L. Trotter Posted January 27, 2018 Report Posted January 27, 2018 Let me pass on some lessons learned this past week. I was traveling from Norfolk, Virginia (CPK) to Lawrence County Airpark (HTW), Ohio this past week. A full briefing was obtained including local NOTAMS. All was well with no reported runway (3000 x 70 ft) concerns at HTW. The winds were calm and the approach to RWY 26 was uneventful. What I didn't notice was "black ice" covering large parts of the runway. Solid ice in parts with melted ice on other parts rendered the pavement wet and dark looking throughout...It all looked the same from the air. I started braking uneventfully at first, until I hit the first section of ice. In retrospect, standard brake pressure....then hitting ice... caused the wheels to lock-up and stop rolling (no antilock feature) until the next non ice spot. I did note the tires sliding on ice and then for maybe a second or two on the non ice surface. I eventually was able to stop, trying only to brake on the wet surface areas (easier to identify once on the ground). Now the lessons.... 1. Even a second or two of skidding can destroy a tire. Yes! just that fast. By luck I saw a single focal flattened area the size of a walnut (into the metal cords) on a new right tire while pushing the plane into position for tie down. If you feel your tires slid while braking, check the entire circumference of all tires. I replaced my tire. 2. You can burn up a lot of runway if it is slippery. Abort the landing early if you don't have a mile to slow down without brakes or just go to a different airport if there is any concern. Under the current flight parameters, I needed 1900' to stop under ideal conditions. I should have played it safe and aborted the landing at the FIRST indication of trouble on this relatively short runway. 3. Although NOTAM's are nice and are created with reasonable reliability, remain cautious particularly at smaller airports. 4. I am sure glad I have always been anal about approach speeds. In my case, 75 kts when crossing approach end of RWY. For each additional 1 kt, expect burning up an additional 100' of runway in our Mooney's. Just 3-4 kts in this case would have resulted in a disaster. A "sterile cockpit" is essential on all landings, considering all flight and environmental factors. Don't let landing become routine. 1
Piloto Posted January 27, 2018 Report Posted January 27, 2018 (edited) Any time I am landing on a wet or icy runway or strong crosswinds I raise the flaps completely just 3ft before touchdown. This ensure a positive contact with the runway and avoid a slippery or weathervane condition. José Edited January 27, 2018 by Piloto
Yetti Posted January 27, 2018 Report Posted January 27, 2018 Did you dynamic brake with full aft yoke?
L. Trotter Posted January 27, 2018 Author Report Posted January 27, 2018 42 minutes ago, Yetti said: Did you dynamic brake with full aft yoke? Yes I did with flaps retracted immediately after touchdown, trying to get as much weight on the main tires as possible.
Hank Posted January 27, 2018 Report Posted January 27, 2018 Welcome to my former home field! I understand the trees on both ends have been cut down. When I was last there almost a year ago, we still had to level off on final for 26 just above 700msl to clear the trees, then chop the throttle and descend to the runway. I'm pretty sure that in the 7 years I was based there, I drug a tire through the branches at least once. That's when I stepped up from 650 to 700 msl over the trees. See if Terry is there, he may be able to do something for you. He may also be across the river (4nm flight or a 25 minute drive) at HTS, where they have another maintenance operation. It all started at Lawrence County, then expanded to the Huntington D. They have radar there, and are great about providing service, I always called them leaving the pattern at HTW. Sorry that you had problems . . . . Tell them I said Hey if you see anyone. Hope this doesn't interfere with the rest of your trip home!
Raptor05121 Posted January 27, 2018 Report Posted January 27, 2018 You guys can have it. I honestly don't know how I didn't stuff my plane landing on a snow-covered runway in MD. Between having to wait for the runway to get plowed and all the other time and money consuming parts of ice and snow removal, I would soon just head south.
Bob - S50 Posted January 27, 2018 Report Posted January 27, 2018 Thanks for the lessons learned. If it makes you feel better, years ago we blew one of our main tires on a DC9 at STL under similar circumstances.. and we had anti-lock brakes!
