Oil Loss, High Oil Temp .....

[funvee]

Sorry I haven't updated... I was booked to write my commercial exam yesterday so I've been studying every spare minute I had.

 

I was out at my Mooney today getting setup .... I bought the oil cooler relocation kit from LASAR so now we are getting things ready for that change.

 

I was told that if the cooler has cold spots when the sump is all warmed up, that means I have an air bubble in the cooler where it is cold.  Since my whole cooler stays cold, I am guessing the whole thing is one big bubble.  Since the relocate puts the cooler on its side that takes away the possibility of bubbles since the outlet is on the top this way.

 

I'll update y'all as soon as we get it done and test that part.

 

I also put a condom over the quick drain to see if anything is coming out of that and put a small catch can on the breather line out so I can see if it is oil or just moisture coming out.

 

Thanks,

Shawn

[funvee]

We started the oil cooler relocate project last night.

We left the cooler and hoses connected together so we could see how much oil was in it and how easy it flows...

Wow, there was less than a cup of oil in the hose/cooler combination.

Also, it was very hard to blow through the assembly (by mouth) both with oil in it and empty. When the old hoses were blown through without oil or oil cooler, they were very restrictive.

Quick related question... Does anyone know how much oil the cooler should be able to hold?

Also, does anyone make an stc'd kit to add a second landing light in the opening where the cooler vacates ?

I will update the progress after we test the new cooler location.

Thanks

[funvee]

We did the Oil cooler relocate.

We did the Lasar cowl mod to block the bottom opening under the spinner.

 

I took it out for 2.5 hr flight.

 

Condom over the quick drain was dry after.

Catch can over the pressure relief tube was empty of oil and just had signs of moisture.

 

After the flight I seem to be down approximately 2 qt but we don't see any sign of it anywhere.

 

My AME is waiting for a new Valve Wobble tester to see if the valve guides could be the problem but with the good compressions we had, I don't know how likely that might be.

[Marauder]

Sorry to hear that things are still not resolved. Do you ever encountered fouled plugs? If it ain't leaking out, it has to be burning it.keep us posted!

[MB65E]

Hi Shawn, well at least now with the oil cooler relocation you have new lines and the cooler shouldn't ice up. Prob a knot faster. The compressions could be perfect and the valve guides could be shot. The wobble test will make sure the valves are not too tight. Still good to do the test. You could have your tech drop the valve into the cylinder and measure the ID of the guide itself. With out the springs you'll feel just a little rock on the valve. A cylinder shop can replace the valve guides. It's almost something a tech could do in the field. Sorry we still have not nailed it.

-Matt

[funvee]

Sorry to hear that things are still not resolved. Do you ever encountered fouled plugs? If it ain't leaking out, it has to be burning it.keep us posted!

 

So far, plugs have been clean but it might be worth pulling them after the next run just to be sure... We haven't done that on the last number of flights.

 

Thanks

Shawn

[Alan Fox]

I had a temp problem it was the incorrect base gasket for the oil filter , make sure it is the correct part # for the filter and not the screen , they are different...

[funvee]

Hi Shawn, well at least now with the oil cooler relocation you have new lines and the cooler shouldn't ice up. Prob a knot faster. The compressions could be perfect and the valve guides could be shot. The wobble test will make sure the valves are not too tight. Still good to do the test. You could have your tech drop the valve into the cylinder and measure the ID of the guide itself. With out the springs you'll feel just a little rock on the valve. A cylinder shop can replace the valve guides. It's almost something a tech could do in the field. Sorry we still have not nailed it.

-Matt

 

Ya, the new lines and cooler location have changed at least one thing... The cooler is quite warm to the touch but still has temps hitting 240 on the gauge so I guess that alone didn't lower my temps.... bummer.  

 

Next up is the wobble test, and we are hoping to find that is the problem.  My AME can swap new guides in at his shop so that would be cool.

 

One thing that I was wondering if someone knows is in regard to the vernatherm... Does anyone know if it should "fully" extend at 180 or should it "start" extending at 180?  I am wondering if the new vernatherm is not fully extending until my temp is 230ish instead of 180.

 

Thanks

Shawn

[funvee]

I had a temp problem it was the incorrect base gasket for the oil filter , make sure it is the correct part # for the filter and not the screen , they are different...

 

Hmmm... That is a new one.  Nobody mentioned that.  I will ask my mx if he can verify it.  

 

Thanks

Shawn

[rbridges]

sorry for the aggravion.  I know it's getting expensive.  Thanks for keeping us updated.  I'm sure the solution will be enlightening to all of us.

