Cylinders for IO 360 - A3B6D

[Mac201]

My J model is getting a field overhaul.  My plan was to replace the cylinders with new ECI Nickel Carbide (Cerminil), but I have discovered from ECI that they do not have the new cylinder certified for my angle valve engine.  It's experimental only until certification.  I am being told that my options are new Lycoming steel cylinders for $1,825 each (best price I have found) or ECI has overhauled ones with nickel carbide cores.  With overhaul, I do not know the life of the cylinder and I understand that repeated overhauls is not good.  Or I can have ECI overhaul my cylinders, but again I do not know the life of the cylinders.  I just purchased the plane in May.  I have recommendation that overhauling cylinders more that once is not a good idea.

 

If anyone has researched this these cylinders, I would appreciate any information. Thanks!

 

Leigh

[Rustler]

Leigh--

I had the same dilema as you this past summer when I did a Western Skyways overhaul. After lengthy discussions and study, I opted for new Lycomings. It came down to the fact that I flew often enough that the steel cylinders (non-chrome) would not be a problem rusting. If you envision long periods of engine inactivity, I'd consider the chromed cylinders. I was concerned about the very thing you are: how many hours on a rebuilt cylinder?

 

 

[Kwixdraw]

I have been thinking this one over pretty hard recently and one thing that I always get back to is,How do you know how much you will fly in a few years? I could see maybe having a medical issue where a person didn't fly for 6 months or a year. I guess if you had nitrided cylinders you could just pickle the engine until you got things sorted out.  Other than that I think I want to go with the new cylinders from Lycoming. Of course I really like the idea of that IO-390.

[Jeff_S]

I don't have a wealth of experience on this but I'll tell you the story I have so far. The prior owner had the ECi chrome cylinders on the J but was having trouble with oil consumption (no compression loss, just using a lot of oil) which he attributed to not flying it that much. So at annual last July he put on the Cerminil cylinders and broke them in (which only takes about 5 hours). I had an oil change done as part of the pre-buy in early January, and since then the plane has flown ~20 hours and each time I check the oil and get ready to add more, the mark stays solid at 6 quarts. So that result seems to have satisfied its objective.

[Mac201]

Thanks Jeff.  So do I understand that they used the overhauled cerminil cylinders?

BTW, are you going to the fly-in at PDK on Saturday?

[Jeff_S]

Yes, I assume they were overhauled because they came with yellow tags which are in the log books. The engine core is at 940 hours SMOH so I figure with the proper care I've got 1000 hours on this set-up, and as we get closer to TBO I'll be able to decide my next step.  The IO-390 has me drooling a bit, but I'm many years away from that decision (hopefully).

I will be at the PDK fly-in tomorrow although I may not "fly in" per se. I caught a bad head cold this week so unless it clears up considerably I won't want to risk my ears on the pressure changes. I may just taxi over and join the crowd...although I hate to start up an engine for such a short cycle so perhaps I'll just drive over to Atlantic and walk in. One way or the other, I'll be there.

[KSMooniac]

Overhauling the cylinders on our IO-360 engines does make economic sense, but I would only consider it if I knew how many hours were on them.  In my case, the first owner got a factory overhaul in 1991 with new cylinders, so I've got first-run jugs and thus would have no qualms about getting them overhauled at a good shop.  I don't think I'd run them for more than two TBO runs, though.  If you have unknown jugs and plan to keep the plane for a long time, then I would opt for new ones to re-baseline everything.

[Mac201]

Thanks for all of the information.  I had pretty much decided to go with OH nickel carbide cylinders from ECI.  I decided that if I needed a top OH during this TBO that I would have already saved $4,000 towards the top against the price of the Lycoming heads.  And I really like the research in terms of rust and wear that I've found on the nickel carbide.  However, my mechanic just called and he may have sourced some low time (about 900 hrs.) first run cylinders that we can send in for OH and Nickel carbide coating.  I am crossing my fingers that they check out!  We are watching our dimes until we get our second son out of college!