COVID 19 Vaccination Discussion

[Ross Statham]

Greetings all,

Yesterday my darling bride and I received our first of two COVID-19 inoculations, which was a pretty smooth process.  (We are both age 65.)  They want us back in four weeks.  We live in a small county with only 25,000 residents, and it was conducted by the local health department with help from the Florida Department of Health.  They had given us an appointment date and time, and we drove up and got into an automobile line-- and all we had to do was roll our windows down while wearing masks.  It's now been 24 hours, and neither of us has had any side affects, other than my wife having a slightly sore arm.  (I had a much sorer arm getting my flu shot last year.)

As you all know, the FAA has said that pilots and air traffic controllers should wait 48 hours before resuming their duties:

https://www.faa.gov/news/updates/?newsId=96258

I thought it might be interesting to hear about any experiences that others have had so far in this regard, especially side effects.

[MooneyMitch]

To interject a little humor during these most difficult times........

[Ross Statham]

1 minute ago, MooneyMitch said:

To interject a little humor during these most difficult times........

A87C4487-650C-464D-9D27-4EC408833FD9.mov

That may win the prize for being the FUNNIEST COVID movie I've seen yet!~~  Thanks, Bubba~

[Andy95W]

I’ve heard from a few sources that the first shot isn’t bad, but the second one kicks your butt.

[MooneyMitch]

2 minutes ago, Andy95W said:

I’ve heard from a few sources that the first shot isn’t bad, but the second one kicks your butt.

I’ve some friends that are awaiting second does..... let’s see.  Hope not. 

[G-SLOT]

I believe that the FAA has approved the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines. It's quite likely that when my turn for the vaccine rolls around I'll be offered the Oxford/Astrazeneca vaccine. Does anyone know the implications of taking that vaccine on Third Class Medical holders?

[FlyingDude]

My wife got her second shot yesterday. So far just mild fatigue. Arm soreness lasted 3 days the 1st time but she said her arm was sore just a few hours after yesterday's shot... She got the Pfizer.

She got it because she's in healthcare. I'm just general public, so I gotta wait. I mentioned maybe I should go to the hospital and throw a fit so maybe they'll jab me and send me away but she said "please don't embarrass me again". The word "again" here worries me ...

Edited January 29, 2021 by FlyingDude

[Nukemzzz]

4 hours ago, Andy95W said:

I’ve heard from a few sources that the first shot isn’t bad, but the second one kicks your butt.

I believe this is because your body is prepared for it and responds to it hard because you are partially inoculated. Sucks, but I’ll be happy to feel crummy for a few days to be done with this. I feel crummy most days after crossing 40 anyway. Not sure I’ll notice. lol

[KLRDMD]

4 hours ago, Ross Statham said:

Greetings all,

Yesterday my darling bride and I received our first of two COVID-19 inoculations, which was a pretty smooth process.  (We are both age 65.)  They want us back in four weeks.  We live in a small county with only 25,000 residents, and it was conducted by the local health department with help from the Florida Department of Health.  They had given us an appointment date and time, and we drove up and got into an automobile line-- and all we had to do was roll our windows down while wearing masks.  It's now been 24 hours, and neither of us has had any side affects, other than my wife having a slightly sore arm.  (I had a much sorer arm getting my flu shot last year.)

As you all know, the FAA has said that pilots and air traffic controllers should wait 48 hours before resuming their duties:

https://www.faa.gov/news/updates/?newsId=96258

I thought it might be interesting to hear about any experiences that others have had so far in this regard, especially side effects.

I've wondered about the FAA document you reference. It specifically states Pfizer and specifically does not state Moderna (or any other vaccine). You obviously received Moderna if they told you the second dose was four weeks out. That's standard for Moderna where Pfizer is three weeks between doses.

I received my second dose of Pfizer eight days ago. I really wanted long term data, specially late side effects but one of the hospitals I'm on staff at said it will be mandatory and I'm sure the other hospital I'm on staff at is going to say the same thing before long. I figured as long as it was mandated (if I wanted to keep my jobs, or probably to work an any hospital) and I wasn't going to get long term data in the next few weeks to months, I figured I may as well get it now.

The first vaccination was similar to a flu shot with a bit more of a sore arm and for longer. For the second one I prophylactically took Advil & Tylenol and continued taking both every six hours for the first three days. My arm was a bit more sore than the first vaccination but I also had a fairly large swelling at the site of injection that lasted for four days. It wasn't a bruise, no discoloration - just swelling, fairly firm.

