M20E aileron variations

[Immelman]

Does anyone know if the ailerons from a '70 or '71E would be compatible with a 1966E? My parts catalog doesn't cover the early 1970s. Alternatively, if someone does have a parts catalog for a 70-71E, could you let me know what the Mooney part numbers of the complete aileron assemblies are (L&R)?

Thanks!

[JaredDavis]

From out of date parts catalogs. Please double check my answers.

Rev June 1977 1969-1975 E models

230015-503 AILERON ASSY, LH     230013-504 AILERON ASSY, RH

The part numbers do not match the ones I see for a 66E.

Rev July 76 1965-67 M20E C & E model

230015-1 AIL~RON ASSYI L     230015-2 AILERON ASSYI R

It looks like they do match a 67 F model

230015-503 AILERON ASSYI L    230015-504 AILERON ASSY1 R

 

Regards, Jared

[Steve65E-NC]

I have a friend with an available  pair of Alirons from a 64C.  He says they were changed out when he added a New Brittian PC control.  Can anyone explain why that change out would have been necessary?  If interested post here and I will respond private.

[Immelman]

Thanks guys!! I may be out of luck, then, if the possible E ailerons came from a later year. It would be interesting to figure out what the differences in these parts is structurally. My late 1960s manual shows the same '503/504' part as the aileron used in the early F models.

Steven65E-NC: Please do send me a PM to get in contact with your friend witht he pair available... I really don't know why he would have had to change them, though. My E was originally eqiipped with a Brittian autopilot. I have not seen anything in the maint manual suggesting different parts were used w/ autopilot vs. w/o.

[N601RX]

Quote: Immelman

Thanks guys!! I may be out of luck, then, if the possible E ailerons came from a later year.

Steven65E-NC: Please do send me a PM to get in contact with your friend witht he pair available... I really don't know why he would have had to change them, though. My E was originally eqiipped with a Brittian autopilot. I have not seen anything in the maint manual suggesting different parts were used w/ autopilot vs. w/o.

[Hank]

I show the same part numbers:

• 
  
• 230015-503, Aileron Assembly, LH
  
• 230015-504, Aileron Assembly, RH
  

Taken from "Illustrated Parts Manual, M20C - M20E - M20F - M20G", Manual Part No. 205, copyrighted in 2006.

You may be good to go.

There is a Effective column which lists various serial numbers beginning with 1968 for various parts, but this column is blank for the ailerons.

[N601RX]

Here is the Quote from one of the regulars on the mapa list that I remembered seeing.

 

> PC on 63 C
>   You cannot install the Mooney PC on a 63 "C" unless you change to 
> the later '65 or late '64 ailerons. The '63 has ailerons which are 
> too heavy for all but a few autopilots ever made. When it was 
> decided to install PC as standard equipment Mooney designed a 
> aileron which had lower forces

[Hank]

So then 66 and 71 ailerons should be the same, right? Both are after the late 64 and later 65 ailerons.

[N601RX]

Yes 66 should be fine, but the ones mentioned earlier for sale from the 64 model are not going to work.

[Immelman]

OK so the earlier aileron is out.

I'd still like to figure out if the other pair I found (allegedly from a 70 or 71E) would work. My parts manual (which covers 65, 66, and 67 only -- recall I have a 66E) calls out the P/N as 230015-1 and 230015-2.

Hank: Does anything in your (much newer) manual cover 1966? Alternatively if you have it as a PDF file, perhaps I could take a peek?

[Steve65E-NC]

Immelman, I just sent you contact info in a MooneySpace PM

Steve

[Jerry 5TJ]

Quote: Immelman

OK so the earlier aileron is out.

I'd still like to figure out if the other pair I found (allegedly from a 70 or 71E) would work. My parts manual (which covers 65, 66, and 67 only -- recall I have a 66E) calls out the P/N as 230015-1 and 230015-2.

Hank: Does anything in your (much newer) manual cover 1966? Alternatively if you have it as a PDF file, perhaps I could take a peek?

[takair]

[takair]

Attached is a photo of a 64 or earlier non-PC aileron.

[Immelman]

I appreciate that photo takair, could be useful in setting up a comparison.

[Immelman]

(summary based on the above, cross-posted to mooney-tech mailing list:

Thanks for the comments fellows. Here is what I have learned about M20E ailerons. There are 3 versions. From what I can tell, none of them are of that newer 'corrugated' sheet metal on the outside you see on the M20J/K.

A. Pre-1965? - older 'rounded' style not compatible with PC system (higher control force required)

B. 1965-1967, used part number 230015-1 & -2 on the  C&E models. This is what I have and am looking for replacements for. Coincidentally, the F model from those years used 230015-503 & -504.

C. 1968-1976: the aileron part #s were changed to 230015-503 & -504 (matching the early F). My 1976 parts catalog says this aileron applied to all M20 C/E/F/G in those years, starting with airplanes that left the factory in Oct '67.

So the big question now for me: Suppose I can find a newer one from a circa 1970 airplane... What is the difference between 230015-1 & -2 and 230015 -503 & -504? Can the aileron off of a 1970 E be used on a 66?? I will speak with my IA about this later today as he is the guy who would have the final say, but I'm curious on what the differences physically are intellectually as well.