just for your update pleasure... after an arduous and expensive 600 mi,,, ferry, cab, bus and another cab rides, i get to ID26.... a very careful preflight and runup takes me from ID26, 37 minutes to KMAN for car gas, and my 1st solo landing in 28 years! rest awhile and im off,,, straight through, passing KBKE, KHRI, KELN, and across the Cascade mountains and into KPWT, Home!!! and my 2nd solo landing in 28 yrs!!! cruising this part @ 6500 ft.. .6 hrs to KMAN,, then another 4.7 hrs to Home. the plane burns more per hr,, and flies slower than any of my plans or dreams,,, but it gave me an opportunity to do a thing i had planned for another time, a thing many of you would not do,,, on purpose!! i ran a tank DRY! took all of 6 seconds after the switch to restore power... and my gauges really do read very accurately

When you're leaned back in the chair, everything is upside down anyway.

With all the high surge we had from this system that just passed through us this week, the fishing camp is good!

So if there is a mile of runway left, what's the harm in taking off again instead of stopping? I've been doing them in Mooneys for 33 years. I didn't know they were hard or dangerous until I joined Mooneyspace.

Like Lance says, just don't do them. Instead practice real landings of all kinds and real takeoffs of all kinds and taxi back. After initial training one generally doesn't need to do concentrated landing practice where you are not practicing good habits anyway. There has been way too many touch and go accidents. We won't do them at MAPA PPP training events nor will the Bonanza guys at their BPPs either. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I would like to tell my tax story, but it is best to let sleeping dogs lie.

I'm going to fix this problem.... I'm tying a string to my tail so I can follow it back home

Sectional or old school IFR (I follow roads) :-) ;-) with a AAA map. Just goes to prove that when the zombie apocalypse happens all you glass panel guys are going to get eaten.

My impression is the failure isn't all that uncommon. We've had it happen twice in 14 years of ownership. Little more oil than usual, discover compromised main seal when pulling the cowl and feeling behind the prop. I know it's scary to think all the oil could drain out in flight. But the prop flange end of the crankshaft exits at the top of the case. Assuming you're not flying aerobatics, the only oil that will blow out there is little droplets from splash lubrication. Even if the seal completely departs, I don't think it's likely to be an OMG-I-coulda-died failure. It's certainly not the same as losing your oil drain plug, or blowing a hole out the bottom of the case with a thrown rod. I'm not trying to water down your concern, though, just explaining why the main seal mechanism likely isn't more robust to start with.

Get to an appropriate speed first. The Best Glide Speeds in our Mooneys are generally up around 90 KIAS. Getting to 70-75 KIAS will result in a better angle of descent to get on glide path. Taking a greater nose-down attitude pushing 90 KIAS or more will only leave for a greater rush to bleed of speed and you will glide farther.

Hahaha. I have no experience yet. But my brother does and I am going to do nothing but learn from here on. We decided to go with a 1979 piper arrow IV t-tail. We are gonna learn on that and then get a beautiful mooney once we get our bearings

Usually if they let you do some of the labor they only charge 25% more

Only one Texan is fighting... the rest of us are laughing.

Whoa! We have some mighty fine folks here in Omaha!

Flight home from MAPA PPP a couple weeks ago. I had the great fortune of having a couple of experienced co-pilot's that made the trip home pleasant and informative. Thanks Mark, thanks Jerry.

If you are talking about the 650, the knobs still can be used to dial in frequencies and identifiers. Unless the turbulence is really bad, I am able to use the touchscreen most of the time but do occasionally resort to using the knobs. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

Before you send your KX155 out, maybe you know someone who will allow you to do a quick and temporary swap? That maybe the easiest way to determine if it's the unit or other factors. If you were closer to Memphis, I would be willing. For repairs, I recommend Bevan Rabell in Wichita

They just put the description in there to get people to come... Then, once everyone is in the tent, they will start selling time shares..

I don't. It depends greatly on your Mooney Model here. Do this in a longbody or Rocket at 75 kts w. full flaps might end up very badly. The forward slip is a tool some use to fix a hosed up stabilized approach, but can cause a tail stall in a Mooney.

David and Cindi will be at the Mooney Summit V with their fantastic cowl mod. Airport day, open to all, will be Friday Sept 29th where David will have the mod and will speak about it. David, bring your order book, I think you will need a big one.

Sorry to hear of these issues. I've been keeping a list of Mooney purchases that didn't go as well as they should have. Your example has been added to the list. I wish we had some way of providing warning to newbies trying to purchase a Mooney for the first time. I was there myself once and it's a daunting task with so many unknowns and pitfalls. As @1967 427 said, no one should buy a Mooney in that part of the country without a pre-buy from either Top Gun or LASAR. And anyone selling a Mooney in CA, NV, OR, WA who won't let their plane go to one of those two shops for a pre-buy, should immediately be discarded from consideration. Here in the Central US and South Central, the shops are Don Maxwell or SWTA. A pre-buy from a reputable MSC is often worth more than you're spending on the plane.