Engine temps

[JoshK]

All valuable information. Thanks to all the Mooney experts!  I’ve not flown to 18K of above. So a cannula or boom is inadequate at higher altitudes, you have to use the mask?  Also is the O2D2 system worth it at $1200? Thats a lotta oxygen fills. Thanks everyone!

Cannula are not legal above 180
The mask is good til 250
A different masking required for 250-400


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[Pinecone]

It is not just the cost of the fills, but finding them and getting them done.

[JoshK]

It is not just the cost of the fills, but finding them and getting them done.

Would you mind posting a photo of your system in the hangar? Fills are indeed a PITA and I am in the midst of doing it myself.

I have a 4 stage cascade system spec’d but it’s on the costly side. A friend of mine who works in the compressed gasses industry helped me do it… I’m pretty sure you could fill the space space shuttle with the hardware he specified.


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[Steven B]

Got it. Thank you all!

[kortopates]

My Two large tanks are very adequate for my transfilling needs.
I don’t believe in adding a microprocessor and electrical dependency to O2 supply at altitude. At least not in a Turbo aircraft that flys in the flight levels - too much can go wrong. Instead we use the Precise Flight Demand conserver system which is purely mechanical and fail safe mode goes to full on which gives me peace of mind. Expensive though but my cargo is worth it
Works just like the electrical one but each person needs their own station which also adds redundancy as we’re two pilots.


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[exM20K]

I’ve flown 80 hours since my previous O2 service, mostly at 16,000 and 17,000 and mostly with two people on board.  I use O2D2 and boom cannula.  That is six months of flying, so if I get an O2 service at annual, I have only one more in the field before next annual. So the trans filling system isn’t worth it for me.

either of the demand conserved systems will give this sort of performance, and you will find them much more comfortable: a puff of O2 vs constant, drying, irritating flow.

@kortopates, I’ve never heard of an O2D2 failing, and I change the batteries every annual and have extras in my “purse.”  Regardless of which system you choose, having a backup is smart. Mountain High used to sell a 3 pack of small (8”) bottles with a mounted face mask. That is hat I have beside me. Failure of a fitting or connection is a much more real risk (ask me how I know).

I chose the O2D2 simply because it is much less expensive for a 2 person setup.  Money used to include the precise flight devices with new Acclaims, I believe.  They all work.

-dan

[Pinecone]

7 hours ago, JoshK said:

Would you mind posting a photo of your system in the hangar? Fills are indeed a PITA and I am in the midst of doing it myself.

Wrong person. I don't have a transfill setup

[Danb]

1 hour ago, exM20K said:

I’ve flown 80 hours since my previous O2 service, mostly at 16,000 and 17,000 and mostly with two people on board.  I use O2D2 and boom cannula.  That is six months of flying, so if I get an O2 service at annual, I have only one more in the field before next annual. So the trans filling system isn’t worth it for me.

either of the demand conserved systems will give this sort of performance, and you will find them much more comfortable: a puff of O2 vs constant, drying, irritating flow.

@kortopates, I’ve never heard of an O2D2 failing, and I change the batteries every annual and have extras in my “purse.”  Regardless of which system you choose, having a backup is smart. Mountain High used to sell a 3 pack of small (8”) bottles with a mounted face mask. That is hat I have beside me. Failure of a fitting or connection is a much more real risk (ask me how I know).

I chose the O2D2 simply because it is much less expensive for a 2 person setup.  Money used to include the precise flight devices with new Acclaims, I believe.  They all work.

-dan

I’ve got the precise flight set up in my Acclaim it appears the 77lb oxygen will last as long as  the 115 lb in the bravo. Took about an hour to get used to the on demand system I now don’t notice it. I agree the much less dryness with the pf system 

[kortopates]

[mention=7862]kortopates[/mention], I’ve never heard of an O2D2 failing, and I change the batteries every annual and have extras in my “purse.”  Regardless of which system you choose, having a backup is smart. Mountain High used to sell a 3 pack of small (8”) bottles with a mounted face mask. That is hat I have beside me. Failure of a fitting or connection is a much more real risk (ask me how I know).
I chose the O2D2 simply because it is much less expensive for a 2 person setup.  Money used to include the precise flight devices with new Acclaims, I believe.  They all work.
-dan

Probably since i am a flight instructor i hear a lot more confession’s. Such as the pilot in the flight levels whose 02D2 batteries died and found himself rushed to change the batteries at 24000’, but being nervous and starting to get hypoxic he ended up putting batteries in backwards. But it’s not working and his anxiety is growing so he’s asking for an immediate descent before it’s too late. Eventually he gets down to breathable air in the teens and realizes his mistake. My memory is a bit hazy on what happened next, but i am pretty sure it worked fine for him once he got the batteries in correctly and he continued on his way.
I know those that have it wired to ships power will feel immune to this issue. If i only flew in the upper teens I wouldn’t worry about it but i really don’t want the added complications flying in the flight levels.
Like you, I have the small MH backup cylinders with face mask - wish they still sold them. It was a great idea for a simple emergency backup.
I really like how i can hear and feel the unit giving me air since it’s reassuring that i know it’s working as intended.