One of the RNs I work with did not have a good experience after her second dose. She had chest pain and generalized very severe muscle soreness for four days and said she still didn't feel 100% four weeks later.

[HXG]

I received my 2nd dose Covid Pfizer vaccine a little over 3 weeks ago. I’m a health care provider so I can share my experience as well as that of 100s of health care workers in my circle. 

Severe Allergic reactions are extremely rare. Most people just have a little more arm soreness than they experience with the flu vaccine that lasts a couple of days on both doses.
 

On the 2nd dose, a few more symptoms do occur with both Pfizer and Moderna vaccines, but are generally mild. A few may feel a little tired with muscle aches for up to 48 hours. Some people had a fever and chills typically beginning 12 hours after injection usually lasting 24 hours or less, but possibly lasting up to 48 hours. 
 

I was an outlier in that I had a fever of 100 for 12 hours after the first injection and then a fever over 101 and chills lasting 72 hours after the 2nd injection despite round the clock tylenol and advil. Since my symptoms lasted beyond 2-3 days, I got a COVID test which was negative. I had some arm soreness which I personally think is a little silly to complain about. I still have some tender lymph nodes in the arm pit on the injection side which is improving. These greater side effects are more common in younger people (I’m middle age), but are a good thing since they are indicative of a strong immune and antibody response (likely increased vaccine efficacy above the overall 94-95%). The more symptoms you have on the first injection, the more you should expect on the 2nd  injection. 
 

I highly recommend getting the vaccine as soon as you get the chance. Yes, a booster may be needed to down the road for longer lasting immunity and for new virus variants, but it’s all well worth it. 

Edited January 29, 2021 by HXG

[hammdo]

I’m on the list to get on the appointment list to get my first shot ;o). I was told 4 months before I can get on the appointment list...

-Don

[corn_flake]

My wife is also in health care and got her first shot back in December and second shot in early January.  Both times has similar side effect.  Soreness around the injection site.  Fatigue in 12 hours but the quickly subside overnight.  I say she is middle age, but I'm sure she would disagree with me.   

[carusoam]

You guys win a prize!  

Thanks for sharing the interesting details that come with the vaccines in the wild...

Best regards,

-a-

[RobertGary1]

Not sure how far off my time js but I’m thinking about waiting in the hope that the vaccine efficacy will continue to improve

[Will.iam]

My big question is if you already got covid and recovered, will they require you to get vaccinated? My job recognizes 90 days immunity. I wonder if i could get antibodies test at a time period after that? I mean right now do they even know how long the vaccine will last?

[ilovecornfields]

After over 80 million shots given the number of people having serious reactions is exceedingly small, so I’d say it’s a much safer bet than COVID.

https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/covid-vaccine-tracker-global-distribution/

My wife and I finished our vaccine series a couple weeks ago with nothing worse than a sore arm and are going to both be vaccinating people next week at the County clinic.

This is a good document for general questions about the vaccine. Premedication  is currently not recommended.

https://www.idsociety.org/covid-19-real-time-learning-network/vaccines/vaccines-information--faq/

[Andy95W]

Glad you’re back, ilovecornfields.  I’ve missed having your medical insights the last 8 months.

[donkaye]

We had our 1st Moderna shot on Tuesday.  We had to wait on the phone for nearly 3 hours to get the appointment.  It's been over 2 days now and just the same arm soreness reported above.  It's a little worse than the flu shot, but not by much.  The next shot is in 4 weeks, and after hearing of some of the side effects both above and from some friends, we have some apprehension but will complete the process.

The positive is that I expect to get back to flight instructing full time again a couple of weeks after the second shot to let immunity build up, of course still using a mask, and a lot of hand sanitizer.  Unless you're teaching in a 747, social distancing is not in the cards.

Edited 2/9/2021:  After 1 week swelling, redness, and itching developed.  This continued for a week and has subsided over the past few days.  Still a little redness.

[donkaye]

Out of curiosity for the doctors on board, how is the effectiveness of a vaccine determined without exposing the volunteers to the actual virus?

[carusoam]

Expect by measuring the body’s response to the vaccine... the concentration of the anti-bodies must reach a certain level to be considered affective...

Expect that the media reports have simplified things down a bit to make them more understandable to everyone... 

it sounds like a very large percentage of the population gets a good response from their anti-body production...

Even a crummy response gives the body a better chance of defending against an acquired infection...

