Flat tire on landing

[kerry]

On ‎5‎/‎2‎/‎2017 at 0:30 PM, N6758N said:

That is true, the problem usually is when you are away from home without tools or airport friends around. However, given a floor jack and a strong steel pipe, you can jack any Mooney to change a single tire. So, if you carried a spare tube and tire with you and a few tools, you might be able to get away with doing it yourself.

You don't even need a floor jack.  It happened to me at airstrip in the middle of nowhere.  I carry a steel bar in the luggage compartment.  I put my back under the wing tip and used my legs to lift the plane up.  We found a rail road tie and my buddy place it under the bar when I lifted the plane.

[thinwing]

On 5/2/2017 at 0:30 PM, N6758N said:

That is true, the problem usually is when you are away from home without tools or airport friends around. However, given a floor jack and a strong steel pipe, you can jack any Mooney to change a single tire. So, if you carried a spare tube and tire with you and a few tools, you might be able to get away with doing it yourself.

A cheap Mooney guy in the know..would go oh crap....1 hop out of plane and if a simple flat temp fill with fixit flat.2 taxi to local EAA guys  ( this is quickest solution) if not any arround go to plan B...Take taxi to nearest auto parts and buy cheapest socket set (us)and cheapest floor jack.buy a lg 1 in socket extension.Also buy cheapest bike pump and taxi back to aircraft.3use the box the sockets came in to chock the good wheels if no airport chocks available.Insert 1 in exstension into gear leg and Jack up.Remove wheel with flat tube and split and replace.Inflate to 40 psi and replace wheel.Reuse old cotter for flight home.Total cost...cab fare 23 x2 ,assorted tools ( chinese manufacturer 31 floor jack 29 for grand total 106.This assumes you carry a spare tube but will get you going faster than waiting for the mechanic to sober up and come out to airport.You can even abandon heavy floor jack and be way ahead...

[Guest]

4 hours ago, thinwing said:

A cheap Mooney guy in the know..would go oh crap....1 hop out of plane and if a simple flat temp fill with fixit flat.2 taxi to local EAA guys  ( this is quickest solution) if not any arround go to plan B...Take taxi to nearest auto parts and buy cheapest socket set (us)and cheapest floor jack.buy a lg 1 in socket extension.Also buy cheapest bike pump and taxi back to aircraft.3use the box the sockets came in to chock the good wheels if no airport chocks available.Insert 1 in exstension into gear leg and Jack up.Remove wheel with flat tube and split and replace.Inflate to 40 psi and replace wheel.Reuse old cotter for flight home.Total cost...cab fare 23 x2 ,assorted tools ( chinese manufacturer 31 floor jack 29 for grand total 106.This assumes you carry a spare tube but will get you going faster than waiting for the mechanic to sober up and come out to airport.You can even abandon heavy floor jack and be way ahead...

And while the mechanic was sobering up, and the owner was out shopping, the airport used a front end loader and a chain to drag the wreck off the runway because their airport was closed and all of their other users wanted to use the airport.

Clarence

[lahso]

I feel fortunate - with a flat nose wheel away from home on a Saturday I offered $200 cash and the mech took it. Total time was about 2.5 hours.

[Hector]

Wow. Had a nose flat in south Florida couple of years back at busy GA airport just before taking the active for departure (KTMB). One of the big national FBOs came and towed my Mooney to their hangar to fix the flat. I thought it was going to be expensive and it was. Fair is fair so I didn't mind paying for the tow service. Their labor rate was very high but they charged me 2.5 which was not outrageous. Parts cost was a bit high as well. What really ticked me off was a $60 ramp fee, $25 security fee, and a several other shop fees I don't remember now totaling over $150.


