Pathfinder P2A autopilot - does it work without vacuum pressure?

[AlexLev]

My airplane has a very old Pathfinder P2A autopilot with a heading/nav mode. As far as I know, the turn coordinator drives it but I'm not sure if it somehow uses the engine driven vacuum pump too. I know the Mooney PC leveling system did, but not sure about the Pathfinder.

Does anyone know whether the Pathfinder will continue to work if engine driven vacuum pump fails? Would be a great help in a vacuum failure, obviously. Checked the flight supplement for it, but it didn't have any info.

[TTaylor]

The P2A is all electric from what I have seen.  No vacuum to the t&b on mine.  I have been trying to reach the repair shop to have mine checked but no luck in reaching them in the past six months.

[AlexLev]

6 minutes ago, TTaylor said:

The P2A is all electric from what I have seen.  No vacuum to the t&b on mine.  I have been trying to reach the repair shop to have mine checked but no luck in reaching them in the past six months.

What repair shop are you calling? I heard Autopilots Central may be able to help from a BeechTalk thread. Have you tried calling them?

[kerry]

I have a P2A in my plane.  It is electric.  No vacuum.  Michael Ritterbush is the only person that has the equipment to repair it.  He use to work for U.S. Avionix who designed and manufactured Pathfinder autopilots.   Michael repairs turn coordinators and now resides in Oregon.  Let me know if you want Michael's contact info. 

[AlexLev]

3 minutes ago, kerry said:

I have a P2A in my plane.  It is electric.  No vacuum.  Michael Ritterbush is the only person that has the equipment to repair it.  He use to work for U.S. Avionix who designed and manufactured Pathfinder autopilots.   Michael repairs turn coordinators and now resides in Oregon.  Let me know if you want Michael's contact info. 

Please! Can you PM it? If my Turn Coordinator is bouncy and a bit unstable in turbulence, but the autopilot works fine, would Michael be the person to overhaul it?

Edited July 17, 2017 by AlexLev

[kerry]

If it's your TC then Michael is the only person that has the parts to OH it.  If it's the heading bug on the DG because it drifts then you need it OH'd from any instrument repair shop.  Try flying with it in wing leveler mode by pushing the heading button in half way and see what happens.

[TTaylor]

I have been trying to reach Michael for about six months with no luck. Let me know if you make contact with him.

 

 

[carusoam]

The power of MS working!

Best regards,

-a-

[wcb]

I could use his contact info or any info on potential repair of a Pathfinder M3A for the 76 M20F.  Any help from the MS community would be awesome.  Several people have said just scrap it and go with a STEC.  For now I would rather save the $10,000 to $15,000 (or more) and only spend a few thousand on a repair (to many other things on my wish list).

[kerry]

If you can get ahold of Michael Ritterbush then it will probably cost less than a thousand to fix it.   I messaged you his email address.

[kerry]

On ‎9‎/‎15‎/‎2017 at 12:23 PM, wcb said:

I could use his contact info or any info on potential repair of a Pathfinder M3A for the 76 M20F.  Any help from the MS community would be awesome.  Several people have said just scrap it and go with a STEC.  For now I would rather save the $10,000 to $15,000 (or more) and only spend a few thousand on a repair (to many other things on my wish list).

If you do scrap it I would like to have it for parts.

[Michel02]

Hi ,  is someone have owner manual  or operation  manuel , just have 1975 mooney  m20f executive 21  ,and a pathfinder  p2a  on board but  instruction how to test       Thank    Michel  c-gmmm     canada

[AlexLev]

I can take a look, I may have a supplement guide, but I am not sure how helpful it will be. It would take me a few weeks to dig it up though - won't be in the hangar for a while with the holidays.

On a sidenote: I just got the astronaturics turn coordinator overhauled by Pacific Southwest Instruments. The good news is that the autopilot works better to hold heading, but the bad news is when I use the knobs on the TC to enter a standard rate turn, it seems to do a full deflection now vs the 8-10 degree bank it did before. Anyone have any ideas on how to troubleshoot?

