rgaines Posted August 4, 2009 Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 I have a 1962 Mooney. I am considering various modifications, including the 201 Window upgrade and various gap seals etc. Does anyone have any before and after experience with any speed modification to know whether the expected speed increases are correct? I did the cowl modification and it worked as advertised with a 3-4 mph speed increase. I am planning to paint my airplane and do an interior renovation. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KSMooniac Posted August 4, 2009 Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 Welcome to the forum! I'm just down the road from you and know of several other Mooney owners in the area. Last year we did a fly-out lunch to K81 (Paola) for BBQ one weekend and should try to make that a regular activity. The biggest speed mods for the early planes are the 201 windshield and cowl conversions. There are lots of cowl mods, from the simple "cowl closure" that reduces the big fish mouth, to a scab-on closure/snout that mimics a 201 geometry and uses a 201 spinner, to hybrids of the pre-201 cowl that almost duplicate the 201 cowl, and then there are full 201 cowl conversions. (in order from least expensive to most expensive) If you are going to paint and do the interior, then it would be a great opportunity to replace all of the windows and do the 201 windshield...it will get you a few more MPH as well as a nice amount of storage space on the glareshield for maps and such. I'm getting ready to paint very soon and I just orderd overlapping nose gear doors (my originals are worn anyway), the later model dorsal fin/empennage fairing, and rudder/elevator hinge covers. Those might net me a couple of knots, maybe. Gap seals all-around will help your early bird too, and don't cost a bunch. You might go shopping here: http://www.lasar.com/mods.asp or http://www.swta.net/mooneyproductinfo/mooneymodpackages.html or http://www.mooneymart.com/Frames/Intro/introduction_to_mmmods.htm to start your wish list. FYI, you cannot add all of the individual speed gains up and get a believable number. If you can only do one thing, I would do the windshield and then go after the others as your budget allows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rgaines Posted August 5, 2009 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2009 Thanks for the information. I go to K81 all the time. I already have the cowl closure and found it worked as claimed and am now considering doing the SWTA 201 window modification. Just checking around to see if others found it to add some mph. Thanks Rgaines Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Anonymous Posted August 5, 2009 Report Share Posted August 5, 2009 Quote: KSMooniac If you can only do one thing, I would do the windshield and then go after the others as your budget allows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eaglebkh Posted August 5, 2009 Report Share Posted August 5, 2009 How much speed increase does the brake caliper reversal provide? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N207LS Posted August 7, 2009 Report Share Posted August 7, 2009 The brake caliper reversal is about 1 mph in reality. I agree that the 201 windshield is the best mod in terms of speed for the $$$. I have several of the mods (gap seals, tail and wing fairing, brake rotation, powerflow, 201 windshield, ari full cowl/nose mod, 201 spinner, k&n air filter), and computed the cost the the former owner of my plane at $1500-$1800 per mph on my airplane. For my $$$ I would do the windshield first, the cowl mod second, and the powerflow third. I would most likely skip the rest and put the $$$ into the panel. Aaron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auburn02 Posted August 7, 2009 Report Share Posted August 7, 2009 As I've mentioned before any E/F model I buy will pretty much have to already have a 201 windshield at a minimum. If that were the only mod done I would take it upon myself to add the lower cowl enclosure and that's about it. Though this caliper rotation sounds interesting, I would probably look into that as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lood Posted August 24, 2009 Report Share Posted August 24, 2009 My Mooney is due for it's annual on 15 October. I'm having the brake caliper reversal done as well as the cowl closure mod. Next year I will do the oil cooler relocation and some upgrades in the panel. BTW, can anyone tell me what the single side window mod consists of? It does wonders in terms of looks on the F model, but I was quoted ZAR27k - that's almost $3400! I though it would just be a simple cut away of the center piece splitting the two exisiting side windows and fitting a one piece window, but looking at the quoted price, there seems to be much more to it? My Mooney only achieves a TAS of around 138kts at 8000ft - full throttle, 2500rpm, 50deg ROP. I will test it again after the annual to see if there's any noticable speed increase. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan Fox Posted October 24, 2009 Report Share Posted October 24, 2009 I did my mods all at once , I did the cowl closure ,flap and aileron gap seals , brake rotation ,gear bay liners and wing root cuffs... I got about 10 to 11 mph out of all of them , but the cowl closure is the most bang for the buck , it got about 4 mph... That is the only one I tried separately... I get 140 knots indicated airspeed at 2400 rpm and 24 inches of mercury.. My best speed is about 8500 feet msl at 2400 rpm and about 19 to 20 inches hg and my ground trac is about 151 to 153 knots with about 125 kts indicated airspeed... