How hard is it to change door panel? Got mine in the mail

[ryoder]

Good idea about the headliner but mine is 100% plastic. It does have some issues and I might replace it some day or cover it.

[Marauder]

Re headliners, I would ask the trim shop you are talking to about the seats. Auto trim shops do car headliners. Auto headliners typically stay glued for years even though the car sits in the sun and the span is far greater than our Mooney segments. Eventually the heat breaks down the foam, not the glue, and the fabric releases from the roof.

We used auto headliner material, "rigid" foam, and contact adhesive. The plane is usually hangered, I expect the headliner to last about 50 more years.

Bob - I'm going to look you up to talk through this process. I have seen your interior and Peter's so I know a decent interior can be had for a decent price. Just need to know how to go about it.

[Marauder]

I just ordered a set of Airtex leather seats and foam in tan. Also got the panels and wind lace. Seats will take six to eight weeks and I might see panels in two to three weeks.

I pulled a seat and took it to the upholstery shop for a discussion. We torched some vinyl and I saw a flame start and then extinguish immediately when the heat was removed. However with leather there was no flame, just a shrinking. Also the vinyl stunk up the place but not the leather. That sold me on leather and they couldn't touch Airtex's price.

The plan is to let them install the covers for me to ensure a professional fit. I'll bolt the panels and seats in and fly in style and comfort.

Here are my current seats. They have no support and are dated.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Bob_Belville]

Chris, my first stage was to take my seats to the custom auto trim shop to redo in leather. The front seats, back bench seat and back with new foam and welding a broken frame and the rear seat kick panel cost me $490. After seeing how nice that was I had him buy another hide for the side panels, luggage area. The leather made the other components look even more ratty so I did the plastic and the headliner, etc..

[DS1980]

Try a company like Fibrenew next time. They offer a mobile service and will be a fraction of what you just paid.

[Marauder]

Chris, my first stage was to take my seats to the custom auto trim shop to redo in leather. The front seats, back bench seat and back with new foam and welding a broken frame and the rear seat kick panel cost me $490. After seeing how nice that was I had him buy another hide for the side panels, luggage area. The leather made the other components look even more ratty so I did the plastic and the headliner, etc..

 

Ok, since you offered a suggestion on the way to go, can you help me figure out the logistics of this?

• How do I find a shop and verify they know what they are doing?
• What do I ask for?
• How do I locate the materials or do I have them find it for me? (I know Peter found hides somewhere)
• What material documentation is required?
• Can they finally get rid of my stupid designed headsets and make it one piece? And also build something for the missing headrests in the back?
• How about the side panels? Do I buy something from Airtex? 
• The original lower stuff I think is some sort of cardboard with cloth on it. How was this handled?
• What about the rugs? 
• Did you do anything with the glare shield?

I know this is taking advantage of our friendship, but could you post some detailed pictures of what things look like? I'm interested in the floors where the rug isn't covering, the lower side panels. 

[Bob_Belville]

Ok, since you offered a suggestion on the way to go, can you help me figure out the logistics of this?

• How do I find a shop and verify they know what they are doing?

I googled "auto trim shop wilmington de" and got this possibility:

http://newcastleupholsteryde.com/

From their gallery it is clear they would find our seats to be pretty trivial. 

This was not the only hit. Perhaps you know someone nearby who knows the market. I found my guy through a friend who owns a body shop. I asked him who did good trim work. I would think if you ask around...

• What do I ask for?

​Auto upholstery or auto trim shop. You will offer to bring them your seats when they are ready for them. Ask for a recommendation of foam. If you really think you'd like to change the top of the seat to eliminate the adjustable head rests get him to make a recommendation. Whether you could do that without the blessing of at least your A&P is above my pay grade.

• How do I locate the materials or do I have them find it for me? (I know Peter found hides somewhere)

The shop will have a source for leather. He will have samples you can check against your color scheme. He'll help you spend your money adding embroidery, welting, perforated inserts, etc.  

• What material documentation is required?

