Paved Runway/Hard surface vs Turf/Grass

[Seth]

This is a separate question to the previous thread about airpark communities. And not specifically for Mooneys (it could work but be careful).

In general, if you were to operate an aircraft out of a private strip on your property, or be part of an airpark community, would you favor a paved hard surface strip (asphalt, concrete) or a turf/grass strip? If you owned your own property it could be an improved meadow as well. It's a different question for a landing strip on your private property vs an airpark community, so please give the answer to each. Especially if you have firsthand reasons and experience, but this is open to everyone.

I do know it's less expensive to get and operate a helicopter than to build a hard surface runway from scratch. 

Thanks,

-Seth

[Jim Peace]

I have a friend who lives on a grass strip here in Florida.  After it rains they are always shut down for a period of 1 to 3 days.  And it rains a lot.  Maybe not a issue if you have something with tundra tires but with a Mooney its a no go for me unless its dry.  Also after it rains you have to have someone drive it and inspect it for issues....unless its a big airpark like Leeward Air Ranch or Triple Tree or similar I would not want to live on a grass strip.  

[Mooneymite]

A paved strip is preferable for sure for wet weather ops. 

How quickly a turf runway becomes useable after a soaking rain is subject to many variables such as soil type, crown and slope.  Climate is a huge factor...are you in Seattle, or the desert southwest? 

The other factor to remember is that if the runway is paved, but the taxiways are turf, you may not be able to get to your "all weather runway".

OTH, in the 23 years I've lived on a turf runway in the Georgia climate, I've had to delay planned trips a few hours in some cases, but generally it hasn't been a problem.  I've never had to do it, but I always have the option of flying my plane to a nearby county airport the day before a big rain and departing from there when our runway is too soft.  Same goes for returning after a big rain.

For Mooney ops, keep in mind that there are wide variances in turf runways.  The smoother, the better.  If you want to operate off of unimproved grass, get a taildragger.

[GeeBee]

The problem with having your own airstrip and having asphalt is you don't get enough rolling over the asphalt to maintain. Asphalt has to be rolled upon regularly to flex it and renew the seal. If you made the runway part of your driveway, that would work. Concrete is really expensive.

[Hank]

I voted hard surface for both. Grass strips are problematic after heavy rain. I've come mighty close to getting stuck before (requiring full power to keep moving . . . )

I wonder why this didn't post last night?

I also saw several prop strikes at Sun n Fun the first two days after the tornado, as people flew in and taxied from the pavement onto the still very wet grass and buried their nose wheels. My own departure was a day late due to the wet, and it took both of us to pull the plane out of the ruts it made sitting there for several days.

Edited January 9, 2021 by Hank

[carusoam]

Getting stuck at sloshskosh after a few days... I thought 280hp would have freed things up a bit...

Be sure to have something hard to park on...

Best regards,

-a-

[laytonl]

I would prefer a hard surface but live in a flyin community with a grass runway.  A wet runway is seldom a problem as our runway drains well.  Our runway is one way though due to runway slope and trees.  Since it is a 3000 ft runway tailwinds over 10 kts are a problem. It is a 100 foot walk from my house to the hangar. Lee

[tmo]

Grass can be made to drain well and would be my choice for sole/private usage; with the modern grass reinforcement methods (think Terra Grid and Perfo as examples) it can easily handle turbine twins and even jets (I know of a PC24 being bought to live on a Terra Grid airfield where a Beech 1900 is already based).

As much as I love our Mooney, I wouldn't want a 2500x150 ft blob of black goo in my back yard.

For a community, it'd be a wash. I'm sure properly installed Terra Grid would withstand the usage of a sizable community, but doing the grass reinforcements properly is not inexpensive.

[Mooneymite]

2 hours ago, tmo said:

Grass can be made to drain well...

Our grass runway is on good old, red Georgia clay.  The original turf was "Heinz 57"- basically whatever grass/weeds would grow on it.  In the summer, we had summer weeds, in the winter, we had winter weeds with cold and hot weather grasses mixed in, but something was always green and growing.  We fertilized and mowed, kept it green and clipped; it worked fine.  The water didn't penetrate the Georgia clay very well and we could use the runway within a couple of hours of a big rain.

However, a group of well meaning residents decided to convert our "Heinz 57" into 100% Bermuda.  Well, it was about 75% field Bermuda and 25% turf type Bermuda.  Bermuda looks great in the summer, but has to be watered, so we installed an irrigation system and well.  However, Bermuda goes dormant for about 4 months and now the runway gets threadbare in the center.  The solution:  seed it with winter rye.  The problem:  winter rye is not tough enough to stand much rolling use. 

The Bermuda project included (and still includes) aerating the runway every chance they get to make the soil better for their Bermuda.  What they didn't understand was the same things that make the Bermuda grow well, also made the runway absorb water better.  Now the runway has to dry for a day, or more and parts of it seem to stay wet because it's like a big sponge now.

The group that is running the show has decided the solution to the damage done by over-aerating is to put down a plastic mat product at a cost of over $50,000.  It still hasn't dawned on this group that over-aerating may be good for grass, but bad for a runway.  So we've spent money on Bermuda sod and seed, annual rye grass seeding, an irrigation system, hours of rolling and aerating, and now plastic mat to compensate for the muck and have ended up with a runway that isn't a usable as what we started with.

A fly-in community is first and foremost a community.  Go along, get along, pay your dues.  Enjoy the green grass!

[47U]

For reliable dispatch, a hard surface.  For nostalgia, grass.  

My C was hangared on at 1/2 mile farm strip in the northern midwest for 35 years.  It was solid enough that the rain generally didn’t bother it, but in the spring when the frost was going out there was a week or two when it wasn’t useable.  The winter presented snow issues, but a snow blower on a tractor 3-point hitch would clean it off.  Not the full 80 foot width, but enough to get in and out.  The tires running over frozen tractor treads in the snow was a whole new type of vibration, to be avoided.  If the snow wasn’t too deep (less than 6” or so), on takeoff roll you could feel the airplane accelerate as it got light enough to get on top of the ‘step’ of the snow.  Not flying speed yet, but acceleration was much better.  Should’ve had skis...

[carusoam]

Proof that the ‘step’ is actually real...   

Great details shared!

Best regards,

-a-