The fda recently approved the mixing of the suppliers of each dose... if needed... if you got the first shot from Pfizer, and only the Moderna Shot was available next...

PP thoughts only, not a doctor...  read a couple of biology books once... and some CNBC...

Best regards,

-a-

[Bartman]

I can echo some thoughts above including @HXG

I am a healthcare provider and have talked to hundreds over 9 hospitals and many in the clinic setting too. I can also tell you I have seen more people die in the last 10 months than in the last 15 years combined. 
 

I had nothing more than soreness and slight swelling with the first Pfizer injection, slightly more than a flu shot. Most reported the same. A few reported nausea and one had vomiting about an hour later. One case of syncope and he was 35 year old and very healthy. Some reported low grade fever, chills, myalgia over the next 24-48 hours but I did not hear of anyone having anaphylaxis type response. There were a lot of symptoms that I would attribute to anxiety.  Several people who had previous cases of documented COVID had more robust responses and said they felt like they had COVID again with the first injection. 
 

My second injection 3 weeks later was a different story.  At 7am I took Tylenol and received the injection at 8am and I worked a normal 12 hours that day. I continued Tylenol every 6 hours and had zero symptoms. At 2am I awakened with shaking chills and low grade fever. This lasted for about 3 hours but it wore me out. For the first time in over a decade I missed work the next day and had intermittent fever and chills. The thing that got me was tachycardia about 110-115 at rest and higher with activity for the remainder of the day. The second night I woke up drenched in sweat, but felt fine on day 3. 
 

Many I have talked to had nothing more than sore arm, and some had fatigue and muscle aches with the second shot. A significant number reported symptoms similar to mine with the second injection.  Of those who previously had COVID they had a robust response to the first injection, but not so much with the second. 
 

Before the pandemic we traveled, went to sporting events and live music, ate out 3 times per week, hosted dinner parties and many other things. In the summer we had a couple of restaurants with outdoor patio seating and we were happy to go there at low occupancy times like Tuesday at 3 in the afternoon. Now we do none of that but with the vaccine and improving infection rates I’m ready to get back to the new normal, whatever that may be. 
 

Bottom line... I would recommend a couple days of flu like symptoms over what I have seen for the past 10 months. Beginning with the youngest at age 19 I’ve seen someone die in every decade of life, but most are older as reported in the news. The risk factors you hear of including Obesty, Diabetes, hypertension, heart kidney and lung disease are real, but I have also seen seemingly healthy people have severe disease as well. 

[Hank]

My company, a medical manufacturer, is in Group 1B, and our turn will come soon. I plan to treat the "sore arm" thing like I have every shot since college (tetanus, typhoid, cholera, flu, you name it)--wait an hour or so then do a dozen or so pushups, even leaning in a doorway or against a wall works. For those shots in the seat of your pants, a few squats or deep knee bends help. The whole point is to use the muscle that the injection went into, it makes a huge difference!

[Bluevalley]

I'm not against vaccines, I was vaccinated as a child in the early 50's. Nothing since. I've never had a flu shot either (wife did and she damn near died)! At my age I'm going to pass on this one also. I've been around this world more times than I can count and only had a couple of head colds. Growing up on a ranch and currently ranching, maybe I've developed "heard immunity" LOL. Oh well, I'm glad I'm retired! "Beijing Uses Anal Swabs To Detect COVID-19 Strains" Have fun boys and girls.

[Bluevalley]

4 hours ago, donkaye said:

We had our 1st Moderna shot on Tuesday.  We had to wait on the phone for nearly 3 hours to get the appointment.  It's been over 2 days now and just the same arm soreness reported above.  It's a little worse than the flu shot, but not by much.  The next shot is in 4 weeks, and after hearing of some of the side effects both above and from some friends, we have some apprehension but will complete the process.

The positive is that I expect to get back to flight instructing full time again a couple of weeks after the second shot to let immunity build up, of course still using a mask, and a lot of hand sanitizer.  Unless you're teaching in a 747, social distancing is not in the cards.

The cockpit seats in a 747 are not 6' apart. Sorry.

[Jerry 5TJ]

I have two flight students who took a pause last March due to CoVid.  One is an ER physician & the other a surgeon, both frequently are around patients with the virus.  Back then it seemed prudent to keep our distance.  
I am scheduled to get my second Pfizer injection in a week and they are now both fully vaccinated.  
So we plan to resume training next month. 
We still will be wearing our masks in the cockpit.