​Automotive materials have to meet a more strict standard than our planes. I sent the leather, carpet and the headliner materials to Skandia for flame spread certification. All were orders of magnitude better than the requirement.Mt log entry: Replaced interior fabrics (headliner, carpet, leather) with materials tested by Skandia Inc. under w/o # 249481 dated 12-10-2012 and certified 14 CFR Part 23.853 and 23-49 app F (e) and certified by FAA DER on 12-12-2012. Said documents attached. Work was performed by Dave's Trim and Robert Belville, owner. signed Lynn Mace AP 311#### IA

• Can they finally get rid of my stupid designed headsets and make it one piece? And also build something for the missing headrests in the back?

If you really think you'd like to change the top of the seat to eliminate the adjustable head rests get him to make a recommendation. Whether you could do that without the blessing of at least your A&P is above my pay grade. But I'm sure a custom trim shop can do whatever you want for a price. As I mentioned above, the aluminum frame of one of front seats had been broken. The prior owner was a big guy and when getting in and out it is tempting to put full weight on the seat back. The trim shop sent  the seat to a local welder who fixed the frame.   

• How about the side panels? Do I buy something from Airtex?

After installing my nice leather seats I decided to have Dave get another hide and do all the side panels including the baggage compartment walls in leather. It is possible Mooney changed the interior between my '66 an your '75(?).

• The original lower stuff I think is some sort of cardboard with cloth on it. How was this handled?

​Yeah, with some kind of padded rigid backer board with leather on it.   I took the parts to the trim shop and he used the old pieces for patterns to cut new backer boards with thin padding. The leather is attached using contact adhesive. In a few instances where the original piece was ratty the new one did not quite fit. Pealing back the leather, trimming the backer and re-wrapping the leather made adjusting very quick and easy. 

• What about the rugs? 

​The trim shop will have carpet samples to choose from. He will be able to do edge binding where called for. My guy backed the carpet with 1/4" foam with silver facing. I considered alternatives but went with industrial weight Velcro strips. I am happy with that solution, the carpets says in place even when back seat passengers put side stress on it getting in and out. The baggage carpet is edged all around but not padded. It fits snug and cannot go anywhere and is easy to remove to vacuum.

• Did you do anything with the glare shield?

I have fussed with it some. It is a 201 style thermoplastic. I have tried to reshape it with a heat gun with modest success. The most unfinished area of my plane is the trim fit to the retrofitted 201 windshield. 3 previous owners and myself have lived with trim that at one time fit nicely, I'm sure, to the original 2 piece, upright w/s.

 

I know this is taking advantage of our friendship, but could you post some detailed pictures of what things look like? I'm interested in the floors where the rug isn't covering, the lower side panels. 

Glad to help. I'll pull the plane out in the sunshine and make a set of pics on details. 

[Marauder]

Glad to help. I'll pull the plane out in the sunshine and make a set of pics on details. 

 

Bob! Can't thank you enough for writing this up!! I would love to see more detailed pictures of how it went together. I looked in your plane while you were here, but had a hard time getting past the panel. I would love to do all the planning for this work this summer and pull everything this winter to have it refurbished. With the cold weather, winter may be a tough time to do this but when my plane gets frozen in, it will give me something to look forward to.

[carusoam]

Peter's leather seats are....memorable!

I mean that in the highest complimentary way.

Best regards,

-a-

[ryoder]

You can also do like I did and just call Airtex and order the entire kit or in pieces. Airtex carpet is pretty nice and is easy to install.

I can't wait to see the seats but they take six to eight weeks to produce. I called a local aircraft interior shop and he was three months backed up and wanted much more than Airtex. He also said I should throw out the Airtex carpet because it is junk and won't last three months.

[carusoam]

I liked my Airtex carpet, even ten years later...(went in my second year of ownership)

I'm sure there are nicer wool ones that Chris should consider.

The higher price raw materials are easier to stomach when you know you have a tendency to buy and hold (for decades).

