Logging solo time

[ilovecornfields]

I apologize in advance because I feel like this is a stupid question, but does anyone log “solo” time after getting their private pilot license? I remember being told to stop logging “solo” once I could log “PIC” but my current instructor is telling me I should be logging both. Is this what everyone else is doing? Is there a reference to logging “solo” time after you get your license?

[Rwsavory]

I am curious why the instructor would give you that advice. Anyway, no “solo” time for me.   It’s all PIC. 

[Andy95W]

A few years ago (maybe 20?) even the FAA agreed that "solo" time is actually PIC time, because every flight has a pilot in command, even if that flight was commanded by a student pilot.  But once you get the private license, it simply doesn't matter for anything.

Please ask your current instructor why he thinks you should be logging both.  If he can stammer out a reason, please post it here on MooneySpace.  After some of the aerodynamics discussions, we could use a good laugh!

[ragedracer1977]

10 minutes ago, Andy95W said:

A few years ago (maybe 20?) even the FAA agreed that "solo" time is actually PIC time, because every flight has a pilot in command, even if that flight was commanded by a student pilot.  But once you get the private license, it simply doesn't matter for anything.

Please ask your current instructor why he thinks you should be logging both.  If he can stammer out a reason, please post it here on MooneySpace.  After some of the aerodynamics discussions, we could use a good laugh!

There is a reason to log solo.  Want to be a commercial pilot?

[ilovecornfields]

His reason was that he has to fill out the IACRA form for my commercial pilot checkride and I guess it asks for “solo” flight time (he claimed having your dog with you made it unloggabble as solo). He was frustrated because I don’t log my time as solo if I’m the only occupant and I told him that no one had ever asked for it before (and last time I took a checkride there was no IACRA). 
 

I guess I’m not sure why anyone would care (a distinction without a difference?). I rarely have a passenger with me that makes the flight any easier and they usually make it more challenging but for some reason the FAA wants to know if I’m by myself?!

[Skates97]

I guess I'm the odd one out. If I'm alone in the plane I log it as PIC and Solo, if I have someone with me I just log it as PIC. I use myflightbook.com and you can record all kinds of different fields and if you need an 8710 form you just click on it and it has all the totals for you. 

[ilovecornfields]

Just now, Skates97 said:

I guess I'm the odd one out. If I'm alone in the plane I log it as PIC and Solo, if I have someone with me I just log it as PIC. I use myflightbook.com and you can record all kinds of different fields and if you need an 8710 form you just click on it and it has all the totals for you. 

I think my instructor would argue that you’re the only one doing it right!

There’s no way I’m going to go back through my logbook and try to figure out which flights were by myself and add “solo” time, though. I guess the question is if I should start doing it now...

[jaylw314]

2 hours ago, ilovecornfields said:

His reason was that he has to fill out the IACRA form for my commercial pilot checkride and I guess it asks for “solo” flight time (he claimed having your dog with you made it unloggabble as solo). He was frustrated because I don’t log my time as solo if I’m the only occupant and I told him that no one had ever asked for it before (and last time I took a checkride there was no IACRA). 
 

I guess I’m not sure why anyone would care (a distinction without a difference?). I rarely have a passenger with me that makes the flight any easier and they usually make it more challenging but for some reason the FAA wants to know if I’m by myself?!

My interepretation, but I'd use the hours I did in my private pilot training flying without an instructor as my "solo" time.  That means it will never change in the future, and I'd put the same "solo" time for any subsequent IACRA application.

[201er]

As long as you can prove you met the requirements of 61.127, solo time beyond that is unimportant for anything.

 

(4) Ten hours of solo flight time in a single engine airplane or 10 hours of flight time performing the duties of pilot in command in a single engine airplane with an authorized instructor on board (either of which may be credited towards the flight time requirement under paragraph (a)(2) of this section), on the areas of operation listed under §61.127(b)(1) that include—

(i) One cross-country flight of not less than 300 nautical miles total distance, with landings at a minimum of three points, one of which is a straight-line distance of at least 250 nautical miles from the original departure point. However, if this requirement is being met in Hawaii, the longest segment need only have a straight-line distance of at least 150 nautical miles; and 

(ii) 5 hours in night VFR conditions with 10 takeoffs and 10 landings (with each landing involving a flight in the traffic pattern) at an airport with an operating control tower.

