Taos or Angel Fire?

[The-sky-captain]

I'm headed to the N. New Mexico region next month to look at some property and I was wondering what strip you local guys would recommend going into. I know that Angel Fire is a pretty tough in and out due to the altitude and the N/S runway that provides big x-winds at times. I'll be coming in from Arkansas and will be making a stop in Pagosa Springs, CO as well after Taos/Angel Fire. Any pointers would be greatly appreciated. Thanks guys.

[Parker_Woodruff]

I'm going to Santa Fe via American Airlines miles on January 27ish.

[The-sky-captain]

Quote: Parker_Woodruff

I'm going to Santa Fe via American Airlines miles on January 27ish.

[jlunseth]

Never landed at Taos during the winter, but I can tell you it is in a very large, flat valley.  If you are doing an approach it will not be next to mountains.  High altitude but plenty of runway.  Don't know Anngelfire at all.

[ToddDPT]

I took my 201 into Taos and it is a non-event.  Nice runway, plenty of room and as jlunseth said, the mountains are not a factor.  

[Parker_Woodruff]

actually I should say I'm going into ABQ then driving to Santa Fe.  Time to go skiing.

[flyguy241]

I have taken our J model into both airports.  If the weather is nice and there is no ice on the runway, try Angle Fire.  It is a very pretty area and a fun approach.  Land to the South and take off to the North and you should be fine.  If weather is an issue, go into Taos.  It's a nice big flat area, the runway aligns with the prevailing winds and you will feel really safe going in and out.  Taos is also about 1300 feet lower.  I have been flying into Taos more often than Angle Fire.  It always seems like Angle Fire has it's own little weather system and we have been stuck under a fog bank while everywhere else in the world is severe VFR.  Angle Fire will almost always have a crosswind and if the runway is icy, it could get challenging.

When flying into Taos, if it is very windy we will fly over Sante Fe and then go North to Taos.  If it is nice and calm and early in the morning, you can shoot straight across from the East.  I climb to about 12,000 and feel comfortable at that altitude.  Be sure to avoid the Taos Pueblo nature conservancy area if you go that route.  

Pack light and be cautious, mountain flying can be pretty unforgiving.

[flyguy241]

DP

 

[smccray]

We have this trip on our short list as well due to proximity to Dallas. As a low time pilot with zero mountain experience, my plan (on paper- no further investigation) is to land at las Vegas, NM and drive up to Angel Fire.  It's only 60 away miles and it keeps me east of the Rockies.

[Geoff]

I regularly fly my 231 into Santa Fe, and Taos.  I have also flown into Angel Fire in the the summer.  I would echo flyguy241's comments.  Santa Fe is great with plenty of runways to choose, Taos is fine but can be windy.  I flew with a local instructor to do my Biannual and he said it was tough to maintain IFR currency since summer IFR = thunderstorms and winter IFR = ICE.

Angel Fire can be a bit tricky due to the potentially high DA, the downdrafts off the west side of the pass, and the relatively close quarters in the valley.  Getting in is sometimes easier than getting out.  If you have not done much mountain flying and have never been to Angel Fire before I would suggest that in anything but the best weather conditions you should exercise discretion. 

Good luck and enjoy the scenery...

[Z W]

I flew into Pagosa Springs (KPSO) about a month ago for skiing at Wolf Creek. Flew over Taos on the way in. Taos is down in a big, open valley and easy to get to. Pagosa, not so much. You'll want to fly up the river valley from the south. This takes you between peaks of 10k-11k while descending to the airport at 7.6k. On approach to the airport, you're flying directly at some 14k peaks. Runway 19 is the preferred there for both takeoffs and landings. I'll just tell you from my experience - the river valley to PSO looks wider on the sectional than it does from the cockpit. Use caution. I would not fly there on a windy day, but YMMV. All that being said, the skiing was fantastic, the most powder I've ever seen in late November. The town was not memorable, and I'll second that the hot springs seemed less than impressive. However, I had a good experience at the FBO. They filled up my tires for free after the plane's first trip to a cold location for the year. They do not offer engine pre-heat, which I found surprising, so be ready for that. They did offer a jump cart for $30 or so after I ran my battery down trying to start the plane at 25 d/F.

Have a good trip and be safe. I'd strongly recommend waiting for a severe clear, low wind day to head up to Durango or Pagosa.

[jlunseth]

I am sure there will be some who disagree, but Taos is not mountain flying to me.  Angelfire would be mountain flying, because it is actually up in the Sangre de Cristos, and that's why I have never landed there.  If coming from the east or west there would certainly be a mountain crossing to get to Taos, and if you are in IFR it can get a little exciting to get to the approach (I think there is only one RNAV).  But the Taos airport is far enough from the ranges on the east or west that you are not in the mountains when landing there.  Angelfire would be a different thing entirely.

One thing I would mention if you are planning to cross the mountains from east or west, and fly in to any of the airports in the Rockies/Sangre de Cristos, is to take a very good look at the direct vs. the Victor airway crossing of the high peaks.  The Victor airway crossings have been there for a long time, and in most cases were set up to allow an aircraft to cross at the lowest altitude available in the area.  Often they angle across the range in order to take advantage of the passes.  Direct routings out of places like Taos, if you are headed east for example, can often take you right over the highest peaks, so not only are you going to have to climb higher, you have a limited amount of time and distance to get there.  You will find this situation exists at most of the airports that are in valleys in the Rockies, where you have to cross peaks to get to the valleys.  I generally like to take the Victor airway when departing, and go direct once I am at altitude and/or over the plains.  I try to do these crossings at FL200 or better in my K.  At that altitude I am are generally out of any mountain wave activity. 

Crossing ranges is a nonfactor for the guys flying up from ABQ or SFE, they can fly the valley all the way.  The ground gets higher, but the peaks are really not an issue.  Coming in from the east or west there will be a range crossing unless you fly down around the toe of the Sangre de Cristos (Las Vegas, NM to SFE) and then fly the valley north to Taos, and that is a far distance out of your way.

[flyguy241]

Quote: smccray

We have this trip on our short list as well due to proximity to Dallas. As a low time pilot with zero mountain experience, my plan (on paper- no further investigation) is to land at las Vegas, NM and drive up to Angel Fire.  It's only 60 away miles and it keeps me east of the Rockies.

[The-sky-captain]

I appreciate the comments from everyone. I'm bringing my snowboard so after business is finished up I'd like to try all of this powder that I keep hearing about at Wolf Creek. I've visited a lot of the ski resorts in Colorado and N. Mexico but I've never had the chance to ride here. Looking forward to it, I've heard it's fantastic.

[HartParr]

If coming from the east fly to the Cimmaron VOR then up the valley to Eagle Nest and turn south for a 11 mile final into AXX. The first time I flew there I forgot about DP and pulled on yoke to flare and nothing happened, be ready to add power to flare. Used to not be able to get fuel at AXX would have to buzz over to Taos to fill up. Just fly the valley (hiway 64). Cross winds at AXX are there almost every afternoon. Been flying to Angel fire since the '70s. Parents have place about a mile northwest of the runway.

[jlunseth]

I saw this posted on the Red Board today.  I hope our OP went elsewhere- not a Mooney:

'Reading the accident reports today and saw where a PA-32 run off the runway yesterday departing Angel Fire, NM. Winds were 24, gusts 34 from 250 runway is 35/17. Damaged the prop and folded the gear. "

[jlunseth]

Double post.