StevenL757 Posted January 27, 2018 Report Posted January 27, 2018 9 hours ago, L. Trotter said: 4. I am sure glad I have always been anal about approach speeds. In my case, 75 kts when crossing approach end of RWY. For each additional 1 kt, expect burning up an additional 100' of runway in our Mooney's. Just 3-4 kts in this case would have resulted in a disaster. A "sterile cockpit" is essential on all landings, considering all flight and environmental factors. Don't let landing become routine. Thanks for sharing. Handled differently, that could have easily turned into a runway excursion event instead of a tire replacement. Glad everything turned out well. Steve
TWinter Posted January 27, 2018 Report Posted January 27, 2018 Glad all ended well. It's ironic I'm reading this post as I'm watching the news and weather while drinking morning coffee. The weather channel just did a quick news report on a possible upgrade for major airports and their runways. I've never seen this before or thought of it, but they either have been or thinking about putting heating grids under the runways (much like a heated floor in a home). They did a on location report at some airport and took a temp reading on a non grid section of a runway and temp was 27f. They did a temp reading on a runway w/ this heat grid system and the temp was 67f. Interesting concept for the future.. of course it will only be at major airports, but very neat concept. -Tom
Hank Posted January 27, 2018 Report Posted January 27, 2018 (edited) 52 minutes ago, TWinter said: Glad all ended well. It's ironic I'm reading this post as I'm watching the news and weather while drinking morning coffee. The weather channel just did a quick news report on a possible upgrade for major airports and their runways. I've never seen this before or thought of it, but they either have been or thinking about putting heating grids under the runways (much like a heated floor in a home). They did a on location report at some airport and took a temp reading on a non grid section of a runway and temp was 27f. They did a temp reading on a runway w/ this heat grid system and the temp was 67f. Interesting concept for the future.. of course it will only be at major airports, but very neat concept. -Tom That sounds good, but heating acres of runway will be expensive. Will theynbe solar powered? I did the math once when we were spraying weeds on the runway at HTW, its 3001 x 75', almost exactly 5 acres. So what would the five huge runways at ATL cost to heat? Each ine is easilynthree times as long and twice as wide (or more)--5 acres x 3 x 2 = 30 acres per runway x 5 = minimum of 150 acres of runway . . . . . Yeah, I know ATL won't need heated runways, but the mathnstill holds for places like DTW, ORD, JFK, MSP, etc. Edited January 27, 2018 by Hank 1
rbridges Posted January 27, 2018 Report Posted January 27, 2018 3 hours ago, TWinter said: Glad all ended well. It's ironic I'm reading this post as I'm watching the news and weather while drinking morning coffee. The weather channel just did a quick news report on a possible upgrade for major airports and their runways. I've never seen this before or thought of it, but they either have been or thinking about putting heating grids under the runways (much like a heated floor in a home). They did a on location report at some airport and took a temp reading on a non grid section of a runway and temp was 27f. They did a temp reading on a runway w/ this heat grid system and the temp was 67f. Interesting concept for the future.. of course it will only be at major airports, but very neat concept. -Tom I saw a news report at a major airport about heated runways, too. Someone spouted something about $200M but said the costs from avoiding delays and cancellations would be worth it over time. 1
carusoam Posted January 27, 2018 Report Posted January 27, 2018 Great reminder, LT! This is where a few extra knots, a few extra pounds, a few knots of wind and a few extra feet of runway add up (or down). The Long Body comes with it’s own extra pounds.... We know that runway pretty well from Hank's prior photos. Best regards, -a-
Hank Posted January 27, 2018 Report Posted January 27, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, carusoam said: We know that runway pretty well from Hank's prior photos. Anthony, it's not the one with horrible patches, narrow and uphill. It's this one, with the nhmbers that I painted on both ends with 10 gallons of Behr paint-and-primer in one! Edited January 27, 2018 by Hank
carusoam Posted January 27, 2018 Report Posted January 27, 2018 I have fuzzy memories all blended together... 1) short, patchy, uphill runway, passing the steeple on the way by... 2) short, river side runway, with tall trees, protecting somebody's farmland from wind erosion... they were probably some low cost shrubs when first planted. Best regards, -a-,
Hank Posted January 27, 2018 Report Posted January 27, 2018 5 minutes ago, carusoam said: I have fuzzy memories all blended together... 1) short, patchy, uphill runway, passing the steeple on the way by... 2) short, river side runway, with tall trees, protecting somebody's farmland from wind erosion... they were probably some low cost shrubs when first planted. Best regards, -a-, #1 is when I head to the NC mountains to see Mom & Dad. #2 is where I got my PPL and kept my Mooney for 7 years before moving back south. This is KHTW from AirNav, I don't have a picture like this on my new phone . . . 1
Recommended Posts