It is pretty amazing how much O2 these devices save. My wife and I flew down to Panama central america over our winter break this past January all on one 115 cuft tank of O2 for the round trip. I can’t recall the last time i had to fill up away from home.


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[N201MKTurbo]

It seems like the O2D2 should have some warning when the batteries are low, so they can be changed before they quits. 
 

If I had one, I would keep a mask handy. It seems like changing the O2 connector would be easier than changing batteries, then you could change the batteries without the panic and get back on the O2D2.

I have the Precise Flight regulator and am very happy with it.

[Z W]

It would be very easy to keep a standard mask or cannula handy and if the O2D2 has any problems, just unplug its air tube and plug the standard cannula or mask into the outlet next to your elbow and put it on.  Not a big deal in the teens but I would want something like that at FL240 for sure.  And probably also a tube or two of Boost oxygen:

https://www.amazon.com/Boost-Oxygen-Supplemental-All-Natural-Respiratory/dp/B094DY136X/ref=sr_1_6?keywords=Boost%2BOxygen&qid=1693743175&sr=8-6&th=1

Next time I'm at the hangar I'll take some pics of the O2D2 and oxygen transfill setups.  There have been plenty of others posted here over the years but may as well add to the knowledge bank, and I'm pretty happy with how both turned out.

[exM20K]

11 hours ago, kortopates said:

Probably since i am a flight instructor i hear a lot more confession’s. Such as the pilot in the flight levels whose 02D2 batteries died and found himself rushed to change the batteries at 24000’, but being nervous and starting to get hypoxic he ended up putting batteries in backwards. But it’s not working and his anxiety is growing so he’s asking for an immediate descent before it’s too late. Eventually he gets down to breathable air in the teens and realizes his mistake. My memory is a bit hazy on what happened next, but i am pretty sure it worked fine for him once he got the batteries in correctly and he continued on his way.

Bad scene, and I can see how a helmet fire could quickly erupt. Unless there is a real safety of flight reason to do otherwise, I limit my flying to 18,000. Not only are masks uncomfortable, their use makes staying hydrated difficult, which really makes fatigue or lack of sharpness an issue on a long flight.

The O2D2 will warn of low battery with four hours remaining. 

-dan

[Fredrik Andersson]

I usually lean during climb so you have about 1350°F on the EGTs, which means about 22 gallon/h (otherwise it is up to 24-26) to make efficient burning. Cylinder temperatures is below 380° F. Then when you reach FL250 it is tricky to get them below 400° but that is goal. LOP gives the lowest cylinder temperature, but I usually have cylinder 3 going up in temperature during that operation even if it passed the peak position. Going richer reduce the temperature, but then no.5 cylinder reaches above 400°. The only way to maintain FL250 (to get over weather) was to use full cool flap and and reduce MP to 26 or less, then cyl 3 and 5 stay close to 380° and the other well below.

[hubcap]

2 hours ago, Fredrik Andersson said:

I usually lean during climb so you have about 1350°F on the EGTs, which means about 22 gallon/h (otherwise it is up to 24-26) to make efficient burning. Cylinder temperatures is below 380° F. Then when you reach FL250 it is tricky to get them below 400° but that is goal. LOP gives the lowest cylinder temperature, but I usually have cylinder 3 going up in temperature during that operation even if it passed the peak position. Going richer reduce the temperature, but then no.5 cylinder reaches above 400°. The only way to maintain FL250 (to get over weather) was to use full cool flap and and reduce MP to 26 or less, then cyl 3 and 5 stay close to 380° and the other well below.

I do not understand why you lean in the climb with a turbocharged engine. You are making sea level manifold pressure all the way to the flight levels. Leaning a turbo during the climb goes against my training and understanding of the turbo.

[Pinecone]

On 9/3/2023 at 6:45 AM, N201MKTurbo said:

It seems like the O2D2 should have some warning when the batteries are low, so they can be changed before they quits. 

It does.  Battery LED flashes once per second starting with the battery level is down to less than 8 hours battery life.

Then it flashes and sounds a tone each second.  And that starts about 2 hours battery life left.

Page 11 - https://www.mhoxygen.com/2016/wp-content/uploads/5MD20-0003-00Rev-1-MH-EDS-2G-User-Manual.pdf

 

[N201MKTurbo]

4 hours ago, Pinecone said:

It does.  Battery LED flashes once per second starting with the battery level is down to less than 8 hours battery life.

Then it flashes and sounds a tone each second.  And that starts about 2 hours battery life left.

Page 11 - https://www.mhoxygen.com/2016/wp-content/uploads/5MD20-0003-00Rev-1-MH-EDS-2G-User-Manual.pdf

 

Hard to ignore that.

[Pinecone]

One one think. 

There is an audio output to wire it into the audio panel.