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[MB65E]

Who is enforcing or even tells FBO's they need to charge all these fees? You go to a normal class D airport and use self serve, all of those same fees are not there. You are using the same federally funded "infrastructure" and "security". Personally, I would prefer line guys to leave me alone, don't touch my airplane. Point me to the self serve and show me where the hole in the fence is. It's a shame. I plan my flights on where the self serve is. The big three I feel are destroying GA. I've seen bulk pricing on their profits. The fuel (jet) is almost cheaper than water. Then every middle man gets paid along the way. 

-Matt

[cnoe]

Who is enforcing or even tells FBO's they need to charge all these fees? You go to a normal class D airport and use self serve, all of those same fees are not there. You are using the same federally funded "infrastructure" and "security". Personally, I would prefer line guys to leave me alone, don't touch my airplane. Point me to the self serve and show me where the hole in the fence is. It's a shame. I plan my flights on where the self serve is. The big three I feel are destroying GA. I've seen bulk pricing on their profits. The fuel (jet) is almost cheaper than water. Then every middle man gets paid along the way. 
-Matt

Just say NO to cheap tubes. A couple years ago after installing new Michelin tires and Desser house-brand tubes I had a main blow out on the taxiway at KAXH (Houston Southwest) on a Saturday. The stem ripped right out of the tube for no apparent reason (air pressure was checked only a day before).

A field mechanic scrounged around for a used tube in their hangar, drove over to the plane, and had me up and running in about 45 minutes. I taxied over to their shop and paid the owner. $50.

Later that week I put new Michelin Air-Stops on both sides and put safety wire back on the inner door myself. Jeez, for $50 you'd think they would have safety wired the door!




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[kerry]

1 hour ago, MB65E said:

Who is enforcing or even tells FBO's they need to charge all these fees? You go to a normal class D airport and use self serve, all of those same fees are not there. You are using the same federally funded "infrastructure" and "security". Personally, I would prefer line guys to leave me alone, don't touch my airplane. Point me to the self serve and show me where the hole in the fence is. It's a shame. I plan my flights on where the self serve is. The big three I feel are destroying GA. I've seen bulk pricing on their profits. The fuel (jet) is almost cheaper than water. Then every middle man gets paid along the way. 

-Matt

I feel the same way but my guess is if you don't pay the fee's then the FBO will place a lein on your plane.  If you never plan on selling your plane my guess is you could probably stiff most the fee's and they would have to take you to court.  If it's a government FBO they probably have tax payed legal team that will take legal action.  As I mentioned above it's just my guess.

[thinwing]

4 hours ago, M20Doc said:

And while the mechanic was sobering up, and the owner was out shopping, the airport used a front end loader and a chain to drag the wreck off the runway because their airport was closed and all of their other users wanted to use the airport.

Clarence

Ha ha..only at your airport Clarence...remind me to skip your hospitality!,

[HRM]

On 5/2/2017 at 0:45 PM, druidjaidan said:

Total was a bit north of $1000

Jeez-Lou-Eez!

I went down to the hangar last weekend to fly and when I went to top off the right main I heard a hissing from the stem. Yep, cracked (Michelin Airstop's no less!). I ordered a Desser tube with a 90º stem and it came yesterday. I am done with straight stems and have no interest in hubcaps. Anyway, I emailed a fellow Mooney owner in the hangar behind mine asking if I could borrow his jack and if he had any tips on tube replacement. Well, we met at the airport at 5:30ish and two and a half hours later, the tube was replaced. He basically did the whole thing and I 'helped'. I had no idea how complicated it is to replace the tube in a Mooney tire. I only spent $70 (tube+shipping) and owe him a steak dinner and some quality time flying The Mistress (I don't let just anyone fly her). 

[Wildhorsesracing]

My nose wheel went flat at a small airport recently and it cost 1/2 that much, so now I feel fortunate! But I usually go to out of the way airports and not the Class C or B because they are usually friendlier and eager to help you (vs. taking advantage of you).  

On the flip side, if your partner was traveling on a sunday, in a hurry to get home, and was possibly a less than friendly customer...