 

[midlifeflyer]

35 minutes ago, 201er said:

As long as you can prove you met the requirements of 61.127, solo time beyond that is unimportant for anything.

 

(4) Ten hours of solo flight time in a single engine airplane or 10 hours of flight time performing the duties of pilot in command in a single engine airplane with an authorized instructor on board (either of which may be credited towards the flight time requirement under paragraph (a)(2) of this section), on the areas of operation listed under §61.127(b)(1) that include—

(i) One cross-country flight of not less than 300 nautical miles total distance, with landings at a minimum of three points, one of which is a straight-line distance of at least 250 nautical miles from the original departure point. However, if this requirement is being met in Hawaii, the longest segment need only have a straight-line distance of at least 150 nautical miles; and 

(ii) 5 hours in night VFR conditions with 10 takeoffs and 10 landings (with each landing involving a flight in the traffic pattern) at an airport with an operating control tower.

 

This. The only post-private FAA certificate or rating which requires solo time - meaning the only human on board - is the commercial (unless you are using the "performing the duties" substitute). Of course, logging solo fir that purpose doesn't require that column.

BTW, I knew someone who had his commercial checkride terminated because he didn't log enough.

[Culver LFA]

7 hours ago, Skates97 said:

I guess I'm the odd one out. If I'm alone in the plane I log it as PIC and Solo, if I have someone with me I just log it as PIC.

I do the same, it’s so easy to do why wouldn’t you?

I also note interesting things I did or saw along the way, who I met and the names of passengers I took flying.  When I can’t fly anymore I’ll enjoy remembering this time in my life and the experience 

[wcb]

8 minutes ago, Culver LFA said:

I do the same, it’s so easy to do why wouldn’t you?

I also note interesting things I did or saw along the way, who I met and the names of passengers I took flying.  When I can’t fly anymore I’ll enjoy remembering this time in my life and the experience 

+1

[RLCarter]

Your Insurance may require "Solo" time for any transition training before you can carry passengers. Time for Ratings and Currency are the only thing that needs to logged (Proof). I have a bunch of SIC time and have never logged any of it

[steingar]

I log everything.  You never know when you'll need it for currency, insurance, training or whatever else.

[ReconMax]

My logbook says "PILOT IN COMMAND (INCL. SOLO)... I always note passengers in the remarks if there are any. Do you guys use Tach or Hobbs or Watch?

[Hank]

28 minutes ago, ReconMax said:

My logbook says "PILOT IN COMMAND (INCL. SOLO)... I always note passengers in the remarks if there are any. Do you guys use Tach or Hobbs or Watch?

My logbook has a separate column for Solo.

I log all flight time using my watch. Tach time is for maintenance. Hobbs time (don't have one in my Mooney) is for paying rental charges.

[gsxrpilot]

45 minutes ago, ReconMax said:

Do you guys use Tach or Hobbs or Watch?

None of the above... I use ForeFlight as it logs all my time automatically. But in the event I don't have ForeFlight with me, then I use my JPI data. Sometimes when trying to catch up the logbook on ForeFlight and verify everything, I refer to my saved data on SavvyAnalysis. All my flights are logged by the JPI and I upload the data regularly (once a month or so) to SavvyAnalysis.

 

[Skates97]

2 hours ago, Culver LFA said:

I do the same, it’s so easy to do why wouldn’t you?

I also note interesting things I did or saw along the way, who I met and the names of passengers I took flying.  When I can’t fly anymore I’ll enjoy remembering this time in my life and the experience 

I agree, when putting it into myflightbook I just click the boxes to cross fill the data. It doesn't take much more time to log the extra information, like whether the takeoff/landings were at towered or non-towered airports, full stop landings or not, etc... I put in the route flown as well as it will calculate approximate total miles flown. I like the airports visited and number of visits at them too. Even if it isn't necessary it's fun to look at the different stats from my flying.

