In Cockpit WX Choices?

[GeorgePerry]

I am interested in hearing what others do to provide real time WX in their cockpits.  I used a Garmin 496 with XM WX.  I hated paying $2000+ for the box (which is now worth much less) and another $35 p/month for the basic XM WX subcription.

After some brief research and reading, there seems to be only 3 choices. 

(1) Pay for a GPS (of some make or model) with XM reciever along with the Sirius WX subscription (basically what I've done up to this point)

...OR...

(2) Get a GDL 69a and mate it with a 430/530 (nice but expensive - $10K plus)

...OR...

(3) Buy an ADS-B reciever ($1200 + $100 annual subcription ) from SkyRadar and run on an App on a Smartphone or IPAD.  I don't really like this option either.  Lots of wires and extra unmounted stuff in the cockpit.

My question to the group is what do you guys and gals do?  What is the least expensive, most user friendly option to get real time WX (NEXRAD, METARS, TAFs WA etc) in the cockpit?

[gregwatts]

I have the Garmin 696 and I get the $54 a month XM WX service. Hasn't failed me yet. Prior to the 696 was a 396.......no issues. With the portable GPS, you still have the option to take the WX with you if you are doing a trip in your car.

[takair]

I held off on XM hoping ADS-B in would mature.  Two years ago I ended up going with the 396 and XM.  I love it, but like you hate to pay the monthly fee, especially when it just sits most of the time.  I am hoping ADS-B matures so that we have options similar to XM, without the monthly fee.  That said, it may only be a matter of time before the FAA figures out that they can charge for that service as well. 

I wish XM had a service option where I can pay for radio and weather at a reasonable price.  I could use the radio in the car most of the time, but transfer the ID to the plane for flying.  Not sure how we lobby them to do that, unless they had an overwhelming response.  I suspect it would require different hardware so that they could protect from handing out the ID.  Maybe a card similar to a database subscription memory card. 

I have also considered suggesting the local FBO has a rental pool of XM antennas that people could rent for trips.  Might work at a busy airport.  If you have a trip, you sign up on line to rent it and return it when done.  I would personally hate the wires and possibility of not getting one when I need it, but it may work for those who don't fly often but want the benefit without the monthly fee. 

[jetdriven]

We just bought a skyradar ADS-B box and have used it only once so far.  It is the dual band unit so it also receives traffic.  It does have radar, metar taf and winds aloft.  The only subscription is 70$ a year for the app. In a couple of years it will pay for itself in subscription fees.  

 

Our plane is going in for an annual next month so I am going to see about permanently mounting it on the rear equipment rack.  An external shark fin DME antenna for the ADS-B data and mount the gps puck under the glare shield.  

[M016576]

I had a 396 with XM up until a year ago.  I sold the 396 on ebay for 800 bucks, and bought a used aera 560 for 1000.  I have the cheapest XM subscription for wx, plus I got the radio subscription with it for an additional 10 bucks a month.  I set up the car mount in my daily commuter (a 2002 jetta), which doesn't have navigation or XM installed... I bought one of those 9 dollar tape inputs, so now I have XM radio in the jetta, nav in the jetta, and xm weather/backup portable in the mooney.  my 396 didn't have the road maps, so paying 200 bucks to upgrade to the 560 was more for the car than anything else! 

As for the weather service.... I really wish XM would offer the winds aloft and icing conditions without having to pay an extra 20 bucks a month for it!!!  The basic service is good enough, though, with radar returns and TAFs at the airports.

The 560's weather interface SUCKS compared to the 396, though... you have to go to a seperate page to view the tafs, then go back to the nav page to navigate/get the compass rose.  the touch interface is clunky compared to the reliability of the UFCD in the Rhino... but it's a hand held GPS so that was expected (I bet the 750 is much nicer!).  I do like the menu driven system, and it's more intuitive than my 430... but... I wish some of the primary features were available on the main navigation map (like the XM weather).  The DIRECT TO button is nice and is easy to use. 

I wish the XM was cheaper, but honestly, I think it's the best thing going as far as coverage in non-radar areas (where I tend to fly often in the rockies....)

[scottfromiowa]

$44/month for XM music/weather (basic) playing on a Garmin 696.  I will put subscription on hold January & Feb as I don't fly that much during these two months.

[takair]

Quote: scottfromiowa

$44/month for XM music/weather (basic) playing on a Garmin 696.  I will put subscription on hold January & Feb as I don't fly that much during these two months.