 

[Guest]

19 hours ago, thinwing said:

Ha ha..only at your airport Clarence...remind me to skip your hospitality!,

It wasn't here, but at a privately owned one nearby.  My buddy just landed gear up after an engine failure on takeoff ( he selected gear up too quickly) the airport owner wanted to drag the plane off the runway to reopen the airport.

If you're fortunate enough to break down here, the local MSC will look after you without a callout fee or over time charges.

Clarence

[thinwing]

That's good to know...last time we used a ft end skip loader was to hoist a 55 gal barrel of avgas to fill a Husky on amphibs

[tigers2007]

Anyone here ever use Fix-a-flat for an aircraft tire (referencing Thinwing's comment)?


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[RLCarter]

4 minutes ago, tigers2007 said:

Anyone here ever use Fix-a-flat for an aircraft tire (referencing Thinwing's comment)?


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Don't do it, Fix-A-Flat doesn't work well at all on tubes and is very corrosive not to mention it's a mess for who ever repairs it correctly later on

[tigers2007]

Would it be appropriate to use in the event of an "emergency" to temporarily seal a ruptured tube to taxi back to the ramp and immediately remove, clean, and replace? (Obviously would need some sort of air pump too).


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[cnoe]

Would it be appropriate to use in the event of an "emergency" to temporarily seal a ruptured tube to taxi back to the ramp and immediately remove, clean, and replace? (Obviously would need some sort of air pump too).


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It won't work at all on anything more than a puncture or slow leak. It's no help whatsoever on a torn stem or tube.

Also note that on planes with inner doors (J on up), if completely flat you cannot "tow" the plane at all without using a wheel dolly without seriously damaging the door. IIRC these are running about $800-$900 each new.


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[bonal]

22 minutes ago, cnoe said:

 

It won't work at all on anything more than a puncture or slow leak. It's no help whatsoever on a torn stem or tube.

Also note that on planes with inner doors (J on up), if completely flat you cannot "tow" the plane at all without using a wheel dolly without seriously damaging the door. IIRC these are running about $800-$900 each new.


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Yes no help on a tube tire. What I don't get is why we don't have tubeless wheels and tires available, or do we?

[EricJ]

2 hours ago, bonal said:

Yes no help on a tube tire. What I don't get is why we don't have tubeless wheels and tires available, or do we?

Tough to do with a split wheel.   You need the wheel to be reliably airtight to do that, which would then require a mounting apparatus (i.e., tire mounting machine) to get the tires on and off the wheel.   A tube is the price you pay for owner maintainability and field repairability.

[bonal]

26 minutes ago, EricJ said:

Tough to do with a split wheel.   You need the wheel to be reliably airtight to do that, which would then require a mounting apparatus (i.e., tire mounting machine) to get the tires on and off the wheel.   A tube is the price you pay for owner maintainability and field repairability.

Not a big deal I have tubeless tires on my racing kart and have both one piece and split rims. The split rims have a big O ring between the halves a far better approach than a tube IMHO. A very simple hand bead breaker tool is used in changing tires.

[Cyril Gibb]

4 hours ago, bonal said:

Not a big deal I have tubeless tires on my racing kart and have both one piece and split rims. The split rims have a big O ring between the halves a far better approach than a tube IMHO. A very simple hand bead breaker tool is used in changing tires.

Not to mention (not all, but certainly any new) cars, trucks, buses, motorcycles, trailers, lawn mowers, mountain bikes and even my wheelbarrows.  Maybe that's an opportunity to go the EAA avionics non-certified route but with tires and wheels.  Lighter, more reliable, less expensive.

edit: I spoke too soon maybe... I see Spruce has 600-6 tubeless tires.

[cliffy]

BTW, if you read any newer Mooney MM you'll see they require 5 gear retractions to verify that there is no tire/wheel well interference on every tire change. If you're at a shop that has to follow the MM (like a certified Repair Station, technically speaking we all have to follow it) they will probably insist on it.