Edited December 14, 2018 by AlexLev

[kerry]

I have the ground check and flight test procedures manual.  I know you can adjust the TC turn rate inside of the controller.  Inside my controller the pot adjusters are labelled.  I'll try to attach the manual tomorrow.

[AlexLev]

@kerry - where is the controller? What happens now if I turn the knob is the aileron just fully deflects and keeps turning (uh oh), rather than a small controlled bank. Before I overhauled the TC, I didn't have this problem.

[Michel02]

nice ,  willing to pay for the manuel  and  work.   thank     Michel

[TTaylor]

I placed the manual in a .zip folder in the Downloads/Avionics section.

[kerry]

7 hours ago, AlexLev said:

@kerry - where is the controller? What happens now if I turn the knob is the aileron just fully deflects and keeps turning (uh oh), rather than a small controlled bank. Before I overhauled the TC, I didn't have this problem.

The controller has 4 buttons on the front of it.  Pull on it.  Should slide out of tray.  On top of controller you'll see the pots that can adjust the gains on your autopilot.  The manual has lots of info on tests and trouble shooting.

[Michel02]

On ‎12‎/‎14‎/‎2018 at 6:29 PM, kerry said:

On ‎12‎/‎13‎/‎2018 at 10:38 PM, AlexLev said:

I can take a look, I may have a supplement guide, but I am not sure how helpful it will be. It would take me a few weeks to dig it up though - won't be in the hangar for a while with the holidays.

On a sidenote: I just got the astronaturics turn coordinator overhauled by Pacific Southwest Instruments. The good news is that the autopilot works better to hold heading, but the bad news is when I use the knobs on the TC to enter a standard rate turn, it seems to do a full deflection now vs the 8-10 degree bank it did before. Anyone have any ideas on how to troubleshoot?

The controller has 4 buttons on the front of it.  Pull on it.  Should slide out of tray.  On top of controller you'll see the pots that can adjust the gains on your autopilot.  The manual has lots of info on tests and trouble shooting.

   I have   turn  coqrd         part no  50-001  14   model 8 j    astronautios    corporation    look almos new  or rebuilt  from log book ,   plug  in said  jul 29  1975  so it look  like install  in the plane 1975   M20 F  executive  when built   ,   on the panel ,,,,, auto pilot  say    GPS or VOR   ,  how to  start the system   is my question  ,,  are the servo  work  elec or vac   , Thank      Michel  

On ‎12‎/‎14‎/‎2018 at 6:29 PM, kerry said:

The controller has 4 buttons on the front of it.  Pull on it.  Should slide out of tray.  On top of controller you'll see the pots that can adjust the gains on your autopilot.  The manual has lots of info on tests and trouble shooting.

 

[Michel02]

When the turn  coordinator is electric  whit a plug in to it  are the servo electric or vacuum  , mine is install in 1975  and plane is 1975 thank     Michel

[kerry]

The auto pilot is all electrical.  No vacuum.

[kerry]

There should be a button that says heading.  If that button is pushed in 1/2 way then the A/P works as a wing leveler.  When heading button is pushed in all the way then the A/P follows the heading bug on your DG.  If you push the VOR  or GPS buttons then it should follow those avionics if wired correctly.  The GPS is confusing to me because GPS is a digital signal.  Your autopilot is analog.  To work you would need some kind of converter.  Whenever you engage your A/P make sure heading bug on your DG  is set.

[Michel02]

thank     i will do  some test     happy new year         Michel   C-GMMM

[AlexLev]

13 hours ago, kerry said:

There should be a button that says heading.  If that button is pushed in 1/2 way then the A/P works as a wing leveler.  When heading button is pushed in all the way then the A/P follows the heading bug on your DG.  If you push the VOR  or GPS buttons then it should follow those avionics if wired correctly.  The GPS is confusing to me because GPS is a digital signal.  Your autopilot is analog.  To work you would need some kind of converter.  Whenever you engage your A/P make sure heading bug on your DG  is set.

I think the 430W has an analog signal output.

[Michel02]

last  question,   where are those servo  so many door  thank    Michel