[Alan Fox]

sorry for the aggravion.  I know it's getting expensive.  Thanks for keeping us updated.  I'm sure the solution will be enlightening to all of us.

Not to me , put in the correct gasket.....

[Marauder]

sorry for the aggravion. I know it's getting expensive. Thanks for keeping us updated. I'm sure the solution will be enlightening to all of us. Not to me , put in the correct gasket.....

Still doesn't explain the significant oil loss. Quart per hourish.

[Alan Fox]

Still doesn't explain the significant oil loss. Quart per hourish.

When your oil temps are 40 to 60 degrees high , you will burn it at a higher rate.....  Also my pressure went up about 10 psi when I changed the gasket....

[funvee]

Hmmm... That is a new one.  Nobody mentioned that.  I will ask my mx if he can verify it.  

 

Thanks

Shawn

I verified with my AME today that he did verify the base gasket when we did the first oil change.  Looks like that isn't it.

 

Today, I took it out for a 1.5 hr flight and it burned a little less than 1/2 qt total.  That is much better than it has been but no idea why it would be different today.  

 

He's expecting his wobble tester around wednesday so that may be the next one we'll do.

 

Thanks

Shawn

[funvee]

Time for an update and a question.

 

Ok, so here's how the last month went... my mx and I noticed 2 plugs where looking wet after a short test run so he pulled those jugs to take a look and sure enough, they where in need of honing.  Sent them into Aero Recip here in Winnipeg.  They Honed them and redid anything else like guides and valves that needed it.  When I got the 2 jugs back, I decided I might aswell send in the last 2 to be sure I fix it.

 

On the second set of jugs they found one cylinder was over spec and would need to be taken to P10 if they could save it.  I decided to buy a replacement jug from them instead so that everything would be identical on all the cylinders.  They took any good parts from my jug and put it in the new one and then did valves and guides etc.

 

We got them back and the new Ring sets for all the cylinders last week.   We cleaned out the finger screen and put in Mineral Oil and a new filter, then took it out to test it.

 

So far, after about 4 hours on the refreshed jugs/valves/rings.... No oil burn at all.  Oil looks brand new still (on the dipstick).  Fingers crossed that my oil burn issue is fixed for good.

 

Now, for my question....

 

After doing the refreshed jugs and rings etc, should I be having less performance until it breaks in?  I used to consistently have an IAS of 145kt when at a density alt of 3000'.  Now I am seeing 135kt-ish at that same density Alt.   If I do a straight out and straight back flight with 1 hr flight time, I averaged 143kt gs.  I used to be waaaaay faster.

 

I can't think of what else could be slowing me down as we haven't done anything to the plane other than the jugs.  We where thinking that my gear could be hanging down a bit but would have to jack it up to test that.

 

Thanks!

Shawn

[Alan Fox]

Check the Man pressure hose for leaks, if it leaks you will indicate higher Man pressure than actual , = less power...

[funvee]

I would have thought a leak in the mp hose would have it under read... But I was getting 27" with Ram air open.  26" with it closed.  I guess that's something to look at.  

Thanks!

[jetdriven]

Our fresh factory engine was about 5-7 knots slower until about 45 hours when everything finally broke in.

[funvee]

Our fresh factory engine was about 5-7 knots slower until about 45 hours when everything finally broke in.

 

I was REALLY hoping to hear that!!!  Thanks.  I'm hoping thats what I'm in for.

[carusoam]

Wondering if the break in oil may have a small, but measurable effect as well. What oil are you using?

Best regards,

-a-

[MB65E]

Sounds like your on your way!! Fly it hard for a bit and the cylinders should last a good 1200+hrs. Enjoy the new Cylinders, more importantly enjoy not thinking of where all the oil was going.

Best.

[funvee]

Wondering if the break in oil may have a small, but measurable effect as well. What oil are you using?

Best regards,

-a-

I'm using Mineral oil (break-in oil) 20-50.  So far the oil is crystal clear after flying.  My old setup would've had the oil being black as night by now.  

 

That, and zero oil burn is looking good.  Hope it's just a nice tight engine causing my slow down.

 

Thanks

[funvee]

Sounds like your on your way!! Fly it hard for a bit and the cylinders should last a good 1200+hrs. Enjoy the new Cylinders, more importantly enjoy not thinking of where all the oil was going.

Best.

 

Ya, the engine guy at aero recip said to "fly it like you stole it" for the first 25-30 hrs.    All in all, if I hid the ASI, I wouldn't know anything was amiss.... it all feels great!

 

Thanks

Shawn

[funvee]

so far running good after about 15 hr...

 

Here it is on a low flyby so mechanic could make sure everything was clean in flight (gear, step etc)