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt_CrashN_Burn Posted December 13, 2010 Report Share Posted December 13, 2010 Quote: rgaines Thanks for the information. I go to K81 all the time. I already have the cowl closure and found it worked as claimed and am now considering doing the SWTA 201 window modification. Just checking around to see if others found it to add some mph. Thanks Rgaines Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lood Posted December 13, 2010 Report Share Posted December 13, 2010 I ended up only doing the Lasar lower cowl closure mod. Nothing changed except for the engine running cooler. Certainly no noticeable speed increase in my situation. Next annual, I'm going to skip all the minor mods and do the 201 windshield. No use spending money to score some extra speed without it actually happening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piloto Posted December 13, 2010 Report Share Posted December 13, 2010 Many of these mods will have some minor speed improvement but in order to see the effect you have to fly the plane at max power (2700rpm/30") and at 1000 feet. At 10,000 feet at 65% you will not notice any difference unless it is a turbo mod addition. The reason is drag. Drag has a greater effect at the higher power settings and lower altitudes. So if you are dissappointed by your new mod try it at the lower altitudes and get a magnifying glas over your air IAS to see the difference. José Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaV8or Posted December 13, 2010 Report Share Posted December 13, 2010 All my mods were installed by prior owners, so I don't know how effective they were. I do know that my log books show that the flap hinge fairings were installed, but they're not there. This says to me that they didn't amount to any speed advantage and just got in the way, so off they went. proof of the pudding is the fact that when Mooney built the Acclaim with intent to capture the highest piston speed title, they didn't bother with hinge fairings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piperpainter Posted December 13, 2010 Report Share Posted December 13, 2010 I know my windshield mod gave me a few knots. But more importantly it looks a helluva lot better and makes the cabin quieter than it was before with the single piece 1/4" thick window. Also some of the mods, such as the wheel well liners, not sure if they help with speed so much as when it comes time to clean out the wheel well...its just much easier and looks better. Not that people typically get down and look at them! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbridges Posted December 13, 2010 Report Share Posted December 13, 2010 reading about the evolution of the 201, it appears the biggest help was the 201 cowling and windshield. All the other stuff may add a little here and there, but I think you'd need quite a few to make a noticeable difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgrami Posted December 14, 2010 Report Share Posted December 14, 2010 Quote: rbridges reading about the evolution of the 201, it appears the biggest help was the 201 cowling and windshield. All the other stuff may add a little here and there, but I think you'd need quite a few to make a noticeable difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flight2000 Posted December 15, 2010 Report Share Posted December 15, 2010 Quote: dgrami I would appreciate it if anybody would like to share their experiences and costs in replacing their windshield. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mcstealth Posted December 15, 2010 Report Share Posted December 15, 2010 Quote: flight2000 I had the LASAR 201 Windshield installed on mine for just under $3.5K (parts and labor). Best Mod I did out of all of them. If you want the guys name that did the mod for me, just send me a PM. He's based out of San Antonio, TX and it takes about two weeks to complete. Brian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeorgePerry Posted December 15, 2010 Report Share Posted December 15, 2010 Quote: rgaines I have a 1962 Mooney. I am considering various modifications, including the 201 Window upgrade and various gap seals etc. Does anyone have any before and after experience with any speed modification to know whether the expected speed increases are correct? I did the cowl modification and it worked as advertised with a 3-4 mph speed increase. I am planning to paint my airplane and do an interior renovation. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flight2000 Posted December 15, 2010 Report Share Posted December 15, 2010 Guys (and gals), please remember that we lost rgaines back in July of this year. This is an older thread, so keep that in mind. He passed away about a month after he completed all of the mods he was talking about back in 09. Brian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capt_CrashN_Burn Posted December 15, 2010 Report Share Posted December 15, 2010 Quote: flight2000 Guys (and gals), please remember that we lost rgaines back in July of this year. This is an older thread, so keep that in mind. He passed away about a month after he completed all of the mods he was talking about back in 09. Brian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjmacdonald Posted December 15, 2010 Report Share Posted December 15, 2010 I to have a 63c model that i have been toying with a windsheild and some other speed mods. I agree that the prices of 201s are cheaper than ever but to sell a early c is also bottom dollar so there really is no advantage to selling it your gonna spend alot either way just my 2 cents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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