Help with Wx500 troubleshoot - burned by ebay lottery

[DXB]

A while back I played the ebay lottery, buying a "new" Wx500 processor without antenna, cables, or tray for 2amu.  My trusted and experienced avionics guy happened to have a new tray, harness, and antenna sitting around and was willing to put it in.  Apparently it ops checked ok in his hands, but I never saw it work after picking it up (I retrieved on a weekend in late March when the world was a little messed up, so I thought best to deal with it later).  Both displays (GTN650 and GI-275) always read "Stormscope inoperative or connection lost" - I've never seen any of the error messages that can be sent from the stormscope itself.  

I figured I'd simply lost the ebay lottery on the processor so I had nothing to complain about.  However my installer recently sent the processor out to a local shop for bench testing and was told it worked just fine (he didn't send to L3 - they supposedly charge $600 and take many months to get it back).  He then spent several hours on my plane last week trying to get it to work but only saw it come on line intermittently.  When flying home, I saw periods of a few seconds where it seemed to come on line but immediately went back to the error message above.  I think my avionics guy has now officially thrown up his hands. 

Any suggestions???  I'd like to plug someone else's working Wx500 processor into my tray briefly if they'd be willing to loan it to me for 15 minutes or so in exchange for a $100+ hamburger.  The swap is quick and idiotproof, and that would put the processor function question to rest at least. I'd be willing to get it fixed or shell out for another processor IF I could prove that was the problem and not the wiring. 

[JKeeth]

The first step in troubleshooting a WX-500 failure is to retrieve the fault codes from the WX-500 fault log, and that is accomplished through the display that is wired to be the master control for the WX-500. Hopefully the GTN650 is wired as the control, as the GTN does a good job of displaying the fault log for the WX-500. I don't have any experience with the GI275 and WX500 combination to say how well that interface works. 

The Stormscope data is accessed in the External Systems page in the GTN's configuration mode, and section 5.5.4.2 in the GTN installation manual has a good description of how to access the fault log and how to view additional data for the WX-500. 

If you can't view the Stormscope data then there is likely a serial communication problem between the WX-500 and the displays. It is very important that the RS-232 RX at the WX-500 is coming from one display only, which would be the master control display. 

FYI...L3 sold the Stormscope product line to Extant Aerospace last year. 

Hope this helps!

Jim

[DXB]

12 minutes ago, JKeeth said:

The first step in troubleshooting a WX-500 failure is to retrieve the fault codes from the WX-500 fault log, and that is accomplished through the display that is wired to be the master control for the WX-500. Hopefully the GTN650 is wired as the control, as the GTN does a good job of displaying the fault log for the WX-500. I don't have any experience with the GI275 and WX500 combination to say how well that interface works. 

The Stormscope data is accessed in the External Systems page in the GTN's configuration mode, and section 5.5.4.2 in the GTN installation manual has a good description of how to access the fault log and how to view additional data for the WX-500. 

If you can't view the Stormscope data then there is likely a serial communication problem between the WX-500 and the displays. It is very important that the RS-232 RX at the WX-500 is coming from one display only, which would be the master control display. 

FYI...L3 sold the Stormscope product line to Extant Aerospace last year. 

Hope this helps!

Jim

Yes - there's no way to retrieve the data because the displays can't even see the stormscope most of the time.  Agree it's likely a serial communication problem.  I'd just like to get my hands on a box that's known to work so I know whether the issue is on the side of the processor or the connector to the harness.

[JKeeth]

Can you send me a pic of the Stormscope Configuration Page from the 650? I’m curious to see if the data displayed on that page matches the actual configuration (strapping) of the unit. Also, what is the serial number of the WX-500 processor? I can look up the history on that unit and determine if it had been returned to L3 for a serial comm problem in the past. Feel free to email me at jim.keeth@L3Harris.com. 

[DXB]

2 hours ago, JKeeth said:

Can you send me a pic of the Stormscope Configuration Page from the 650? I’m curious to see if the data displayed on that page matches the actual configuration (strapping) of the unit. Also, what is the serial number of the WX-500 processor? I can look up the history on that unit and determine if it had been returned to L3 for a serial comm problem in the past. Feel free to email me at jim.keeth@L3Harris.com. 

Thanks so much Jim! I will definitely gather that info next I'm at the hangar and email you.

[carusoam]

Great details Jim!

Thanks for sharing them.

Go MS!

Best regards,

-a-

[Aerodon]

DXB,

Don't despair.  I believe there is an issue with the older WX500's connecting to a GTN650/750.  I think it has something to do with the GTN looking for the WX500 before the WX500 has gone through the self tests.  Try powering the WX500 first, see if there are any error messages on the LED's on the front of the unit.  Then power the GTN and see if you have any luck?

I too have a couple of these NOS WX500's they work fine on my test rig, but one failed with a GTN750.  I'm busy installing a GTN750 and plan to check it out later.

 

Don

 

 

[carusoam]

@DXB check the message from Aerodon above...