[Wistarmo]

Garmin 530W/430W with GDL 69A, XM Weather subscription.  My wife really appreciates the music/news with the 69A.

[M016576]

Quote: takair

 Have heard you can turn it on and off.  How responsive are they and what is the frequency they will allow you to manipulate the subscription?  For example, can I have them put it on hold and then call them if I have a trip pop up.  Is it a matter of hours or days?  I imagine they must have something in place to prevent me from abusing this. 

[Immelman]

I purchased a SkyRadar receiver last month (on special, $900) and have been quite happy with it so far. Coverage excellent on the few trips I've taken. The wiring is not an issue if you get it out of the way - I mounted it with double-stick tape back in the hat rack, all the data comes up to the iPad wirelessly. I'm using WingX to overlay the weather on charts. One of these days I'll put a write up on my blog of a couple trips I've taken with it, screen shots, etc. Just for grins on a recent trip I called the FSS, gave a pirep, and 5 minutes later it was there on the feed of pilot reports for a nearby station. How cool is that?

The best thing, for me, is that this was a one-time purchase. I want income streams coming to me from investments, not going out to XM (other people's investments). Besides we're already paying for it (taxes!)

[flyboy0681]

The plane is in the shop right now getting a GDL 69 interfaced to the GTN-750. I found the GDL used on eBay for less than $1,900 (with papers), although it took several months of waiting for a listing to show up.

[GeorgePerry]

Quote: jetdriven

We just bought a skyradar ADS-B box and have used it only once so far.  It is the dual band unit so it also receives traffic.  It does have radar, metar taf and winds aloft.  The only subscription is 70$ a year for the app. In a couple of years it will pay for itself in subscription fees.  

 

Our plane is going in for an annual next month so I am going to see about permanently mounting it on the rear equipment rack.  An external shark fin DME antenna for the ADS-B data and mount the gps puck under the glare shield.  

[jetdriven]

Of the mounting rack and antenna?   As soon. I do it, sure. 

 

 

 

[Piloto]

I have XM\WX on my Aera 560 and I am happy with it. I needed something that also provides coverage in the Bahamas and XM\WX was the only option for me. As for cost, yes I am not too happy about it but if I consider onboard radar cost over ten years the radar option is more expensive than the XM susbscription and you do not get the extra features XM\WX has.

Jose

[dougmilam]

I use a yoke mounted Garmin Aera 510 with XM.  The wires are behind the panel.  Costs about $1,100 new.  The resolution isn't as good as the 560 but I have not found that a problem so far.  The touch screen is handy.  For instance, today, I touched an airport on the screen that was not my destination and quickly was offered information such as the METAR, frequencies, left or right traffic pattern, runway length, etc.  I have considered tablet options, but so far haven't found a tablet based system that is as failproof in IFR flight as the Aera.

[GeorgePerry]

 

Seems like my quick analysis of WX choices were accurate.  Portable or Panel mounted GPS with XM WX are still the modes of choice. 

Although the potential is there....I'm not convinced that ADS-B will be the nirvana the FAA promises it to be.  Also I worry that in the future the FAA will pull an ADB-B WX bait and switch similar to what's going on with other digital services.  If folks chose to jump on the ADS-B wagon too soon, there might be some disappointment in the not too distant future.

At least with Sirius XM and Garmin you know what you’re getting.  A business that's motive is profit.  Stability and maintaining a customer base is important to them....Not so with the FAA and ADS-B.  Shifting the goal line midway through the game seems to be the way the FAA chooses to operate.

[Guest]

I don't like the prices of XM either but it's a private company that does deliver, overkill price yes but does deliver, I will reluctantly stay with XM. 

Seems like anything the Goverment promises anymore is a complete and total failure as is with the FAA etc. I do not believe ADSB will be what was promised, it will linger and linger yet fail. 

 

HAPPY NEW YEAR !!!!!!!!! Everyone. 

[fantom]

Quote: dougmilam

I use a yoke mounted Garmin Aera 510 with XM.  The wires are behind the panel...... I have considered tablet options, but so far haven't found a tablet based system that is as failproof in IFR flight as the Aera.

[fantom]

Quote: dougmilam

I use a yoke mounted Garmin Aera 510 with XM.  The wires are behind the panel...... I have considered tablet options, but so far haven't found a tablet based system that is as failproof in IFR flight as the Aera.