[ReconMax]

25 minutes ago, gsxrpilot said:

None of the above... I use ForeFlight as it logs all my time automatically. But in the event I don't have ForeFlight with me, then I use my JPI data. Sometimes when trying to catch up the logbook on ForeFlight and verify everything, I refer to my saved data on SavvyAnalysis. All my flights are logged by the JPI and I upload the data regularly (once a month or so) to SavvyAnalysis.

 

I wonder if I can do that with my JPI 830. I have not yet tried to get any data off of it yet. I'll look into it. For a second, I thought I might start relying on Garmin Pilot but it didn't work out for me. Maybe I need to learn more about it though. I basically decided that the only reliable way to record my time was to use my logbook and write it down.

[gsxrpilot]

6 minutes ago, ReconMax said:

I wonder if I can do that with my JPI 830. I have not yet tried to get any data off of it yet. I'll look into it. For a second, I thought I might start relying on Garmin Pilot but it didn't work out for me. Maybe I need to learn more about it though. I basically decided that the only reliable way to record my time was to use my logbook and write it down.

Assuming your JPI 830 has data logging, which it should, I highly recommend opening a free account at SavvyAnalysis and start uploading all your engine data there. It's a super nice log and when questions arise, it makes troubleshooting much easier.

[Oldguy]

8 minutes ago, ReconMax said:

I wonder if I can do that with my JPI 830. I have not yet tried to get any data off of it yet. I'll look into it. For a second, I thought I might start relying on Garmin Pilot but it didn't work out for me. Maybe I need to learn more about it though. I basically decided that the only reliable way to record my time was to use my logbook and write it down.

 

Just now, gsxrpilot said:

Assuming your JPI 830 has data logging, which it should, I highly recommend opening a free account at SavvyAnalysis and start uploading all your engine data there. It's a super nice log and when questions arise, it makes troubleshooting much easier.

Exactly what @gsxrpilot said. If you look at many of the questions on MS about engine problems, many times you will see a picture included from the Savvyanalysis.com site for the engine in question. And with as many top notch mechanics as we have on this site, you can usually get an answer in a relatively short time.

[ReconMax]

3 minutes ago, Oldguy said:

 

Exactly what @gsxrpilot said. If you look at many of the questions on MS about engine problems, many times you will see a picture included from the Savvyanalysis.com site for the engine in question. And with as many top notch mechanics as we have on this site, you can usually get an answer in a relatively short time.

@gsxrpilot and @Oldguy, Thanks for the suggestion. I just opened an account and will start working on pulling my data.

[Stephen]

2 hours ago, gsxrpilot said:

None of the above... I use ForeFlight as it logs all my time automatically. But in the event I don't have ForeFlight with me, then I use my JPI data. Sometimes when trying to catch up the logbook on ForeFlight and verify everything, I refer to my saved data on SavvyAnalysis. All my flights are logged by the JPI and I upload the data regularly (once a month or so) to SavvyAnalysis.

 

+1, mostly.  I take a pic of the Hobbs/Tach on JPI before and after starting flight and >> ForFlight flight log with that

[Andy95W]

13 hours ago, ragedracer1977 said:

There is a reason to log solo.  Want to be a commercial pilot?

Yes, I do! 

I'm not sure if it's changed (and I doubt that it has) but when I took my Commercial checkride back in the 90s, "Solo" meant without an instructor present to provide assistance, with the implication that another pilot also did not provide assistance.  My solo cross country was one of the (many) cross country flights I took with my wife (who is not a licensed pilot).  When I was instructing 20 years ago, this was exactly how I sent my students for their checkrides, and never had an issue with any DPE or the FSDO.

And with more than a year and a half of flight time at this point, I sure as hell ain't gonna start logging that now.

[Andy95W]

13 hours ago, ilovecornfields said:

(he claimed having your dog with you made it unloggabble as solo). 

I've been around aviation for a long time and I think this is one of the stupidest things I've ever heard.

@ilovecornfields 's instructor really needs to talk to a local DPE to see how this is actually interpreted by his local FSDO.