Best regards,

-a-

[Bob_Belville]

Chris, fwiw, my guy, Dave's Trim, does not have a website, he barely has a phone. He's a one man shop who's been doing this work for 30 years. His pit bull, Bella, is a fraud who barks loud but hides under the sewing table if you move in her direction. He does lots of '55 Chevys,  '40 Fords etc. I would recommend asking around if the bigger shops tell you it takes $1000 to recover your seats in leather with new foam. This is a low overhead business, a sewing machine, scissors, and not much else. It lends itself to guys like Dave.

 

If anyone has an older vehicle with a headliner that has come loose, guys like Dave can replace it better than new in half a day for maybe $150. I had my '98 Dakota and my '04 Crossfire done a few years ago. 

[Bob_Belville]

Chris, I took several pics and uploaded them to a new gallery album. I will go through and add labels when I get a chance.

http://mooneyspace.com/gallery/album/14102-interior-details-june-2015-work-done-1212/

[Marauder]

Chris, I took several pics and uploaded them to a new gallery album. I will go through and add labels when I get a chance.

http://mooneyspace.com/gallery/album/14102-interior-details-june-2015-work-done-1212/

Great, thank you! I will look through later today after the meetings are over.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[ryoder]

Pilots side panel went in quick now that I know what I am doing. Looks great and is more substantial.

[carusoam]

Snazzzzzy!

-a-

[ryoder]

Installed Airtex rear wall panels.

[Marauder]

Installed Airtex rear wall panels.

 

I'm impressed. Time for you to fly up to Marauder's and help me do mine!

[ryoder]

It's not rocket science. Just takes some time and basic hand tools. I've got front panels and wind lace left to install. The leather seat covers haven't shipped yet.

I am happy with the panel quality. They are corrugated plastic with padded carpet.

[Marauder]

It's not rocket science. Just takes some time and basic hand tools. I've got front panels and wind lace left to install. The leather seat covers haven't shipped yet.

I am happy with the panel quality. They are corrugated plastic with padded carpet.

 

Sounds like, being based in Florida, you need to fly to the mid-Atlantlc for a nice respite from that Florida heat. How about you tell me what to order and we spend a week doing my interior. You, me, a few beers? Heck! I can even have you do a "Cheap Bast$%d's Interior Remodel Clinic" and charge everyone 25 cents to attend. I am even willing to bet that "Stinky Pants" would show up for that! We can have Peter Garmin (muzzled for his "Garmin is the BEST!" comments) to talk about how to pick fine leather to do the seats. I have seen his interior, it is NICE!

 

I'm willing to bet there are a number of folks who would be interested in attending!

[Hank]

OR we could meet in the mid,e, with my C as the lucky patient! We could even let the dentist demonstrate hoe to put the leather onto the seats.

[Bob_Belville]

I see Marauder, you've found a prettier girl. I remember when I used to hear the sweet talk. 

[ryoder]

I don't get out much. If anyone wants to talk about these mods you can email me and I'll give you a call.

But really what you should do is go to Vantage Plane plastics and use their express part finder to show all the plastic they have for your Mooney. Then wait till there is a sale and order them. They have huge discounts at the air shows so get your list together and buy it there. I'd recommend the three panels I bought. Door panel and two side panels since people interact with those a lot. Next you'll need the full Airtex kit. It's pretty simple. You need floor carpet, wall panels, and leather seats. Also buy new wind lace. It takes eight weeks to get seats and four to get Airtex wall panels so order now. They also have discounts at air shows. Vantage will send your part almost every immediately so if you order Monday you'll have it by the weekend. The door panel comes off easy. It's just screwed into place and the door handle is safety wired in. You'll need a drill, a dremel with cutoff wheels, a pencil, measuring tools, and rasps. Also get some new stainless steel screws. I used industrial Velcro I picked up at Lowes for some of the assembly.

Both vantage and Airtex are great. Call them and talk to them some time.

Anyone who wants info can call me. If you think you can't do it you we wrong. This is time consuming but easy and rewarding.