[jlunseth]

I have the GDL69A, and it displays on the 430 and an MX20.  The MX20 displays the graphical products, and if I want a TAF or METAR at a particular airport, I can get that on the 430.  I find the display, particularly NEXRAD, to be invaluable and probably a life saver on long flights, where there is invariably some weather to deal with somewhere along the route.

I have not jumped on the ADS-B bandwagon yet because it is not everywhere.  Nor do I run WX on a tablet or EFB because the panel mounted equipment is 100% reliable.  Panel WX is so valuable I don't ever want to be in the air without it.  Maybe if they get the bugs out of ADS-B someday, and it is available everywhere in the CONUS I will change my mind.  But having WX on the panel is so important to flight safety in my view, that I won't settle for "cheap" and "there sometimes." 

Weather display on the iPad for flight planning is great, but too costly to get in flight since I already have the reliable panel system.

[jwilkins]

A few years ago I bought a Bendix AV80R with the WX receiver.

The bluetooth link was not robust and the notification that the WX was off line was not really obvious. Bendix and WX replaced the bluetooth module which made a lot of improvement, but they were never able to fully eliminate an intermittent COM squelch issue which was found on several Mooneys (my F included; never happened with the K). Something in the AV80R / WX combination was generating enough EMI to open the squelch on the G430 Com. It was very annoying, and I spent over $500 having ground and power wires checked from the battery to the alternator and back to the circuit breaker bus bar. and installing noise filters. We even had the alternator pulled and bench checked for noise. 

So, I bought  a Flight Cheetah 190 with the USB hard wire module to the same WX receiver. The link was fine; the Flight Cheetah display was a bit sunlight challenged and the user interface was not a smooth transition from the G430 and AV80R. It was very capable once I got used to navigating the functions. The disply was narrow enough so that I could mount it vertically on my yoke and still have full use of the yoke for flying the plane.

For weather only I was using the Bendix AV80R because of the brighter screen. When my son was flying with me and wanted to have his 'own' full featured GPS he used the Flight Cheetah. He got tired of me telling him not to mess with the G430 "That is MINE when we are flying; leave it alone". The Flight Cheetah did more than the G430, and he could monitor weather so life was good. 

I just bought a SkyRadar and use it on an iPad 2 with WingX 7. The ADS-B coverage in CA and AZ has been wonderful and I really like the WingX 7 navigating and utility. As others have noted the iPad is also a little sunlight challenged but, as I have not yet figured out how to mount the iPad it is not a problem to move it around in the sun.

I would like a certified installed system but, as I plan on about a three to four year replacement cycle on the plane, I can't justify the installed cost. Maybe next plane purchase I'll find a good deal on a plane with a system already installed. If I had an installed WX system I would probably keep the SkyRadar also.

Meanwhile, I cut the WX subscription and have a system I like better. Perhaps the standards will change or the Govt will start charging  for data, but I fully expect / hope that I will get the SkyRadar cost back (about two years) before any major changes get implemented. Meanwhile, I really like this combination and the only dedicated hardware is the Sky Radar receiver. If the standards change I can probably find something ese to use the iPad for.  I understand some people have found applications for the iPad in addition to in-cockpit moving maps and flight planning software.

[Greg_D]

ForeFlight also supports in-flight weather on the iPad.  Check out the FAQ page that covers this topic:

http://www.foreflight.com/support/xm.php

[Piloto]

In view of the popularity of small UAVs used by the DOD there has been discussions and studies for WX disemination via the WAAS satellites on the military GPS band. If this comes true a GPS navigator would be able to receive wx in the same way as XM\WX but without the need of separate antenna/receiver. The intended coverage would be global. If allowed for civilians this would provide XM/WX like at no charge with a greater coverage and reliability than ADS-B/UAT.  In fact the implementation of WX via WAAS satellites is a lower cost alternative that can be shared by civilians and the DOD.  ADS-B/UAT may have the same fate as LORAN.

Jose

 

 

 

 

[231Pilot]

I use WSI displayed on a MX20, and a Stormscope.  The subscription for North America is roughly $50/month.  Not a bad investment.

[GeorgePerry]

Good avweb video that basically answered my questions.  I'll stick with XM for the time being.  When ADS-B fully comes on line I wouldn't be surprised to see XM forced to cut prices in order to stay competitive in the Aviation WX market.