The Transfer of STCs

[DaV8or]

The submarine Mooney thread got me to thinking about that plane and what should, or should not be done with it in perfect world. The airplane does have a lot of nice mods on it that would be minimally, or not damaged at all by the flood. Things like the wing tips and the 201 winshield. In a salvage scenario like this, can STCs be transfered to another plane or do you need to send your parts back to the original manufacturer for a blessing? Could the parts of this plane be broken up and sold to others? We already got the answer on the Aspen, it's trash no matter what. It seems this might be the case for what ever plane a used Aspen comes from.

[jetdriven]

Disturbing the used value of an 12K$ Aspen is zero, as disctated by the manufacturer.   Same thing with S-TEC autopilots.  

[N601RX]

The FAA sees a STC as intellectual property much as a patent.  That is the reason that you need a letter from the holder stating that you have permission to use it. Unfortunately some companies see that as easy money for doing very little work on their part.  Other companies such as Brittain Autopilot will give you the permission letter free once they have tested the parts to make sure they function correctly. They only charged me $200 to repair and test an autopilot that I wanted to put in my plane.  They said there was no charge for the STC and permission letter.

 

[Piloto]

An STC does not gives the holder an exclusivity right to be the only manufacturer of a mod or product. The STC only indicates that the product is in compliance with applicable FAA rules such as FAR 23. The holder of the STC would need to manufacture it's product under a PMA approval indicating the product is manufactured and tested per the STC approval. Parts from the submerged Mooney can be reused as long the installer can qualify them via an 8130 form. Do not be discourage of avionics components that has been submerged in water. Most electronic PCB assemblies are submerged and washed during the manufacturing process. It is likely that after being cleaned throughly with contact cleaner or similar solution they will work back again. A passing test by an avionics shop can issue an 8130 form.

Jose 

[Shadrach]

Quote: N601RX

The FAA sees a STC as intellectual property much as a patent.  That is the reason that you need a letter from the holder stating that you have permission to use it. Unfortunately some companies see that as easy money for doing very little work on their part.  Other companies such as Brittain Autopilot will give you the permission letter free once they have tested the parts to make sure they function correctly. They only charged me $200 to repair and test an autopilot that I wanted to put in my plane.  They said there was no charge for the STC and permission letter.

[Shadrach]

Quote: Piloto

An STC does not gives the holder an exclusivity right to be the only manufacturer of a mod or product. The STC only indicates that the product is in compliance with applicable FAA rules such as FAR 23. The holder of the STC would need to manufacture it's product under a PMA approval indicating the product is manufactured and tested per the STC approval. Parts from the submerged Mooney can be reused as long the installer can qualify them via an 8130 form. Do not be discourage of avionics components that has been submerged in water. Most electronic PCB assemblies are submerged and washed during the manufacturing process. It is likely that after being cleaned throughly with contact cleaner or similar solution they will work back again. A passing test by an avionics shop can issue an 8130 form.

Jose 

[danb35]

Quote: N601RX

The FAA sees a STC as intellectual property much as a patent.  That is the reason that you need a letter from the holder stating that you have permission to use it.

[Sabremech]

As a holder of an STC, it is not transferable to another aircraft unless "I" as the STC holder agree to it and issue the STC to the new S/N aircraft.  You need the STC paperwork, installation instructions, and ICA for installation on an aircraft. We're responsible for that part for the life of it or the aircraft and since the 337 is filled out for that specific aircraft it can not just be removed and installed on another aircraft by an A&P/IA sign off.

Most of us who hold an STC make it aircraft S/N specific because we are liable for the part from the moment it leaves our shop and is installed on an aircraft  to the time the aircraft is scrapped. I would probably allow the part to be installed on another aircraft, but only after it was sent to me for inspection and certification to original drawings, for a reduced price, and with the appropriate paperwork for installation and maint.

 It's all about the liability and who has it !!

 

[peter]

This post is a duplicate of a post I've made in the other thread about the submarine aircraft....

Aspen does not charge to use our STCs.  We do *not* have a policy preventing installation of used equipment under our STC.

We have previously provided permission letters to Aspen dealers to install used equipment.  A separate letter is needed because our blanket STC permission statement only covers new equipment installations.  No one has ever been charged to use an Aspen owned STC to install Aspen equipment.

The recertification process is the method by which it is determined if a used piece of equipment is serviceable/airworthy. The cost of recertifying equipment depends on whether there is anything wrong with it when it comes back in, and how many system components require recertification.   For example, inspection of the display assembly is under $400. Complete remanufacture is under $1000.  Inspection costs are creditable toward a subsequent remanufacture.

Unlike some of the legacy avionics identified in this discussion (that use hand soldered "through hole" electronic components) Aspen's electronics comprise of machine-placed surface-mount components.  This means there are no field-repairable electronics in the equipment. 

It's important to note that working on the Aspen displays requires special tools, knowledge, software and documentation.  As of today, there are no facilities outside of the Aspen factory that have made the investment needed to repair or recertify Aspen equipment.

There have been several statements made in the last day or two on Mooneyspace that incorrectly present Aspen's practices on this subject.  Rather than debate hypothetical situations with folks who have no intention of installing used Aspen equipment, I personally invite anyone who is having trouble with our organization on this issue to reach out to me, and I will help. 

With that, all I can say is it is a beautiful day here, so I am on my way out to enjoy it.

[jetdriven]

Thanks for clearing that up, Peter.   Go enjoy that 231.

[Ron McBride]

If I purchased brand Z electronics used, and there was an emergency AD note against these electronics, how would the manufacturer or the FAA notify me?

IN my humble opinion, the manufacturer should inspect and repair, at a reasonable cost these electronics, so that I may be able to purchase and have them installed according to the STC. If you can sue Cirrus for flying your plane into a building or VFR into IFR, what would many widows do with an electronics manufacturer?

Would you want to bye an electronic panel that has been submerged and not reinspected? I wouldn't.

Ron

[Shadrach]

Quote: N9154V

If I purchased brand Z electronics used, and there was an emergency AD note against these electronics, how would the manufacturer or the FAA notify me?

IN my humble opinion, the manufacturer should inspect and repair, at a reasonable cost these electronics, so that I may be able to purchase and have them installed according to the STC. If you can sue Cirrus for flying your plane into a building or VFR into IFR, what would many widows do with an electronics manufacturer?

Would you want to bye an electronic panel that has been submerged and not reinspected? I wouldn't.

Ron

[danb35]

Quote: N9154V

If you can sue Cirrus for flying your plane into a building or VFR into IFR, what would many widows do with an electronics manufacturer?

[fantom]

Quote: danb35

Anyone can sue for anything, but neither of those suits was successful.

[jetdriven]

Not so fast, Fantom.  Then large corporations can simply spend the smaller party into the ground,  and then  hit them with a multi-million dollar legal bill.

Its all about equal access to justice.

 

-edited-

[John Pleisse]

Quote: jetdriven

Not so fast, Fantom.  Then large corporations can simply spend the smaller party into the ground,  and then  hit them with a multi-million dollar legal bill.

Its all about equal access to justice.

 

-edited-