-a-

[Marauder]

A while back I played the ebay lottery, buying a "new" Wx500 processor without antenna, cables, or tray for 2amu.  My trusted and experienced avionics guy happened to have a new tray, harness, and antenna sitting around and was willing to put it in.  Apparently it ops checked ok in his hands, but I never saw it work after picking it up (I retrieved on a weekend in late March when the world was a little messed up, so I thought best to deal with it later).  Both displays (GTN650 and GI-275) always read "Stormscope inoperative or connection lost" - I've never seen any of the error messages that can be sent from the stormscope itself.  
I figured I'd simply lost the ebay lottery on the processor so I had nothing to complain about.  However my installer recently sent the processor out to a local shop for bench testing and was told it worked just fine (he didn't send to L3 - they supposedly charge $600 and take many months to get it back).  He then spent several hours on my plane last week trying to get it to work but only saw it come on line intermittently.  When flying home, I saw periods of a few seconds where it seemed to come on line but immediately went back to the error message above.  I think my avionics guy has now officially thrown up his hands. 
Any suggestions???  I'd like to plug someone else's working Wx500 processor into my tray briefly if they'd be willing to loan it to me for 15 minutes or so in exchange for a $100+ hamburger.  The swap is quick and idiotproof, and that would put the processor function question to rest at least. I'd be willing to get it fixed or shell out for another processor IF I could prove that was the problem and not the wiring. 

Dev - if you’re still using Ben, my plane will be out there around November 8th. Ben can swap your 500 over to see if it is box related.

I suspect that the issue is the communication. I have the Lynx act as the control head for the WX-500 and it can do the self tests to determine if it is working correctly. I have it connected to my Aspens and GTN 650 as well.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

[DXB]

Hi @JKeethand @Aerodon. Thanks again for your guidance with this issue.  Unit is S/N 97420.  I tried powering up the Wx500 first before the GTN650, and it made no difference. The lights on the back of the Wx-500 stay the same before and after powering the GTN650:

 

LED 1 - ON ("normal operation");  LED 7 - ON ("something has failed internal or external")  LED 8 - flashes once per sec (normal operation -test signal between processor and antenna).  Pics of all the configuration pages are also posted below. Is this consistent with the serial communication problem previously suggested? Any other ideas?

 

[JKeeth]

Thanks for the pics! This is very helpful!

Error code 16 is the reason the unit is failing, and a code 16 is caused by either a bad antenna (very rare) or a wiring problem in the antenna cable. Most likely there is a short or open in the antenna cable. A continuity check should be performed on each wire in the cable to ensure none of the wires are open or shorted. 

Processor s/n 97420 was manufactured in 2011 and has never been returned for repair.

Hope this helps!

Jim

[DXB]

1 hour ago, JKeeth said:

Thanks for the pics! This is very helpful!

Error code 16 is the reason the unit is failing, and a code 16 is caused by either a bad antenna (very rare) or a wiring problem in the antenna cable. Most likely there is a short or open in the antenna cable. A continuity check should be performed on each wire in the cable to ensure none of the wires are open or shorted. 

Processor s/n 97420 was manufactured in 2011 and has never been returned for repair.

Hope this helps!

Jim

Thanks very much Jim!  I'll run your guidance by my installer. Do you happen to know if the fault log clears out automatically with each startup?  It strikes me that I should have hit the refresh button.

[JKeeth]

35 minutes ago, DXB said:

Thanks very much Jim!  I'll run your guidance by my installer. Do you happen to know if the fault log clears out automatically with each startup?  It strikes me that I should have hit the refresh button.

The fault log cannot be cleared. The 20 most recent faults are shown in the fault log and cannot be erased. In your unit code 16 has occurred twenty times over the past approximate 1 hour (53 hours 16 minutes to 54 hours 24 minutes).

Kinda odd to see a 9 year old unit with only 54 hours of operation!

[DXB]

4 minutes ago, JKeeth said:

The fault log cannot be cleared. The 20 most recent faults are shown in the fault log and cannot be erased. In your unit code 16 has occurred twenty times over the past approximate 1 hour (53 hours 16 minutes to 54 hours 24 minutes).

Kinda odd to see a 9 year old unit with only 54 hours of operation!

Interesting - so the 54 hours of operation were all mine this year with the unit not working - so it was truly "new" when I bought it two years before I had installed last spring.

[philiplane]

The WX500 processor is accessed via a serial port, with a laptop. You can check all functions and the error logs. Plus, you use the laptop to calibrate the whole system. 

Not sure why the tech hasn't done this.

[JKeeth]

1 hour ago, philiplane said:

The WX500 processor is accessed via a serial port, with a laptop. You can check all functions and the error logs. Plus, you use the laptop to calibrate the whole system. 

Not sure why the tech hasn't done this.

That’s correct for the Skywatch TAS/TCAS system but not for Stormscope. The only way to interface with the WX-500 is through the controlling display. 

[philiplane]

10 hours ago, JKeeth said:

That’s correct for the Skywatch TAS/TCAS system but not for Stormscope. The only way to interface with the WX-500 is through the controlling display. 

My bad, I have SKy Watch on the brain from fixing four of them last week. I use a spare display & antenna that I have and plug in into the processor on the WX500

[Alan Fox]

I have a tagged antenna , if you need an antenna … 

[Lance Link]

Maybe check with Don Valentine?